Face masks

[Lons]

Whilst it's true we humans preserve life of the less able/ intelligent / sensible, etc, etc, the alternative requires someone or some people to decide who is worthy and who isn't. Slight echoes of 1930's Europe, I fear. :shock:
If we are to be truly 'survival of the fittest' then anarchy and not society is the logical extension. Everyone should be self sufficient. I think it's fair to say that humans have moved beyond that. Just a thought.

The suggestion that others decide who lives or dies dependant on age, ability, creed or anything else is certainly not something I would ever support Greg although we know it happens every day in hospitals to prioritise beds, equipment and medication. If you read my posts you'll find I got slammed by some for my views that the old and other vulnerable people be protected by lockdown.
My mother's family were Austrian and although not Jewish were right in the centre of Nazi persecution so I have strong views as you can probably imagine.

 

[Rorschach]

If you read my posts you'll find I got slammed by some for my views that the old and other vulnerable people be protected by lockdown.

If you got slammed by me it was for the method you proposed/supported, not for the principle of protecting the old and vulnerable.

 

[John Brown]

I have two nephews, both adopted and brought up in the same environment. One is exceeding smart with a good master's degree, and the other couildn't find his buttocks in the dark.

I have friends who had two children, neither were adopted. Chalk and Cheese.

Strange names, I'll grant you, but hey, it was the 70s.

 

[RogerS]

Back to my OP
Masks give some protection to others from the wearer. So the masks do have a function.

Whilst it might defy the logic of the man in the street they don't protect the wearer.
Distance does. Double the distance and you decrease the risk by fourfold or more ( the more is open to some debate but not the fourfold!).

The right mask DOES protect the user if applied and used properly. Otherwise there'd be very few medical staff left.

 

[Lons]

If you read my posts you'll find I got slammed by some for my views that the old and other vulnerable people be protected by lockdown.

If you got slammed by me it was for the method you proposed/supported, not for the principle of protecting the old and vulnerable.

Bullsh*t!

I could have named you but didn't as it would be provocative however you've just identified yourself. :wink: Anyway what happened to your declaration you wouldn't respond to any of my posts? You just can't help being an bottom wipe! :roll:

 

[Garno]

My mother's family were Austrian and although not Jewish were right in the centre of Nazi persecution so I have strong views as you can probably imagine.

Everyone should have strong views on this, if only to make sure it can never happen again.

 

[Rorschach]

Lets also remember the Nazi's killed more non-Jews, than Jews.

 

[Trevanion]

8 pages in and they're already on Nazis

 

[Trainee neophyte]

In no way segueing from Nazis, there is an interesting paper written by a Swiss former. Emeritus professor at the university of Berne:

Coronavirus: Why everyone was wrong
The immune response to the virus is stronger than everyone thought.

Firstly, it was wrong to claim that this virus was novel. Secondly, It was even more wrong to claim that the population would not already have some immunity against this virus. Thirdly, it was the crowning of stupidity to claim that someone could have Covid-19 without any symptoms at all or even to pass the disease along without showing any symptoms whatsoever.

It goes against the orthodoxy, but is interesting reading: https://medium.com/@vernunftundrichtigk ... e6db5ba809

 

[Lons]

Have you taken your medication tonight TN?

 

[Trainee neophyte]

Have you taken your medication tonight TN?

Did you read it? If so, what do you disagree with?

 

[RogerS]

Have you taken your medication tonight TN?

Did you read it? If so, what do you disagree with?

Is your tinfoil hat on securely, TN ? You'll be telling us next that 5G masts are causing Covid.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

The author, Beda M Stadler is the former director of the Institute for Immunology at the University of Bern, a biologist and professor emeritus

Of course, it's on the internet so may be nonsense - if you can show that Her Doktor didn't write the article, isn't a doctor, or isn't qualified to comment in this area, then I would be interested to hear. If you can show your medical qualifications trump his qualifications, I would also be interested to hear your opinion as to why, specifically, this article is tosh. Until then...

 

[lurker]

Back to my OP
Masks give some protection to others from the wearer. So the masks do have a function.

Whilst it might defy the logic of the man in the street they don't protect the wearer.
Distance does. Double the distance and you decrease the risk by fourfold or more ( the more is open to some debate but not the fourfold!).

The right mask DOES protect the user if applied and used properly. Otherwise there'd be very few medical staff left.

Read the seventh post on page one, I made to this thread.

