Hand Plane setup, sharpening & how to plane properly - in person course

[D_W]

I think it's just someones hobby, which they like to talk about all the time.

I think someone doesn't know what they're talking about, but they're going to "school" to woodwork and think they're an authority. If it wasn't a significant issue, nicholson wouldn't have talked about it and more expensive double iron planes wouldn't have replaced single iron planes.

But, show them your degree when they ask about your bona fides. I'm sure that will impress someone. Because, I know when I work with clients day to day, I tell them all about my credentials rather than what I've got experience with and where I see potential areas of improvement for them.

 

[Ttrees]

I’m at a loss here as to what an “influenced shaving” is.
Surely the term influence in the title of the older video above is applied to the position of the cap iron to the iron and it is this that has an “influence” upon the timber being planed and producing a shaving of some type.
Either close or not so close depending on the timber or type of surface required.

Anyone new to this forum would think that simply planing a piece of timber to flat and square needs a PhD in either maths or metallurgy.
Its no real surprise that folk come on here and lack the confidence to sharpen and plane because they are getting the impression that it’s some recondite art that only the chosen can do.

Sure, we can understand that the placement of cap iron on an iron can “influence“ the type of shaving that you can get but the shaving itself is not called an “influenced shaving”…or am I missing something ?

Sounds to me like you've described things perfectly GerryT
I think newcomers would do well to be reading these forums, as the guru's drip feed system has likely gotten old for them and led those to this place.

Until I get a better description for a smoother shaving in difficult material,
I will continue as others to use the scientific term from the video.
Think it was done a long time ago now, does that count as vintage?
Can we use the term by now?

Were not working Cuban mahogany or clear timbers like in the days many of the
go to's of old were written.
I believe those guides would have more on the subject if things weren't so hand to mouth.
That's two small reasons I can give as to why this doesn't have much mention in historical terms.

Fair I think to give someone a chance to learn, and seek all options,
should they have placed a foot on a few paths already.

I don't believe this to be as complicated as the folks are making it out to be,
but my writing could likely be better.

 

[Adam W.]

No, for most people it's not complicated or scientific, but some just love to pretend that they know best and play guru.

Just smile and nod and skip the posts.

 

[Jameshow]

To me it's just practice.

Firstly to sharpen the blade.

Secondly take small amounts off, you cannot put it back on but you can take it off further,

Thirdly if it's not cutting correctly stop and ask myself what's the problem? what have I done differently, what's different about the timber?

Forthly try and remember what I did previously and get back up to speed if I've been away from the bench, any length of time.

Fifty if it isn't happening go and have a break and come back to it, something is often on my mind that's stops me from good woodworking....

 

[Jacob]

If you go into enough detail the simplest things can be made to seem really difficult.

 

[Jacob]

To me it's just practice.

Firstly to sharpen the blade.

Secondly take small amounts off, you cannot put it back on but you can take it off further,

Thirdly if it's not cutting correctly stop and ask myself what's the problem? what have I done differently, what's different about the timber?

Forthly try and remember what I did previously and get back up to speed if I've been away from the bench, any length of time.

Fifty if it isn't happening go and have a break and come back to it, something is often on my mind that's stops me from good woodworking....

Yebbut that's all very well - how curly are your shavings?

 

[Sporky McGuffin]

Anyone new to this forum would think that simply planing a piece of timber to flat and square needs a PhD in either maths or metallurgy.
Its no real surprise that folk come on here and lack the confidence to sharpen and plane because they are getting the impression that it’s some recondite art that only the chosen can do.

Very much this. For woodworking I am a hobbyist; I make things that I'll either like making or will like once made. I use hand tools and machines and have some gadgets, and the navel-gazing and air-of-authority posts definitely push me towards the machines and gadgets because they give the impression that my approach to hand tools - sharpen them with the sharpening stuff I have until they work well enough for what I'm doing - is akin to being a Neanderthal just smashing one rock into another and shouting "UG" at passing clouds.

 

[Jacob]

.........
Maybe you folks would like to see both the winding sticks and a flat bench approach?
Well I haven't seen Brain do any checks on the bench, clickedy clacks or pivoting,
but reckon the technique might be in some more of his videos.

Brain seems to be planing away without reference to the flatness of the bench! How can this be?
He's got the hang of winding sticks for twist and for hollows though he does seem to taking them a bit seriously.
Big plane for a little piece of wood.
He talks too much and is probably over thinking it.

 

[D_W]

Brain seems to be planing away without reference to the flatness of the bench! How can this be?
He's got the hang of winding sticks for twist and for hollows though he does seem to taking them a bit seriously.
Big plane for a little piece of wood.

https://brianholcombewoodworker.com/furniture-gallery/
I don't think you'd want to get into any kind of contest with brian in making things out of wood, but you could probably paint faster. Brian is probably being deliberate for demonstration - don't know.

