How to free jammed mortise lock

[The Bear]

This week is obviously the week for everything to break in my house. So far I've had a broken oven (thanks for the help in fixing that), blocked drain, broken macerator, a few minor things and now a jammed lock. I've only been here 3 months.

The wooden side door to the garage has a mortise lock. The handle moves the latchbolt (is that the correct term) freely but the key operated dead lock is jammed. I can move the key about a sixth of a turn then it is rock solid. I can get inside the garage (through the up and over door) and it is the same when operating from the inside.

I have a feeling something inside the lock has moved/broken. I think this because about 2 months ago I had a similar problem but on that occasion the door was open, so I was able to take the handles off and slide the lock out of the edge of the door. I took it apart and fixed it. Problem this time is its jammed in the closed and locked position so I cant get to any part of the lock.

Any suggestion of what I can do without damaging the frame? Or do I need a locksmith, or is there even anything a locksmith can do?

Clearly I will be fitting a new lock if I get it out this time and not fixing it again.

Thanks

Mark

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Get a thin cutting disc for an angle grinder and cut the bolt between the door and the frame - if you're careful you won't even touch the frame or the door. Two minute job.

 

[The Bear]

Any idea how thin the thinest are Phil. The fit is very snug and can't see me doing it without causing some damage. How hard is the metal likely to be, possibly thinking hacksaw blade as an alternative

Mark

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I've used 1.6mm - 1/16". You might get thinner, but there aren't many doors that don't have a larger gap than that - they wouldn't open or close. The bolt possibly has a roller in it which precludes the use of a hacksaw.

 

[petermillard]

Metal cutting blade in a multitool works well, if a little slower than a grinder.

Hth Pete

 

[powertools]

Grind or file the tops of the hinge pins and tap the pins out with a nail and then take off the door from the hinge side when you have repaired the lock replace the pins with the non cut off ends uppermost.

 

[The Bear]

Several good ideas guys thanks. I don't have a multitool (assuming you mean Dremel-like, Pete) so can't do that. I'll take a look for the thin grinder blades. I'll also take a look at the hinges tomorrow, that method never crossed my mind powertools.

Thanks

Mark

 

[RogerP]

This sort of multi-tool would do the job without damage to the door...

 

[blackrodd]

Grind or file the tops of the hinge pins and tap the pins out with a nail and then take off the door from the hinge side when you have repaired the lock replace the pins with the non cut off ends uppermost.

+1 as above, very good idea, no damage, Simples.
Rodders

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Assuming you can get the pins out. The lock is knackered - why make work? Two minutes and it's cut.

 

[The Bear]

Don't have ones of those either Roger though a Fein multimaster is on the wish list

Mark

 

[The Bear]

Another Q, this time in relation to the replacement lock I'm going to need. I'd like to buy the new one in advance of getting the old one out so I can fit it straight away and not have compromised security. Yes I can screw the door shut but would like to slot the new one straight in.

But do all these locks have the same geometry? IE will the key holes, door handle holes be the same, or do I need to be careful what I buy. Obviously I'd like to drop the new one in and all line up rather than cut new holes. Are they all the same?

Mark

 

[blackrodd]

Silly question first, Is the key you are using, the right one for that lock?
I take it you have tried the key at different depths, in the lock. (I've been caught out before)!
Get The right backset (door edge to handle spindle/key centre) and having just changed 7 locks, for replacement chubb-type with older mortice locks, the newer ones I found to be just a little tighter in the mortice, which needed easing, the screw holes were different and the lock boxes needed lowering 3mm.
But no real problems HTH Regards Rodders

 

[The Bear]

Haha yes the right key, my wife made me check that! Yes Also tried different depths and slight angles. Because it got jammed in the open position a few months ago I'm pretty certain the bit that slipped inside the lock has slipped again. I won't be opening it and repairing at again though even if I did get it out without damaging it, too much hassle for it to happen a third time!

Looking online they seem to be 22mm wide, and vary in height so I guess I'm going to have to get the old one out first.

Mark

 

[blackrodd]

Haha yes the right key, my wife made me check that! Yes Also tried different depths and slight angles. Because it got jammed in the open position a few months ago I'm pretty certain the bit that slipped inside the lock has slipped again. I won't be opening it and repairing at again though even if I did get it out without damaging it, too much hassle for it to happen a third time!

Looking online they seem to be 22mm wide, and vary in height so I guess I'm going to have to get the old one out first.

Mark

AHH! sorry to hear that.
As you say get the old lock out first, and try and replace like for like may be a good idea.
I believe Union have lost the manufacturing and sales rights under the Chubb banner, so I'm not sure on that front.
If you don't know, Can I advise you not to buy a lock with any other than brass catch and lock tongue?
In a rush I bought a lock with aluminium bits mentioned, it marked easily and formed a groove,so the catch just jammed, just as if it were angle ground within about 6 months!
Regards Rodders

 

[The Bear]

I'll bear that in mind, thanks

Mark

 

[petermillard]

Hi. Yes, I meant a Fein-type multitool, not a dremel. Sounds like you have a sash lock - combined lever handle and mortice lock?? The lock body should be a standard size, assuming it's a UK lock; standard lock depths are 2 1/2" / 63mm or 3" / 75mm - you can check from outside by measuring the backset i.e. the distance between the door edge and the keyhole centre:-

HTH Pete

 

[bugbear]

I successfully repaired a mortise lock that was jamming "sometimes" ) with help, so I wouldn't write it
off yet.

are-mortise-locks-5-lever-a-standard-size-t76566.html

(many thank again to Bern)

BugBear

 

[flying haggis]

1mm thick cutting discs from toolstation

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Power+T ... isc/p95605

 

[DrPhill]

Pedant alert

assuming it's a UK lock; standard lock depths are 2 1/2" / 63mm or 3" / 65mm -

3" / 75mm ?

An interesting topic. Tell us how it all turns out.