Festool Vacuum Rip Off!

[kmhphoto]

My brother-in-law just purchased a Festool SRH 45E vacuum cleaner. Cost was £892.00 + VAT.
It bears a remarkable resemblance to the Alto Attix range that was being discussed on here a while back. In fact the only difference is that the Alto is £625.00!
A call to Alto revealed that the reason for the similarity is "We make them for Festool"

Now I love my Festools but this is clearly a rip off!

 

[chippy1970]

Is that the new vac for dryliners ?

It goes with the wall sander ?

Thats bad if they are exactly the same, I have not seen any other festool stuff that is made by other manufacturers I thought they made everything in house.

 

[TheDudester]

If you have a look at both cleaners they are virtually identical except for colour of course!

Regards

D

 

[woody67]

See what you mean!!! :shock: :shock:

 

[mister henderson]

It's not necessarily Festool themselves who are making the extra money here, it could be that the dealer charged the full retail price and therefore made the biggest slice of the extra profit.

Having said that, it's a good example of the need to check the market carefully. I have lots of Festool stuff but at that price I think I would be having a good look around first.

 

[mister henderson]

See what you mean!!! :shock: :shock:

Having had another look at the picture, I can clearly see that the Festool is bigger!

 

[Slim]

Confirms what I have always thought about Festool. They overprice simply because they can.

 

[motownmartin]

Festool may be good tools but you pay an extra 30% for the name, its the same when you buy anything in the world of fashion, anything with a Gucci Label can be double the price, I tend to steer clear of anything like that

 

[woody67]

Having had another look at the picture, I can clearly see that the Festool is bigger!

Ah - Ah, that's why! No wonder Festool charges £267 more. Can't understand why kmhphoto is complaining! :wink:

 

[ivan]

Mafell certainly made/make routers for Festool, and some of their own bear a passing (not identical, but definitely brotherly) resemblance to the Festool range. It's quite possible that all Festool mfg. is contracted out.

 

[Jake]

Not all of it is, but some of it seems to be.

It is difficult to judge how identical the two are inside - not that I have any doubt that Festool would aim to sell at a premium to Nilfisk. [edited, as found the Nilfisk H-rated one at £625 being referred to)

 

[Steve Maskery]

Festool have a policy of in-huse production where possible.

They sub-contract specialist parts to appropriate manufacturers (e.g. magnesium castings for the TS55, the plastic housings for the bodies, etc.) Some standard parts are bought on the international market. For example, all cintered parts come from China, simply because there is now only one cintered-part manufacturer in the world, and that is in China. One of their machines is made in Czechland, I forget which.

But the vast majority of the manufacturing is done at their own factory, including machining of critical parts like armatures.

I don't know anything about the particular vac in question, but it does seem worthy of a raised eyebrow.

S

 

[BradNaylor]

Now I love my Festools but this is clearly a rip off!

No it isn't.

A 'rip-off' is where some sort of fraud has taken place or if a product or service is misrepresented. Festool (or anyone else) is quite at liberty to charge whatever they like. Indeed they have a duty to their shareholders to maximise profits. If they find that their products no longer command a premium they will have to reduce their prices.

This is capitalism.

The onus is on the buyer to research the market and to find the best deal.

Caveat emptor - buyer beware.

 

[Mcluma]

Now I love my Festools but this is clearly a rip off!

No it isn't.

A 'rip-off' is where some sort of fraud has taken place or if a product or service is misrepresented. Festool (or anyone else) is quite at liberty to charge whatever they like. Indeed they have a duty to their shareholders to maximise profits. If they find that their products no longer command a premium they will have to reduce their prices.

This is capitalism.

The onus is on the buyer to research the market and to find the best deal.

Caveat emptor - buyer beware.

Sorry but you'r blatantly wrong

This is a rip off

see Wikipedia for an explanation of rip off:
A ripoff (or rip-off) is a bad deal. Usually it refers to an incident in which a person pays too much for something. A ripoff is distinguished from a scam in that a scam involves wrongdoing such as fraud; a ripoff, on the other hand, is in the eye of the beholder

In a related meaning, a ripoff is a blatant or unscrupulous copy or imitation. This is also known as a knockoff. In both senses there is an associated verb "to rip off", but the location of the preposition differs between the two meanings

 

[ivan]

The vac might not be a rip off by any definition - Nilfisk/Alto probably sell a lot more blue ones than Festool do of their coloured 'copy', so the Fesool version is bound to cost more.

