chip extraction/collection V's air filtration

[NikNak]

Hi guys (and gals)

I'm sure this has (probably) been covered before, but i'm gonna ask again anyway, plus i see there's quite a few few 'newbies' that may be interested in reading this and the replies.....

I recently got rid of my old SIP chip collector, similar to one of these

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... rod580436/

and have now saved a bit of money to buy myself something a little better.... but what to go for :?

Now, at this point please bear in mind that it's only for hobby use and wont be used day-in-day-out, but don't want to buy the cheapest, or the most expensive. I've got a small Jet lathe, an EB band-saw, a small vertical belt sander and a 100mm belt/150mm disc sander.... oh and a router (with table) that gets very occasional use. Shed size is 16' x 10' x err 8' (?)

I'm eyeing up one one of these...

http://www.axminster.co.uk/jet-jet-afs- ... prod21189/

and carry on using my trusty dust pan and brush to collect up all the chips that never seemed to get sucked up anyway as they tended to 'spray' where ever they wanted to go....

Will this be good enough with the dust pan and brush..?


or.... should i bite the bullet and ALSO get me-self one of these too..?

http://www.yandles.co.uk/product.php/se ... AMCGV286-1


or.... i see that Ax have these on offer at the mo....

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... rod370402/


or.... have you got any other suggestions/ideas..?? :?



(oh, i've also got down me shed an old Dyson used for general cleaning/sucking of dust and smaller chips...)



As always..... cheers in advance




Nick

 

[CHJ]

Unless you also wear a good face mask then be aware that a shop air filtration unit is only working in parallel with your lungs in clearing the air of dust particles, good for getting a clean atmosphere for cabinet finishing etc but not the ideal unit to be used as stand alone as far as personal safety is concerned.
I personally think you would be better off with a HVLP extractor fitted with fine(cartridge) filter in the shop or best of all fitted with a coarse filter situated outside the shop to move as much dust laden air away from the spinning wood.

Have you read my notes on the subject from the H&S sticky.

 

[wabbitpoo]

I think a lot of newcomers to the hobby assume they can keep a tidy, clean workshop like you see on telly. This isn't so in my experience. Save the money and get yourself a powered lightweight face mask to protect yourself, then go around with your vac cleaner now and then to clean up. That would be my advice. others will have their own advice.

 

[Bemused]

+1 for above.
The roof mounted air cleaners / filters only clean the air up after all the dust is air born and they take a while to do this and soon clog
I would suggest (based on my limited experience) a power face mask as number 1, this is your primary protection.

Then as funds allow then something like the record power RSDE1 / 2, which will make life easy from a cleaning up in the nooks ad crannies point of view and again latter can b adapted for machine extraction for the more nasty jobs

 

[mike s]

i wear a trend airshield pro air-fed respirator that filters the air i breath and keeps my lungs safe.
i am looking to buy an air filter to take away the airborn dust so it doesnt coat everything in the shop.
i have a shop vaccuum cleaner that i attach to any machine that makes a lot of dust but there is always some that escapes, this is why i wear an air fed helmet.
a shopvac is good for taking the bulk out of the machines you attach it to but will not keep all of it out of the air, an air filter will remove it from the air but at this point it will be in your lungs.
you will need to keep your dustpan and brush for heavy shavings from turning as they fill the shopvac too quickly, using the brush will throw up the fine dust on the floor - another reason to wear a respirator.
so my advice would be to get a good air fed respirator (like the airshield), an air filtration machine (like the one you linked) and a vaccuum cleaner type machine that attaches to the source of the mess.

 

[gerrybhoy70]

Save the money and get yourself a powered lightweight face mask to protect yourself, then go around with your vac cleaner now and then to clean up. That would be my advice. others will have their own advice.

I'm with wabbitpoo on this one.
Even with filtration/extraction, there's still going to be clearing up to do afterwards so leave it all to the brush/shovel/vac as they're never going tob e 100% effective.

Provided you have good masking & shielding to protect your lungs & eyes, then I don't see a need for anything else.

Unless you're running a constant production line, I don't really see the need for extraction systems.
Most people I know who turn wood for a hobby or small extra earner do it from the comfort(??) of a draughty shed, so there's plenty of air movement to carry dust out.

Again, only my opinion.

 

[NikNak]

ooopps..... i can feel an edit coming on.... i shuda said that i doo wear a mask as well, sorry should have made that clear

Thanks Chas (?) for the link to the H&S docs. Read them fully and very interesting and informative they are too.

I've spent 30 years in the glassfibre industry working with Polyesters, Vinylesters, Epoxies, Furan's, Phenolics, Carbon Fibre, Kevlar, etc etc... and as you may (or may not) know there's LOADS of nasty smells, dusts and general yucky doo dahh's at every corner. And over the years i've developed a very sensitive nose and can detect the slightest 'nasty' at the mere whiff of it, when others just look at me like i'm over-reacting. So i can assure you prevention IS at the top of my list.