The plane is what anyone would've used for pre-smoothing work on a panel until power planers were common. 20-24 inches or so for a try or long plane, then smoother.

The idea that this is territory for a smoother or jack plane is modern goofiness.

I know who made the plane that he's using.

 

[D_W]

Very much this. For woodworking I am a hobbyist; I make things that I'll either like making or will like once made. I use hand tools and machines and have some gadgets, and the navel-gazing and air-of-authority posts definitely push me towards the machines and gadgets because they give the impression that my approach to hand tools - sharpen them with the sharpening stuff I have until they work well enough for what I'm doing - is akin to being a Neanderthal just smashing one rock into another and shouting "UG" at passing clouds.

I think you're overinterpreting the actual users of hand tools. The actual use is sharpen tool, set tool, plane wood. The long routines or gobs of specialty tools are modern hobbyist nonsense. The idea that features were added to planes (like cap irons) aren't are esoteric is also modern nonsense, but that one's got a strong following because people like paul sellers or rob cosman (and the entirety of lee valley) avoid discussion of it.

Interestingly, the last french planemaker that I saw a video of (on youtube) from around 1980 made a fairly fast plane and put the plane together and instantly shot a shaving straight up out of the plane.

What's really popular on forums is for some people who have little (this isn't you, by the way) experience using hand tools for much neat work making grand claims about how simple things are for them, and their advice leaves people who actually want to do nice work simply in the lurch. It is maybe a little boring to hear that one set of chisels, a jack, try/jointer and smoothing plane and a pair of stones is enough to do just about everything planing flat (and on any wood practical, or even impractical to work) - maybe that has something to do with it. That excludes for purposes of any practical gain anything more modern than a stanley 4, expensive sharpening stones, ruler tricks, etc. Simply using the basic function of a double iron plane is all that's needed.

 

[Jacob]

...... the navel-gazing and air-of-authority posts .....

The would-be-gurus tend to want to own the territory but can safely be ignored!
They spread a lot of confusion and we see far more misled guru victims than gurus.

 

[D_W]

No, for most people it's not complicated or scientific, but some just love to pretend that they know best and play guru.

Just smile and nod and skip the posts.

Show them your B.A. and tell them you just want adulation!!

 

[Adam W.]

Show them your B.A. and tell them you just want adulation!!

Whatever you say Bubba.

 

[Ttrees]

Brain seems to be planing away without reference to the flatness of the bench! How can this be?
He's got the hang of winding sticks for twist and for hollows though he does seem to taking them a bit seriously.
Big plane for a little piece of wood.
He talks too much and is probably over thinking it.

Note that the bench is flat, and the big blue spirit level in the background.
I haven't watched the video through, just identified a well working plane.
All I can say is I'll flip the timber if I get a shadow line under the work, and make it sit right, note the appearance of that shadow line on the left, could well be caused by the work being held with the dogs, and thus the timber lifting on the left hand side.

I use a simple batton/cleat in front of the work, and if very wide or many wideish pieces maybe something to the back side of the bench, never anything behind needed.
The planes will cut in both grain directions, so no need to swap directions to suit any grain, as any rough cambered plane has been used beforehand will have followed it favourably, no need for a scrub plane for what I do.

No planing across the grain, just diagonally if twist is apparent.
Maybe I'll get lazy and use dogs someday, until then I'll use my methods,
but that will only be after planing as I do now, and getting the board flat in the first place.
as I can't flip the work if it's held.

 

[Adam W.]

Anyway.

@Ttrees I think it might have been an article from that bijou kumbaya carpentry mag that I get from the states.

I'll dig it out later after tea.

 

[Jameshow]

To me it's just practice.

Firstly to sharpen the blade.

Secondly take small amounts off, you cannot put it back on but you can take it off further,

Thirdly if it's not cutting correctly stop and ask myself what's the problem? what have I done differently, what's different about the timber?

Forthly try and remember what I did previously and get back up to speed if I've been away from the bench, any length of time.

Fifty if it isn't happening go and have a break and come back to it, something is often on my mind that's stops me from good woodworking....

Yea forgot to say I mostly work on a workmate.....!

 

[Jacob]

........
All I can say is I'll flip the timber if I get a shadow line under the work, ......

All I'm saying is that you don't need to flip the wood over, unless it's really rocky then a wedge or a bit of clamping might help. You work on the chosen first face, then the edges, then the back.
Brain isn't flipping it. Cosman's vid is about prepping for the thicknesser with a bit of hand planing, which he does perfectly well on a loose board. He could hand finish the side he started on without flipping it.
I'd try and forget about the "reference surface" idea if I were you, though it comes in handy sometimes.

 

[Jacob]

Yea forgot to say I mostly work on a workmate.....!

Well don't tell the others!

 

[Adam W.]

@Jameshow Now you've done it !

 

[Ttrees]

Seemed possibly the best written historical record of folks suggesting to use if it is.
Likely in the archives.