Idwal stones - what can you guys tell me?

[bridger]

I would presume that what made the Arkansas stones so desirable to the English market 125 years ago was their consistency. Very little practical difference between translucent stones from different mines.

Probably the consistency of supply as well as quality. I get the feeling that a lot of UK stones were a bit of a cottage industry while the US got the extraction and shaping mechanised very quickly. Odd that Washita stones seem to outnumber the various other Arkansas stones by a considerable margin in the secondhand shops and ebay.

I imagine that's the ratio the quarry spits 'em out in.

BugBear

something like that. I remember when I was a kid washita was a cheaper, utility grade tradesman's stone. I used a washita stone as my only stone for a number of years, borrowing time on a bench grinder when I needed to do any heavy shaping work. I still have the broken pieces of that stone somewhere.

 

[D_W]

I just went back to the 1891 bartlett's catalog. Depending on the size of the stone, assorted stones (they are sold by the pound in that catalog) are twice as expensive for hard arkansas vs. washita for large stones, up to four times or so as expensive for slips. I guess it's probably trouble to process hard arks into slips since they are fragile, but who knows.

Hindostans are about half the price of the washita by the pound (I've used two hindostans and found them pretty much useless - you could use them if you had to, but they leave an unrefined edge and cut slowly at the same time. That reminds me, I have a coarse hindostan that is headed for the garbage can, I can't even get someone to pay $10 for it - it looked like a coticule in an ebay auction and I took a chance on it).

The catalog is old enough that there is no synthetic stone material sold in it. In the 1920s, it would've been full of carborundum corp silicon carbide stones stones, as well as some india stones.

The only razor hone in the bartlett catalog (which is gigantic, like 1500 pages, maybe more than that) is a 1 1/2 x 6 coticule.

I know I've seen another listing where 2x6 bench stones were sold and the trans ark was twice the cost of a washita, and a soft arkansas (sold and advertised as a low-cost alternative to the washita) was half again as much as the washita.

 

[essexalan]

Not sure that all of these LI stones actually come from LI they did extract Novaculite hones from Llyn Melynllyn but I do not know what Salmen were digging out. Most of the stones sold in those red or yellow boxes are slate and the Yellow Lake moniker is just a trade name

You might not know but Mellynllyn means Yellow lake in English

I did know that but thanks for the heads up.

Hazeon 1893 lists Arkansas at between 6 and 7 shillings per pound and Washitas, American cut, at one and tuppence per pound. Grecian, Charnley and Welsh stone are all 56 shiilings per cwt so about the same price as Arkansas. Hazeon imported the Arkansas and Washita in chunks and cut them to size as well as selling American cut stones.

 

[bugbear]

Hazeon 1893 lists Arkansas at between 6 and 7 shillings per pound and Washitas, American cut, at one and tuppence per pound. Grecian, Charnley and Welsh stone are all 56 shiilings per cwt so about the same price as Arkansas. Hazeon imported the Arkansas and Washita in chunks and cut them to size as well as selling American cut stones.

That's interesting - I'd heard of Turkey stones, but not Greek.

Given the price, can we assume that the "Welsh Stone" isn't a slate?

BugBear

 

[essexalan]

Hazeon 1893 lists Arkansas at between 6 and 7 shillings per pound and Washitas, American cut, at one and tuppence per pound. Grecian, Charnley and Welsh stone are all 56 shiilings per cwt so about the same price as Arkansas. Hazeon imported the Arkansas and Washita in chunks and cut them to size as well as selling American cut stones.

That's interesting - I'd heard of Turkey stones, but not Greek.

Given the price, can we assume that the "Welsh Stone" isn't a slate?

BugBear

Grecian stones are LI not Greek. Hazeon also sold a lot of other stones including Turkey or Cretan. Not sure what Welsh Stone refers to but I doubt it was slate at that price, LM and Cutlers Green spring to mind. I only have page 4 & 5 from the TATHS publication. Apparently Hazeon's cutting gear was used largely unchanged from the mid 1800's until 1980 or so, the machinery is in the Science Museum which must be worth a look if it is on display. Not sure what the UK was importing from the US at that time but blocks of highly sale able Arkansas and Washita would have made excellent ballast.