The main reason for posting yesterday was that i spent a few hours down the shed turning a 10 1/2" bowl/platter from a lump of Zebrano worktop given to me... and it STINKS when you turn it. Ended up with a mahoosive pile of shavings and dust everywhere.... and being a VERY tidy person i then spent ages tidying up afterwards... :evil: .... and sorry Gerry but there are no drafts in my shed... as i've insulated it soo well :wink:

As most of what i turn is of the small variety, i.e. pens, box's, ring box's etc, I think i'm going to go for the
http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... rod370402/
as i think this will serve my needs quite nicely, plus it comes with a 'starter pack' of tubes and fittings 8)
and then maybe back that up with a small Microclene 'air' filter as well.... (but a little later on... :wink: )

But if anyone has one of this type of err extractor/collector then i'd be very interested to hear what they think of it and how it performs..... :?:


Nick

 

[gerrybhoy70]

.... and sorry Gerry but there are no drafts in my shed... as i've insulated it soo well :wink:Nick

Lucky git!! :evil:

 

[wallace]

My two penneth is like the others masks, I am so sensitive to dust now that I still get irritation when I use my 3M dustmaster so now I have a small pump that came from a cold war radar machine. It draws fresh air from outside and pumps it into my mask. One way to deal with dust generated from woodturning is to have a shed just for the lathe. I have done this, then I dont have to clean up everytime I turn. plus it makes for good anti fatigue matting when you get a good few inches of shaveings.
Mark

 

[Harlequin]

some food for thought

about-dust-extractors-and-the-thien-cyclone-t57135.html

 

[Silverbirch]

Like many of us, I suspect, I wrestle with the twin problems of trying to deal with the maximum amount of dust with the minimum amount of noise.
I use a HVLP two bag dust extractor, with the hose positioned near to the head of my lathe. It doesn`t catch many shavings, but helps to draw dust produced when turning drier wood or when sanding, away from the lathe.I think it also redistributes a good proportion of it back into the air. I also have it connected to the bandsaw, where it does a similar job. Its only 750w, but adequate for these two jobs, and not as noisy as a vacuum type machine.
I also use a Trend Airshield mask/helmet, which also produces noise, but works very efficiently. Its main downside is that its fairly heavy and bulky and becomes annoying to wear after a while.
My third line of defence is a Microclene air filter, which seems to do a good job, but makes an irritating wooshing noise. Fiinally, I make frequent use of a brush and shovel (not noisy at all) and a vacuum cleaner.
So, I try to strike a balance, by only using the various appliances when they are needed. I like to listen to the radio while I`m working. I`m supposed to be doing it for pleasure. I don`t want to feel like I`m engaged in some kind of industrial process.
Hope this is of some help.

Ian

 

[chipmunk]

Hi Nick,
I have recently installed a twin motor wall mounted camvac with 63mm plumbing for sanding at the lathe, dust ex at the bandsaw and for general cleaning up. I also have a Jet AFS 500 running all of the time in the workshop.

This seems to be a pretty good set-up although I am a bit disappointed that the camvac outer woven filter clogs relatively quickly but in a way that's good - it means it is doing its job.

The Jet dust filter is a lot quieter than the Microclenes and the twin motor Camvac is way more powerful than the Axminster in your link and is cheaper than the Numatic equivalents sold by Axminster. A couple of noise reducing labyrynths on the camvac exhausts are a must though because these things are noisy (cheaper than two hoses as recommended by Camvac) but these were easy to knock-up out of some scrap.

I can recommend the Axminster 63mm plumbing kit which is cheaper than the equivalents from Camvac.

HTH
Jon

 

[NikNak]

Many thanks guys.....


John, i've placed an order today for the AX SFCA-200 wall mounted system, and a set of the 'plumbing' accessories too. To be delivered very soon....

late xmas present from me to me.... :ho2



Nick

 

[myturn]

I've been using a Camvac GV336 (single motor) and it is ok for extraction on "enclosed" tools like mitre-saw, router, band-saw. It is very noisy which makes it quite a nuisance if using it for any length of time.

It's useless for the lathe where it only picks up what falls directly into the collector (I use the poseable hose) or what is within an inch or two of the mouth of the hose. Turning any reasonable sized bowl or hollow-form throws the dust everywhere. I also have a Microclene above the lathe and wear a JSP Power Cap, the latter being the main line of defence against dust.

I've just ordered an Axminster UB-801F Extractor with fine filter and will dedicate this to the lathe collecting via a Big Mouth dust hood and also experiment using a desk-fan to encourage the dust towards the collector and away from me.

From all I have read and heard from other turners the 2.5" ducting is completely inadequate for extracting from the lathe and the minimum should be 4" and preferably 6".

Dust prevention has become a crusade for me as I react quite badly to it both from inhalation and, with several species, simply from contact. If this new extractor is still insufficient then my next move will be to follow Chas's advice and build a small shed outside to house as large and as many extractors as are needed to keep the dust under control.

My advice to anyone using a lathe is to rely mainly on a powered respirator as that is the ONLY thing that will really keep the dust out of your lungs.