From what I have seen on the telly the medics are alive more by luck than design. Most of them have either not been trained properly or have ignored their training.

 

[RogerS]

The author, Beda M Stadler is the former director of the Institute for Immunology at the University of Bern, a biologist and professor emeritus

Of course, it's on the internet so may be nonsense - if you can show that Her Doktor didn't write the article, isn't a doctor, or isn't qualified to comment in this area, then I would be interested to hear. If you can show your medical qualifications trump his qualifications, I would also be interested to hear your opinion as to why, specifically, this article is tosh. Until then...

Oh FFS, TN....get a grip, man.

Here's a snippet...

So: Sars-Cov-2 isn’t all that new, but merely a seasonal cold virus that mutated and disappears in summer, as all cold viruses do

Remind me? How many effing people around the world are DEAD because of Covid ?

I'm sticking you back on Ignore along with that other nutter, Karen.

 

[RogerS]

Back to my OP
Masks give some protection to others from the wearer. So the masks do have a function.

Whilst it might defy the logic of the man in the street they don't protect the wearer.
Distance does. Double the distance and you decrease the risk by fourfold or more ( the more is open to some debate but not the fourfold!).

The right mask DOES protect the user if applied and used properly. Otherwise there'd be very few medical staff left.

Read the seventh post on page one, I made to this thread.

From what I have seen on the telly the medics are alive more by luck than design. Most of them have either not been trained properly or have ignored their training.

My point is still valid.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

@Roger (who allegedly can't hear me): Relax. Breathe. It's just an idea. I did say it goes against the orthodoxy. If you don't want to play with thought experiments, that's ok, too.

 

[Lons]

Have you taken your medication tonight TN?

Did you read it? If so, what do you disagree with?

Some of it, haven't you got better things to do than trawl the internet for tosh, maybe the animals need feeding or olives picking.

 

[Lons]

The author, Beda M Stadler is the former director of the Institute for Immunology at the University of Bern, a biologist and professor emeritus

Of course, it's on the internet so may be nonsense - if you can show that Her Doktor didn't write the article, isn't a doctor, or isn't qualified to comment in this area, then I would be interested to hear. If you can show your medical qualifications trump his qualifications, I would also be interested to hear your opinion as to why, specifically, this article is tosh. Until then...

And of course as you don't have those qualifications either then why would you believe what he says when there are many more opinions published to the contrary by scientists with equal or higher qualifications.

Oh I know, it's because he says what you want to believe and you post just to troll. :wink:

 

[Trainee neophyte]

Oh I know, it's because he says what you want to believe and you post just to troll

No. Actually, I try really hard not to upset people. In other words, I bow to the groupthink and accept the enforced censorship of aggressive narrative control that is so evident here. That is, I mostly bow to it, sometimes things gets the better of me. I have to say that I am rapidly losing the will to consider other people's feeling, at which point I may well become a troll. Until then, I am trying to have some kind of discourse, but unfortunately it is mostly with people who put their fingers in their ears and shout "La, la, la! I can't hear you!".

Questions I consider interesting: does the human body have an ability to protect itself from the Coronavirus? Does this(novel?) virus mean that no human being, anywhere in the world, has protection or built in immunity from it? If that is the case , why are virtally no children getting ill? How does that work? I can't get my head around the logic.

Another interesting question: the chart of deaths in the UK conforms to virtually every normal epidemic - it is a textbook example. Why does this mean that it will not behave like every other coronavirus outbreak: infections increase, peak, decrease and die out, awaiting the next virus, after it has mutated. Every single cold virus outbreak follows this pattern - why not this one? What's different? Why will there be a second wave? Virus return is normally because it comes back to infect the newly born, who don't have herd immunity, but this virus doesn't touch children, so what is the logic?

And then your appeal to authority: only listen to the approved experts? Which ones? The ones that have already been confirmed to be completely wrong and incompetent (Neil Fergusson), or the ones that have already been caught out in the lie (masks don't work, until they do)? Show me which lie is the correct lie to believe, please.

I would like to have a conversation about these things, because I freely admit there are things here I don't understand, and things that don't seem to conform to the internal logic of the agreed upon narrative.

If you are so completely wedded to a narrative that you cannot even contemplate considering alternatives, that says more about you than me, in my opinion.

So the question really is: have you driven me out, enforced narrative cleansing and ensured that only your "official" view Is allowed to be aired, or do I keep chipping away, asking questions and offering alternative viewpoints? What say you? Do you want a conversation, or just confirmation that you are always right?