how old are you and how many hours do you work

[RogerBoyle]

I was Self Employed untill 2007 doing Mainly Cabinet making and site work
The hours i was working were pretty much the same as the hours that you are
In the spring of 2007 My Nearest and Dearest asked me if i could spend more time at home being an active member or the family lol by getting a 9 to 5 job.
(She knew I wouldn't cut back on the hours I was working )
Of course I fobbed her off saying yes I'd keep my eyes open etc but carried on working

Eventually In May she saw an add for a Kitchen fitter and persuaded me to apply, at the time I was better at making them rather than fitting them LOL anyway long story shortened
I asked for silly money and Perks they agreed I ended up trying it on a trial basis for 3 months but contracts were agreed and signed end of the first week..
For the last 4 years I have spent so much more time with my family that i could never go back to that way of working

Unfortunately I was made redundant in April this year so it is back to being self employed
Its a struggle as i am again starting from Scratch but even so I still would balance my working life and family life so much better than i did in the past..

In your position I would probably find somebody that you trust and sub out some of the work rather than take anyone else on ( H&S :twisted: etc)

Oh and I'm 48 with 3 kids and 2 grand kids ( I was an early starter LOL)

Roger

 

[tomatwark]

Andy

I hope you manage to sort this out, as I said my hand has been somewhat forced, although in a good way, as if I was employed I would not be in a position to be able to change my working hours to suit looking after my daughter, the other thing I am doing is moving the computer back home so I can do alot of the paper work there.

It nearly 7.30 and I am still at my desk here having a cuppa before I tackle my final task of the day.

I will say that I have made these decisions before and then slipped back into my old ways and gradually increased my hours again.

I now have a reason that I can't do this and we have already said that even if the child minder can eventually take my daughter on a Monday we will try to stick with the new arrangment.

I am still allowed to do a couple of late nights a week if I have too and paper work on a Sunday morning if need be.

Basicly SWMBO has spoken and these are the new rules, maybe you should insist your wife is allowed to nag you on this and you have to do what she tells you, as long as she understands the house may take a bit longer. ( That's what my wife and I agreed anyway)

At the end of the day as others have said your family is more important than making lots of money.



Tom

 

[houtslager]

Hi Andy, I post my tuppence worth now that some of the other lads have. In '96 I was like you , workiing all of God's hours. :?
I had then , 1 bag of tools, and a suitcase of clothing [ actually, my old Army holdall ]
the next 10 years I work my arse off often doing 15 hrs a day until each project was finished then another project came in and it started again. Now I have a house full of tools and machines which need to be re-housed.
Since' 06, I realised we here to live a life not live to work, in fact I was turning into a younger version of my Dad. Uh uh, then I upped sticks to East Friesland, where life is turned back to the 70's in speed, which has saved my life and relationship. Okay the downside is now I no longer have a 30+ turnover, plus side is I can switch off, grab a coffee roll a *** and sit in the garden and watch the swallows duck and dive.
Though in a month I will be seriously looking for more subbie work as I need to finish my workshop build before Christmas.
SO if I was wearing your boots I'd SERIOUSLY look at my life / work balance and see where I could improve it.
As someone else said - find a GOOD SUB CONTRACTOR, sub SOME of the work out, and spend some more time with your family BEFORE they forget your Name.

hth,

Karl

 

[Tusses]

Well, I'm just about to put another coat of paint on the bookcase I am making today, before I close up for the night.

I have 9 more bookcases to make next week, and a few other things aside.

Today the steel cladding arrived for my new workshed build, which will have to wait a bit :? not enough hours at the moment !

 

[chrs_666]

I have done those hours for a 18 month strech made cracking money but ended up very ill very stressed had no time for my family or daughter never again no amount of money is worth it forty, fifty sixty hours hours a week at a push when very buisy for short periods only. I was given the same advice that i have just given when i was on a money racket i didnt listen i had to have three months off work due to stress and fatigue . slow down and get some help.

 

[petermillard]

I've been self-employed all my working life, and without question I've also done my fair share of hard graft - pulling all-nighters, 20-hour days, seven-day weeks, no holidays, all that - but not since I was in my twenties. You're not old at forty, but you're not in your twenties either - as you're finding out. Falling asleep in the van whilst waiting to pick up your kids from school is ('scuse the pun) a wake-up call - carry on like this and one day you won't wake up at all.

Why do you do it? What do you want? Is it just the money? Is it just the fear that you don't know when the bubble will burst for the current product you make? Every self-employed individual has these same concerns, but you have to sort out the 'work/life' balance a bit.

