Impact driver

[lurker]

I have just ordered a impact driver.
Are ordinary PZ bits ok with these?
I am prepared that they will not last for long but they are cheap enough.
I tend to loose them faster than I wear them out.

Daft question, mostly use PZ2. Is PZ1 larger or smaller?

 

[sunnybob]

1 is small, 2 is medium, 3 is large.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

PZ 1 is smaller.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_screw_drives

 

[Jake]

The impact ones are better. Bits don't IME wear out as fast with a ID as they don't slip so much, but they will snap or fragment quite often with cheapos. But if you can live with that, the cheap ones will work until they do break (or get lost).

 

[sammy.se]

Bits that work best have a thin part in the shank. If you google "PZ2 Impact bits" you'll see what I mean.
The idea is that the bit will snap before your drill gets damaged.

My personal recent experience is that: Milwaukee bits aren't very good; Wera bits are very good.

 

[Raymond UK]

I've bought a box of these about 3 years ago. Only snapped 2 so far with everyday use.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Milwaukee-49 ... _cAD5-uZoA

Wera ones are very good too. I also bought a set of Makita gold bits as most of my power tools are Makita but they snap very very quickly.

 

[RogerBoyle]

I got some of them 4 weeks ago ,, Box did not last a week ... Total crap... bought from Screwfix
Used to screw ply to temporary hoardings through pre drilled holes in the ply... Went back to cheap eurber ones and still on the same bit

 

[DBT85]

An impact driver is so nice after years of just using a drill driver. Louder of course but very nice.

 

[Eric The Viking]

Try Wera's diamond-coated bits.

I was introduced to them in the 1980s (when they were unusual), and would never use ordinary bits given the choice. They only really have benefit with Phillips and Pozi screws though: Torx- and hex-headed fastners really don't slip.

The diamond bits are not intended for impact drivers, but I find the trick with impact drivers is not to be too aggressive anyway (with Pozi-screws, that is), so they do last pretty well. I've never snapped a Wera bit, nor chewed it up, but they do wear out faster in an impact driver.

That said, I only use 10.8V (AKA "12V") tools, not 18V or more powerful, which are fine for driving up to #10 (5mm) without pilot holes. I don't really use bigger screws (that would be coach screws if needed). Too much torque will probably kill anything.

 

[TFrench]

What size impact have you bought Jim? I find my 10.8v bosch is fine with normal bits but the 18v makita shatters them very quickly. For 90% of DIY the 10v one is perfect - it's controllable enough to use as a screwdriver.

 

[lurker]

What size impact have you bought Jim? I find my 10.8v bosch is fine with normal bits but the 18v makita shatters them very quickly. For 90% of DIY the 10v one is perfect - it's controllable enough to use as a screwdriver.

I bought a bare one that uses same batteries as my Makita drill driver.
Amazon 44 quid delivered.
It’s 18v so I am needing the warnings about torque.
Ordered some proper bits from tool station will collect in the morning.

 

[Eric The Viking]

What size impact have you bought Jim? I find my 10.8v bosch is fine with normal bits but the 18v makita shatters them very quickly. For 90% of DIY the 10v one is perfect - it's controllable enough to use as a screwdriver.

Agree totally.

I don't possess any 18V tools, but Richard our roofer does. When we were doing roof work about 19 months ago, I naively gave him a few (new) diamond bits, as we had to re-use some self-tapping screws (don't ask), and he was having difficulty (and my spares were running out!).

I found them the following morning in the gutter, with pieces snapped off.

It's worth pointing out that my 10.8V impact driver was no slower than his, and worked for all bar the very biggest screws (which anyway had Pozi #3 heads). In softwood I don't really think the extra torque mattered much, if at all, as my failure rate (chewed screws or broken driver bits), was almost zero compared to regular breakages with the more powerful driver.

It is, of course, also possible to drive screws with a big hammer. No, not a hammer drill, just a hammer. I've done it a few times and I've seen site carpenters do it a lot in the past. That's not to say it is a good way to work either...

... I'm probably just getting old and grumpy.

E.

 

[Jake]

I think diamond coated bits are wasted on an impact driver. As noted they aren't as tough and shatter-proof as the proper bits (but they are not cheap enough that doesn't matter) and their advantage of reducing cam-out is pretty much redundant with an impact driver rather than a drill driver.

 

[lurker]

Had a go with my new toy this morning after collecting some De walt PZ3 bits.
I am most impressed, particularly with the lack of cam out.

I am dismantling a fence and putting the (20) panels into a different location on the same site. I think it will be perfect for re-installation, together with some self drilling screws that I picked up from Toolstation today.

However, as I half expected, it wasn't brilliant for removing the screws that currently hold the panels. It managed to budge maybe 30% of the screws. In some places the erector used 4 inch nails and my reciprocating saw with a metal blade went through those like a hot knife through butter.

Which leaves me with 30 or so screws to remove. These are 4 inch high tensile so I can't cut them. Also I don't want to damage the panels (decent quality) as I need them looking good in their new home.
Hopefully I think I have thought of a good idea: I have one of those impact wrenches that you smack with a hammer ( must be 20 years since I used it last)
So will give that a try tomorrow, even if it just budges the screw a bit, I think the Matika will do the rest.

 

[Sideways]

If all else fails, an angle grinder with a cut off disc will slice what you can't unscrew.

 

[lurker]

If all else fails, an angle grinder with a cut off disc will slice what you can't unscrew.

Yes that will be the fall back.

 

[Eric The Viking]

... I have one of those impact wrenches that you smack with a hammer ( must be 20 years since I used it last)
So will give that a try tomorrow, even if it just budges the screw a bit, I think the Matika will do the rest.

I too have one - takes me back to mucking about with small Italian and Japanese bikes as a teenager!

I have a funny feeling though, that a proper powered impact driver, like wot you have, has the same functionality - I mean it hammers into the screw as well as around. So, much as we probably all need the exercise right now...

This is the realm of retraining granny on raw omelettes, I know, but have you tried gently tightening the stubborn screws before attempting to loosen them. Obviously if the heads are chewed in that direction it's probably futile, but you may get a few more that way. Also sometimes a Phillips bit (possibly with the point ground off a little) works where a Pozi doesn't - because of the parallel sides, I guess.

Anything to avoid drilling/Dremelling the tops off - feel your pain on that one. I did, however get a cheap set of diamond burrs like these:
Diamond burrs on Amazon, which have been amazingly useful doing this sort of thing (you can use them like an end mill with care).

I also have these, but they're probably too small,

and a diamond cutting disc for my Proxxon similar to these, which will make short work of slicing through a hardened screw shank.

Hope you win!

 

[Jake]

I have a funny feeling though, that a proper powered impact driver, like wot you have, has the same functionality - I mean it hammers into the screw as well as around.

For the power tool impact drivers, the impacts are rotational shocks. It's not like a SDS/hammer drill with a percussive action.