Help with Huge Black & Decker Drill

[Rhyolith]

We need a power tool section on this forum Hope this is an ok place for this, as its kind of a wood & metalworking tool.

Here is one of my favourite power tools, well at least when it comes to looks! As I don't have a chuck key big enough to actually use it.
Black & Decker 3/4" Drill by Rhyolith, on Flickr
I have been trying to find out how old it is, the person I bought it off claimed it was from the 1960s. Research online suggests that this design dates back as early the 1920s, meaning it could be nearly 100 years old! However it is hard to put an accurate date on it, and 100 years is a bit crazy for a electric tool (that still works!) can anyone help?

Also where to a get a massive chuck key?... :shock:
No.36 Chuck by Rhyolith, on Flickr

 

[Roughcut]

Jacobs no.36 chuck key?: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/K4-S13-CHUCK- ... 1799392503

 

[Rhyolith]

Jacobs no.36 chuck key?: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/K4-S13-CHUCK- ... 1799392503

Lol, thats defiantly a duh moment :roll: Thanks

 

[t8hants]

Ah the good old all metal gutbuster, those things don't take prisoners, your bones will break before they do. If the bit does jam the machine keeps going round. Still have some interesting memories of them in the boatyard, I watched a big one shake off three blokes who couldn't hold it. Unlike modern chucks those old Jacobs are very efficient so don't do them up too tight, so you have a safety margin, better a slipped bit than a sprained wrist.

 

[heimlaga]

I bough my shuck key off the shelf at an industrial supplyer. They are standard to this day.

I had a Finnish made equivalent from the post-war era. Manufactured by OY Naula AB in Jakobstad. It looked almst like a knock off of your Black&Decker.
I used in on construction sites for several years. Got a bit bruised once and ended up on two weeks sick leave once. After that lesson I learned to make proper precautions when using it. Once tamed the monster became very useful and rather safe. Two and a half years ago it sent out a puff of smoke and died when drilling peg holes in a log wall. The windings had burned and the collector was worn out. A rewind would have been too costly...... but someone told me that it should be in a museum so I called the town museum in Jakobstad and they wanted it. One day when heading for a job in that direction I walked into the office of the museum director and handed it over;-)

 

[Rhyolith]

The noise it makes is like some huge fearsome animal, so I am pretty wary of it!

The motor is around 800 watts (over 1 horsepower) and all that power is geared down ridiculously low... so I can entirely believe theses drills could have overpowered 3 men. After seeing a picture of a nearly identical one in a drill stand (so its basically a pillar drill) I decided that would be the safest way to use it if I could find such a stand (think B&D made one specifically for it). However I mostly have it to look at, its just to scary to use :shock:

heimlaga, cool story Its good to know its preserved, particularly as people are rapidly forgetting what a truly well made tool looks like . I am often torn with 50+ year old tools whether to preserve or use them; boing both has its merits.

Does anyone have any idea what era my drill is from? Could it be as old as 1920?

 

[Mark A]

Wow, that's a beauty!

I've been after a "gutbuster" type drill for a while as I enjoy restoring old power tools.

I was using one of my vintage circular saws a few weeks ago (a 1950s 8" Black and Decker) and the old boy who's repairing our roof saw it and wanted a go!

 

[Mark A]

Just taken another look at your drill and think my little 3/8" B&D is of similar vintage. Sadly the body's been attacked with wet and dry paper so I may not be able to see the plate properly, but if you ever take it apart there could be a slight chance that the date of manufacturing has been engraved onto the armature. I know for a fact that my Wolf RS10D circular saw was built in 1958 because it says so on the armature.

 

[Bm101]

As suggested, buying might be better done on Ebay but you might find this website useful Rhyolith. US company but they have a fair bit of stock for Jacobs, if you need to look for parts information and so on.
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=1117


Cheers
Chris

 

[toolsntat]

Does anyone have any idea what era my drill is from? Could it be as old as 1920?

On your other plate it says the patent date is May 18 1926

Dates can often be hidden in model numbers etc

Wonder if yours is a 26 from reversing the 62 at the end of yours :?:

PS your "machine in the bracken" looks interesting, anymore pictures ? 8) 8)

Andy

 

[Rhyolith]

Just taken another look at your drill and think my little 3/8" B&D is of similar vintage. Sadly the body's been attacked with wet and dry paper so I may not be able to see the plate properly, but if you ever take it apart there could be a slight chance that the date of manufacturing has been engraved onto the armature. I know for a fact that my Wolf RS10D circular saw was built in 1958 because it says so on the armature.

Thats just the angle of the photograph, the plates are in very good condition Here is a better photo, the patent date is displayed (as toolsntat pointed out), but not the manufacture date of this specific drill or at least not in a manner I can interpret.
Black & Decker 3/4" Drill by Rhyolith, on Flickr

Does anyone have any idea what era my drill is from? Could it be as old as 1920?