I'm now 51 with two teenage kids; I've been self-employed for thirty years, and my idea of a hard working day is starting at eight and finishing at six. This last week I've had a really nice job where I haven't started until 9.00 and have finished around three each day; I don't charge any less for that.

Sounds to me like you're making widgets (or whatever) at around an hour apiece, and each one yields £30-odd in profit. So why not charge more and make fewer of them? Or charge the same and make less. Or sub out some of the workload - or all of it. It isn't rocket-science; there's only so many hours in the day, and only one of you. Something's got to give - if it's going to be you, then at least make it voluntary.

Good luck, Pete.

 

[gregmcateer]

Hi Andy,

Reading through all the posts, I've got to agree with the general sentiment - Give yourself some timeout.

I used to run a busy firm - left at 7 and never got back home before 7 (and usually 8 or 9). Although you work at home, the Missus and kids coming to the door ain't the same as being 'present' - We all know how to half listen - and they know it too!

My work was different from yours, but since selling up I have managed to take the kids to school and collect them at least twice a week - I tell you what, its the best thing ever. If you can, walk them there and back - it beats the crap out of sitting in the car/van with your mind on traffic and work - I made a real conscious effort to walk along and talk AND LISTEN to them - not about any of my crap - just their stuff - whatever they want to talk about and however trivial or annoying it seems. Just having Dad there, investing his time in them pays dividends, honestly.

As you toil away, your time IS being used to provide for them and it is important to feed the mouths and save for retirement, so if you are working long and late on stuff you feel has to be done, think about the good stuff and about who you are providing for - and the day should go by quicker.

I once heard a guy at a seminar and he said you can either work you arse off all your life and pay for someone to look after you when you are old, or you can work smart and invest in your friends and family, who will look after you - I know which one I'd prefer, (and I used to run a domiciliary care company!).

Keep chipper, buddy and align your work and play with your true values, otherwise you will always feel in conflict. (Wow, that was a bit heavy!)

On a lighter note - At the very least, remember that your kids choose your nursing home!

Cheers,

Greg

 

[DOOGYREV]

Hi Andy,

I am your age and also self-employed, so it is very difficult to pin down exactly how many hours a week I work, as far as my brain is concerned I think, I am thinking about jobs and how best to do them all the time, often I wake up in the morning and think I should add another couple of hundred pounds to the estimate I did the previous night, or how to do something differently.

A couple of years before the recession I was doing around 40-50 hours a week in the workshop and 10-20 hours measuring up and talking to the customers, designing, drawing, doing estimates, cutting lists and paperwork, and I paid a boy who came in on Saturday mornings, just to sweep up, tidy etc…
This was Ideal for me (Oh Happy Days!) I found this to be a good balance between work rest and play.

Just before the recession I was doing about 50-60 hours a week in the workshop and 20-30 hours a week out of the workshop, I also had the opportunity to take on an apprentice (who I knew was a good worker, just lacking in skills and experience) He even worked for me for a week as a trial, to see if he wanted to do it, and if I thought he could be any good. Then the work just stopped coming in, I wasn’t getting any appointments, and got no reply from the sent estimates. It got to the stage where I had to send letters to some of my longest held regular customers, explaining the situation I was in and asking if they needed anything doing, well some did and kept me going. (I Guess all those bottles of wine at Christmas, were worth it)

Since then things were really slow, and in order to get the few jobs coming in, I had to price really low to make sure I got them, with little or no profit, and more hours, just to pay the bills.

Right now it would be easier to say it the other way around I make sure that I play one round of golf, a week (4 hours) and sleep about 6 hours a night if I am lucky, pretty much the rest of the time is spent working in one way or another, or being distracted here!

It is a means to an end though, now the work is coming in again, I can afford to price the jobs higher, and pay off the credit cards and overdraughts that kept me going over the last couple of years, once that is done I can afford to be more selective again and price the jobs accordingly.

My philosophy is Work Hard - Play Hard. Generally (work permitting) I might do 2 or 3 weeks solid but then go away for a long weekend or just take a day off willy-nilly.
If this is a cash cow and it’s just temporary to do up your house, then carry on sounds good to me, but from what you have said I fear that you have become a workaholic!

It's a lot of hours I know but I have always done the same throughout my working life, I was taught if you want something you have to work for it and work hard. Days off have always been few and far between but thats just what I'm used to. Andy

So what is it that you want? That your working so hard for?