Festool's real rip off is the difference between US and european pricing.

 

[andycorleone]

The vac might not be a rip off by any definition - Nilfisk/Alto probably sell a lot more blue ones than Festool do of their coloured 'copy', so the Fesool version is bound to cost more.

Festool's real rip off is the difference between US and european pricing.

absolutely true. I can only imagine germans so pissed because something made in your country cost cheaper else where :shock:

 

[TheTiddles]

The difference is tax, I can (and do) buy British made tools cheaper in Texas than I can get them here. The only thing that enables this to continue is import duty.

If Festool do make all their own parts in-house in Germany then that is why they cost so much. Manufacture in Europe is frightfully expensive. The general rule is, if it's cheaper to outsource components, send them out. If you can't get the quality you are after, bring them in. Obviously they need the quality of making parts themselves, that or they aren't very good at running suppliers.

The vacuum cleaner is a clear case of them wanting a high quality tool to compliment their range but it not being their area of expertise, so you buy someone else's technology and re-badge it, it is a common practice and everybody does it. You think Dewalt make their own motors??

Now, obviously it is the same machine and you are paying a premium for something, be that the additional cost of moulding the parts in different colours, every time they need a batch they will have to clean out the equipment, run sample parts validate etc... much more expensive than always running the same color. This will push the overall cost up, is the service better with Festool, the guarantee more comprehansive? Or maybe they are getting stung for selling someone elses machine and have to pay a premium to them for the privelige?

Aidan

 

[Mcluma]

Now, obviously it is the same machine and you are paying a premium for something, be that the additional cost of moulding the parts in different colours, every time they need a batch they will have to clean out the equipment, run sample parts validate etc... much more expensive than always running the same color. This will push the overall cost up, is the service better with Festool, the guarantee more comprehansive? Or maybe they are getting stung for selling someone elses machine and have to pay a premium to them for the privelige?

Aidan

You know what, i wouldn't be surprised at all if the mouldings would come from china

 

[tnimble]

The difference is tax, I can (and do) buy British made tools cheaper in Texas than I can get them here. The only thing that enables this to continue is import duty.

How can this be related to tax, when the difference between goods sold in the USa or in Europe (for most european countries the UK prices are about the same lower as the USA princing is for the UK) the production country within europe, or when fully manufactured in an asian country and the USA? Depending on the country and the product pricing can differ up to about 300%! No VAT or import tax even comes close, and most product have no import taxes on them.

 

[BradNaylor]

Now I love my Festools but this is clearly a rip off!

No it isn't.

A 'rip-off' is where some sort of fraud has taken place or if a product or service is misrepresented. Festool (or anyone else) is quite at liberty to charge whatever they like. Indeed they have a duty to their shareholders to maximise profits. If they find that their products no longer command a premium they will have to reduce their prices.

This is capitalism.

The onus is on the buyer to research the market and to find the best deal.

Caveat emptor - buyer beware.

Sorry but you'r blatantly wrong

This is a rip off

see Wikipedia for an explanation of rip off:
A ripoff (or rip-off) is a bad deal. Usually it refers to an incident in which a person pays too much for something. A ripoff is distinguished from a scam in that a scam involves wrongdoing such as fraud; a ripoff, on the other hand, is in the eye of the beholder

In a related meaning, a ripoff is a blatant or unscrupulous copy or imitation. This is also known as a knockoff. In both senses there is an associated verb "to rip off", but the location of the preposition differs between the two meanings

Here's a few more definitions of what constitutes a 'rip off'.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/rip-off

http://www.yourdictionary.com/rip-off

http://dictionary.die.net/rip%20off

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rip-off

As you can see, the consensus is that a 'rip off' entails dishonesty, not just a high price.

Carrying your logic to it's conclusion would mean that someone bidding for and winning a DeWalt drill on ebay and then finding the same model for sale in his local tool shop at a lower price could consider himself to have been 'ripped off'!

Which of course he wasn't. Freely entering into an agreement which you later regret does not mean you have been ripped off. It just means that you've paid more than you needed to.

Not for the first time Wikipedia is totally inaccurate!

Cheers
Dan