cordless drills and batteries, NiCad V NiMh.

[chunkolini]

Hi again.
My cordless bosch drill/driver has croaked, or rather the batteries have croaked, NiCad's I hate em.

Where do I go next? I have seen the axminster combi drill at £50.00ish with NiMh batteries, and a high amphour rating. I have used a few of their own brand tools with success but was put off last week by their useless circular saw (rant rant).More info available if folk are interested.

I have also seen a Dewalt drill/driver at a similar price but it has NiCad's.

Being notoriously tight, I dont mind spending on decent kit but I hate buying stuff that does not do the job. Are there 'batteries' and 'Batteries' ?

It is a tool I use a lot and depend upon, and I hate throwing things out.

Opinions welcome, experienced opinions even more welcome.

Chunko'

 

[TonyW]

Hi Chunko'
While not being able to give you an "experienced expert opinion" and understanding that you may be well aware of this - my opinion:

I believe that NiMh batteries are probably the better way to go. They do not seem to suffer the memory effect of NiCads meaning you can just keep charging them at any state of battery power. I believe that partial charging of NiCads is the reason so many seem to fail too quicly. I think that you can try and rejuvenate NiCads by draining them completely (perhaps attaching a torch bulb and leaving overnight) although I have not actually tried this.
I guess also that amphour rating - higher the better.

Hope this of some help until a more expert answer comes along - also apologies if I am "trying to teach granny to suck eggs"

Regards
Tony

 

[mailee]

Yes there are batteries and batteries. I think you will find that batteries with the Makita/De Walt logo are better than some of the unbranded ones in NiCads. I have two Makita drill drivers which are older than I can think (actually one of them is 15yrs old and still on the same batteries! You must make sure that you run the batteries completely flat before charging them with NiCad's or they will develop a memory. NiMh ones are better of course but not so many about. It will improve even more once Lithium batteries are perfected. Anyway I digress a little, go for good quality NiCad's if you replace them they are more expensive but worth the money. :wink:

 

[PowerTool]

I agree with Alan - when you buy a cordless drill,the largest part of the purchase price is for the batteries;good quality NiCad are currently the best bet.

Andrew

 

[Phil]

Well for what its worth....

I agree with mailee....my makita batteries have been in use every day for years - still going strong. (NiMh)

Just invested in some of the makita LXT (LI) range and find these excellent also ( so far anyway - time will tell)

also i agree avoid cheap unbranded batteries - Makita source directly from samsung - quality batteries that will give you many years of service

Good luck with whatever you decide to do

Phil

 

[Woody Alan]

My Makita is also going strong after many years too and my Bosch failed early, which is why my impact drill is also Makita. I am a little surprised by the reference to Samsung as regards batteries, I haven't heard of them being a source before. The most respected rechargeable batteries of all time are Sanyo, but whether they are used by Makita I couldn't say, but I wouldn't be at all surprised. The reference to Sanyo comes from many years radio control modelling where you have to know what you can rely on, or risk losing many hundreds of pounds/hours of model. As sadly several did, despite information to the contrary, cheap batteries aren't worth the saving.

Cheers Alan

 

[Nick W]

Before giving up on your old unit, try disassembling the battery pack and inspecting the contents. You will almost certainly find that the batteries themselves are standard issue, and you can replace them with off the shelf ones. The only slight problem might be with connecting the new ones together, but if you're careful with the soldering iron, or better a spot welder, it can be done.

 

[Anonymous]

The most respected rechargeable batteries of all time are Sanyo

And Panasonic are also top end cells for pro tools.

Andy

 

[Slim]

I think that you can try and rejuvenate NiCads by draining them completely (perhaps attaching a torch bulb and leaving overnight) although I have not actually tried this.

NiCads lose their charge holding capacity because crystals grow and short out the induvidual cells. There is a recognised technique for rejuvinating NiCads. This is done by zapping the battery with a much higher voltage than would normally be used to charge the battery. It can be done using a MIG welder. The quick burst of higher voltage burns away these crystals and restore the battery to its former glory. However, I would certinly not recommend doing this as it could be dangerous.

I have also heard that placing the battery in soil pipe with electric cable coiled around it, plugged into the mains (thus creating a magnetic field) works.

 

[Noel]

As Andy has mentioned Panasonic are generally recognized as world leaders in battery technology. Indeed, they manufacture the majority of top end tools' powerpacks despite the various tool makers' labelling.

 

[dedee]

I did what Nick W suggested and replaced NiCads with Nimh. I bought them from these people http://www.strikalite.co.uk/ who also configured the batteries ie did the soldering bit.

The only downside is that using my existing charger they take about 4 times longer to recharge.


Andy

 

[Anonymous]

The memory effect in modern niCADs is well documented as the fallacy it is. This effect has not been evident in batteries for many years

A search on the forum will reveal previous discussions where links and evidence were put forward by various people.
higher energy densities)

Having said that, NiMH is the way to go unless you can get Lithium Ion which have higher energy densities


As an aside, we use 7.2 and 4.8 volt NiCAD packs all year round at work (our students use them) and are still using the ones I bought 7 years ago

 

[Woody Alan]

Dedee

Unless your charger is specifically made to charge Nimh then it might not be capable of detecting the peak voltage at full charge (smaller peak than nicad) so be careful as it's very easy to overcharge because of this. You can usually tell if you are getting an overcharge as they will get hot HOT. I do realise it may be due to the capacity of the new cells is 4 times that of your old ones.
Something to be aware of, is capacity isn't everything, the ability of the cell to deliver the power required is often diminished to some extent by the neccessary make up of the cell to get the extra capacity. Also these higher capacity cells won't neccessarily fast charge very well or for very long. Sanyo make ranges of cells specifically for fast charging as do Panasonic.

Alan

 

[dedee]

Alan, thanks for the warning. I remember discussing the tech spec of my charger with the bods at Strikalite but do not recall any mention of your point about overcharging. I'll see if I can find Nimh charger just in case.

Andy

 

[Nick W]

Yes, I should have made it clear that you should replace NiCd with NiCd, MiMh with NiMh etc. as the voltages of the different types vary and may well play havoc with your charger.

 

[George_N]

Not only do you get better quality batteries with the likes of Makita, you get better quality chargers. Cheaper drill/drivers have simple "dumb" chargers tht keep on charging after the battery is fully charged. The batteries then overheat, which dramatically shortens their life.

 

[the_g_ster]

I don't think i would fancy zapping a battery with a mig welder.

You're right, there is an exact science to getting the best out of these batteries, and even the NMH ones suffer a bit from memory.

Li-ion batteries are well and truely perfected now (batteries, phones and other fancy equipment that's high load too) but because all the product life cycle stuff the big players are holding it back as they can do what they need with this and still try and charge you a fortune for somthing that's technically very much out of date. Li-ion ones would be awesome in some things but they will prob come out in next 5 to 10 years.

It's the same with phones too, not so long ago we had tiny mobile phones, but now because the cameras they are alot larger. There are too tiny camera's, but manufacturers just want to milk the current models with very little development costs and maximum profits.