I think that you probably have already achieved what you wanted, but have been caught in a vicious circle where you have been ‘institutionalised’ it reminds me of a film, I can’t remember the title (wall street??) but the main character had a goal of making $1000000.00 then would quit the city and use the money to live a simple life with no work, but when he got to $1000000.00 he said he would quit when he got to $2000000.00 etc.. etc… finally his goal became whoever has the most money when they die wins.

For me I used to have a nice balance of the ‘bread and butter work’ no thinking knock out 10 cabinets a week, would pay the bills, and some more thought inspiring Jobs which I really enjoyed.

Variety is the spice of life, with regards to mailee he is a machine (correct me if I am wrong) but I think one of the reasons he can do what he does is because each job is different (although there all gates) and I think he must get profound satisfaction (as I do), standing back and looking at what he has managed to create this evening from just a pile of wood this morning.

Personally I believe that working hard makes you live longer as long as you are enjoying what it is you are doing, my one eyed turner worked right up until the day he died aged 93 and I wished my Granddad a happy 94th Birthday on Tuesday and he still cycles 3 miles to work and 3 miles back every day.

Your certainly not on your own, if you can see light at the end of the tunnel then just push through and get there, for my no brainer monotonous jobs I like to set a time goal so I work harder and not longer so if it took me 10 hours to glue up 15 frames I would try and do it in 9 hours.

My worst enemy is finding excuses to put off stuff I don’t like doing, like writing all this instead of doing 2 estimates (that I could have finished by now)

There have been a lot of comments that have made me think about a lot of stuff, I hope that mine helps you in some way.

I believe in a nutshell you should be doing what makes you happy, rather then struggeling to achieve happiness!

Good luck

 

[Steve Blackdog]

Andy

I've been in a similar place to you. I'm not saying go all religious, but I found a great deal of help going to Quaker meetings. I'm not religious. You sit there for an hour in silence. It is like being dipped in water. For me it was about taking time out from the hectic world around me.

There's also a great book called something like "where ever you go, there you are". It's about Buddhist meditation. Again, it can be a great help to find five minutes every now and again to clear yourself out.

You might find that you opt for a simplified life. You might find it easier to enjoy the one you've got.

All the best.

Steve (old hippy!!!)

 

[DOOGYREV]

A young lady confidently walked around the room explaining stress management to an audience; with a raised glass of water, and everyone thought they knew that she was going to ask the ultimate question, 'half empty or half full?'.... But, she fooled them all... "How heavy is this glass of water?", she inquired with a smile.

Answers called out ranged from 8 oz. to 20 oz.

She replied, "The absolute weight doesn't matter. It depends on how long I hold it.
If I hold it for a minute, that's not a problem.
If I hold it for an hour, I'll have an ache in my right arm.
If I hold it for a day, you'll have to call an ambulance.
In each case it's the same weight, but the longer I hold it, the heavier it becomes." She continued, "and that's the way it is with stress. If we carry our burdens all the time, sooner or later, as the burden becomes increasingly heavy, we won't be able to carry on."

"As with the glass of water, you have to put it down for a while and rest before picking it up again. When we're refreshed, we can carry on with the burden - holding stress longer and better each time we practice. So, as early in the evening as you can, put all your burdens down. Don't carry them through the evening and into the night ... drop them and pick them up tomorrow.

Whatever burdens you're carrying now, let them down for a while. Relax, pick them up later after you're rested. Life is short.. Enjoy it and the now 'supposed' stress that you've conquered!"

1 - Accept the fact that some days you're the pigeon, and some days you're the statue!

2 - Always keep your words soft and sweet, just in case you have to eat them..

3 - Drive carefully... It's not only cars that can be recalled by their Maker...

4 - If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague

5 - If you lend someone $20 and never see that person again, it was probably worth it.

6 - Never put both feet in your mouth at the same time, because then you won't have a leg to stand on.

7 - Nobody cares if you can't dance well. Just get up and dance.

8 - Birthdays are good for you. The more you have, the longer you live.

9 - You may be only one person in the world, but you may also be the world to one person.

10 - A truly happy person is one who can enjoy the scenery on a detour.

11 - Have an awesome day and know that someone has thought about you today.

12 - It was me, your friend!