On your other plate it says the patent date is May 18 1926

Dates can often be hidden in model numbers etc

Wonder if yours is a 26 from reversing the 62 at the end of yours :?:

PS your "machine in the bracken" looks interesting, anymore pictures ? 8) 8)

Andy

I think it was some sort of mining machine, here is a picture of the whole thing
The Whole thing by Rhyolith, on Flickr

 

[heimlaga]

I think some people exaggerate the dangers....... just like any brutally strong power tools you should learn how to use it safely.

Just a few tips:

At 800 watts and around 600 rpm (typical speed for this type of machines) you should be able to hold it on your own when drilling vertically. Just stand with your feets widely apart and fairly straight arms and be prepared for a jam and a jerk. If you are prepared for it nothing dangerous will happen. Pulling the power button with just the outermost tip of your right hand index finger is a good habit. If the machine jerks your right hand index finger finger is likely to slid off the button due to the direction of rotation.

Drilling horizontally with one of theese is usually a two man job........ and drilling while standing on a chair or a ladder or a light scaffolding is a job for suicidal fools aiming for the Darwin Award.

The machine in the bracken looks like a stone crusher. It would be nice to have one of those.

 

[Rhyolith]

The trigger has to be pulled once to turn on a once to turn off, it other words it won't turn off just because your not pulling it anymore... thats probably the most dangerous thing about it.

The machine in the bracken is not mine, its lying on a hillside in Wales. Wish it was though

 

[Duncan A]

I can't help with dating the drill, but I've used similar to these in the past and can confirm that the torque when the bit jams is
impressive but tameable as long as you're ready for it. It is NOT a good idea to fall asleep on it after a night out, as I once
saw someone do! For on-site drilling at height into steel they were often used with the aid of a board through the handle
(broken off Rhyolith's machine) to give relief from their weight and to apply loads of pressure.
Frequently used in this fashion whilst teetering dangerously on an unstable or insubstantial platform - in the days when men
were men and even B & D tools were steel!
Duncan

 

[Rhyolith]

I have been on the look out for a replacement handle/breast plate for the back of this drill for a while... not holding my hopes up to high of finding one in the next decade...

Falling asleep on one one of these... :shock:

How solidly this thing is built is insane, I swear everything was been super macho back then...

 

[dickm]

+1 for it being a sronecrusher hiding in the bracken. Was it anywhere near the lead mines around Plynlimon?
Our neighbour had a similar machine which someone had spent a lot of time mounting on a chassis with feed hopper and oftake conveyor. It was being used to break up the concrete from the old house to make hardcore for the new. Quit noisy!

 

[Mark A]

Just taken another look at your drill and think my little 3/8" B&D is of similar vintage. Sadly the body's been attacked with wet and dry paper so I may not be able to see the plate properly, but if you ever take it apart there could be a slight chance that the date of manufacturing has been engraved onto the armature. I know for a fact that my Wolf RS10D circular saw was built in 1958 because it says so on the armature.

Thats just the angle of the photograph, the plates are in very good condition Here is a better photo, the patent date is displayed (as toolsntat pointed out), but not the manufacture date of this specific drill or at least not in a manner I can interpret.

I was talking about my drill when I mentioned the wet and dry!

I had a quick look earlier and it's definitely from the same era as your drill, but I didn't have time to check out serial numbers etc.

 

[heimlaga]

I wonder if it would be possible to block the latching mechanism inside the trigger so the machine runs only when you push the trigger.
Mine had been through some kind of modification to acheive that but that happened before I bought it

The top handles are usually broken off because someone has put a board through it as support. Mine was gone as well and I decided not to fabricate a new one. I was afraid that it would misslead someone to actually use it to hold the machine when drilling.

 

[Rhyolith]

+1 for it being a sronecrusher hiding in the bracken. Was it anywhere near the lead mines around Plynlimon?
Our neighbour had a similar machine which someone had spent a lot of time mounting on a chassis with feed hopper and oftake conveyor. It was being used to break up the concrete from the old house to make hardcore for the new. Quit noisy!

I assumed the trigger latches on so the thing can be used in a drill press conveniently. As this is the mostly likely practical use I have for it I will probably leave the trigger as it is... honestly though I think I will just put it on display somewhere; is an interesting talking piece

So one of the serial numbers contain the manufacture date? How do I extracts that info?

 

[AndyT]

Looking for something else, I just came across an old Black and Decker catalogue that I am sure you will like, Rhyolith.
It's from about the same era as your drill (possibly!) though I don't think the exact same model is there. It does have some great evocative pictures and some informative copy about design features and build quality.

It's on a wide ranging and interesting site which tries to cover the history of woodworking and tools, and goes off into all sorts of directions, on this page:
http://www.woodworkinghistory.com/manufacturers_tool_catalogs.htm - scroll down for the Black and Decker Portable Electric Tools and Shop Equipment (Catalog No 6) -- 1923 - just under the Percy Wells dresser.
(I could have linked direct to the pdf but then you'd miss all the other treats!)