 

[mailee]

I have only just noticed this thread and read it from start to finish. I have to admit I do work hard for my business but it is out of necessity at the moment to get the business off the ground. In my former employment I worked a shift system of on average 6 to 2 and 2 to 10. When I was not at work I was in my workshop building for customers. It was not unusual for me to work from 6am to 9pm each day when I was on the early shift. (I had the nickname Duracell) Now I am self employed although I am working a lot of hours I am working less than I did before. I now start at 9am usually as sometimmes I start a little earlier if I am picking up materials. I will then work on average until 7pm. I do not stop for lunch but have sandwiches as I work. I also try not to work weekends but it is enevitable sometimes. I am now 55 years old and do feel that age at times but I feel much better than when I was employed. I am not making a fortune yet but am paying the bills each month and feeding the family.....just. I really enjoy the work and do not charge enough I know but my customers are happy and I seem to be getting plenty of work through recommendation. I have now been self employed for just under a year and don't see a lot of the family but they understand this situation as it is at the moment. My son is back in China working at the moment unti uni starts again in Sept but he will then be living away again when he returns. My wife is also working away at the moment having finished her Uni course. I am now working more hours as there is nothing to keep me at home other than my books and drawing up plans etc. I am also a smoker and do drink a little but am only slightly built at around nine stone wet through but am in good health...apart from my teeth that is....(smoking I am afraid) I do eat well for my size and can put away a good sunday lunch easlily every day. (Think I have a high metabolic rate) Recently I have been eating take aways and quick meals but making sure I DO eat well every day. Hopefully I will be able to ease back next year when the business is more stable and take more time out for myself, until then I shall try to make sure I do have the weekends to myself if I can. Sorry to garble on but i thought you should know why I am a dynamo with my work. Oh and I only have a small mortgage and low outgoings. HTH. :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

well... where do I start. There have been some very good advise floating about in the tread. Reading through it does seam it's not only me and may be some other people also need to stop and think. If you are in the same boat, read again and make sure some of the very good advise has sunk in!

Before I do carry on I would like to first thank Dodge for his pm. Out of all the posts I have read rodger's pm really stopped me in my tracks. He has requested that it dosen't go on the forum which goes without saying as he would have put it here himself instead of in a pm if that had been his wishes. Rodger THANK YOU, the information has been taken on board and has been a great help, may be one day I can repay the favor.

Well after typing and reading most of the day yesterday I sat down with the wife to come up with a plan, all be it in the car on the way to pick some gear up :?
In the short term I have made some phone calls and pulled in some help, they will be here today. In the long term I have opted to go back down the staff road. I am on with a new workshop build so I am going to have a push with it and get it finished then set someone on. I'm guessing that this should be up and running in about 6 weeks. May be then I can get back to a "normall" working week, what ever one of them is.

I used to go fishing, carp fishing for any of you that know what it's all about. Hours, days on end just sat behind the rods and alarms with nowt to do but think and found it prefect for clearing the head. I think the gear needs to come back out :lol:

If I am compleatly honest when I started the thread I expected some light harted banter along the lines of "man up and get on with it, it's called life" sort of thing and was hoping for the kick up the back side I needed to get on with things. However it has turned a bit heavy and really opened my eyes, may be I have been living/working blinkered to my surroundings.

Thanks for all the input, this might be a turning point in my business that will result in a beter quality of life for myself and more importantly my family. Thanks guys

all the best

Andy

 

[Tusses]

Good to hear you have stopped and thought.

Good luck with everything.

Oh ... the workshop build ... why not get a casual laborer in to do most of the work, with your supervision !

Surely you can earn more woodworking than you would pay him to put up some blocks

Fishing ! I need to get my license back up to date, as I live with 300ft of canal bank on my property :mrgreen:

Take care

Rich

 

[Tusses]

oh, and dont forget to make sure your machinery and gaurds are all up to date with current HSE, and your employers liability is on your insurance if you take on staff. Something that is easily overlooked !

You other option is subbing it out, but then you have to wonder if it's a good thing, you dont want them selling from underneath you !

 

[Benchwayze]

Tuss...

Fishing... I think I should do the same.

There's a great carp pool a mile from my house, and it's day-ticket water too. Hey ho.... Some new lines and weights? 8)

Andy...
Glad you have stopped to think. Best of luck.

John

 

[Digit]

With those hours Andy you're entitled to be bloody tired, age ain't got nuthin to do with it!

Roy.

 

[tomatwark]

Andy

I am glad that you have decided on away forward, I know how hard it is to make these decisions, but hopefully it will start to get your life work balance back on track.

Just remember that there are alot of us on here with similar experiences who will always try to help if we can.

It may also be the case that you have made one or two others stop and think as well


Tom