Antique wood and brass 10 inch level, need manufacturer for 18th century

[MarthaBear]

Hello,

I am researching my Great Grandfathers tools, who was a Master Finish Carpenter from Glasgow. I am trying to determine the manufacture of a 10” antique brass and hardwood level; it has a stamp of "ALEX R COUTTS WARRANTED". 1 Image Attached

In my research, I am thinking there was a takeover of a company along the way because I cannot find any history of an Alex R Coutts company in hand tools for the late 18th and early 19th Century.

I found another level that looks exactly like mine however; it is stamped Mathieson Glasgow, and a bit worn. 2 Image Attached.

I found a post of someone selling a very similar level with the same stamp "ALEX COUTTS WARRANTED" however, the Warranted is in a slightly different location. Then the level is slightly different than mine, it has a side brass piece that mine does not have, and the top brass is a bit different. 3 Image Attached.

Then I found one exactly like the second one however it is stamped "Bennet B. Burley Warranted Glasgow" 4 Image Attached

Then I found other levels stamped “Alexander Coutts Glasgow Warranted”, with just a brass top. Image Attached.

Then I found exact same levels with just a brass top, but they are stamped "Alex Coutts Glasgow", "Bennet B Burley Glasgow Warranted", and “Bennet B Burley Glasgow No 5 Warranted" Images Attached.

Then I found multiple listings selling what appeared to be the same level however none of these had any stamps.

This is where I need help. So many identical levels, with so many different stamps. I can be many companies that have switched hands along the way. I researched the A. Coutts, Alex Coutts, Alex R Coutts, Bennet B Burley, Mathieson, Alex Mathieson, Alex Mathieson & Son all as possible main companies. However, I have nothing definite to show the heritage / manufacture of this item that I can turn into the museum. HELP!
10 inch Wood Brass Levels

 

[Jacob]

Hello,

I am researching my Great Grandfathers tools, who was a Master Finish Carpenter from Glasgow. I am trying to determine the manufacture of a 10” antique brass and hardwood level; it has a stamp of "ALEX R COUTTS WARRANTED". 1 Image Attached

In my research, I am thinking there was a takeover of a company along the way because I cannot find any history of an Alex R Coutts company in hand tools for the late 18th and early 19th Century.

I found another level that looks exactly like mine however; it is stamped Mathieson Glasgow, and a bit worn. 2 Image Attached.

I found a post of someone selling a very similar level with the same stamp "ALEX COUTTS WARRANTED" however, the Warranted is in a slightly different location. Then the level is slightly different than mine, it has a side brass piece that mine does not have, and the top brass is a bit different. 3 Image Attached.

Then I found one exactly like the second one however it is stamped "Bennet B. Burley Warranted Glasgow" 4 Image Attached

Then I found other levels stamped “Alexander Coutts Glasgow Warranted”, with just a brass top. Image Attached.

Then I found exact same levels with just a brass top, but they are stamped "Alex Coutts Glasgow", "Bennet B Burley Glasgow Warranted", and “Bennet B Burley Glasgow No 5 Warranted" Images Attached.

Then I found multiple listings selling what appeared to be the same level however none of these had any stamps.

This is where I need help. So many identical levels, with so many different stamps. I can be many companies that have switched hands along the way. I researched the A. Coutts, Alex Coutts, Alex R Coutts, Bennet B Burley, Mathieson, Alex Mathieson, Alex Mathieson & Son all as possible main companies. However, I have nothing definite to show the heritage / manufacture of this item that I can turn into the museum. HELP!
10 inch Wood Brass Levels

Common practice for a tool-dealer or shop to have their own mark put on items supplied made by somebody else.
He's listed here: (230) - Towns > Glasgow > 1828-1912 - Post-Office annual Glasgow directory > 1892-1893 - Scottish Directories - National Library of Scotland
Coutts, Alexander, edge-tool maker, 181 Trongate;
ho. 92 Evelyn st., Dennistoun.

 

[MarthaBear]

Common practice for a tool-dealer or shop to have their own mark put on items supplied made by somebody else.
He's listed here: (230) - Towns > Glasgow > 1828-1912 - Post-Office annual Glasgow directory > 1892-1893 - Scottish Directories - National Library of Scotland
Coutts, Alexander, edge-tool maker, 181 Trongate;
ho. 92 Evelyn st., Dennistoun.

Hello Jacob,
Thank you for your help! This additional information about Alex Coutts helps. Let me see if I understand correctly. My Great Grandfather probably bought the level from Mr. Coutts, who put his stamp on it. Mr. Coutts was basically the reseller of the level. Then who was the manufacturer? I have to have that for my donation to the museum. Thank you for your help! Martha

 

[Jacob]

Hello Jacob,
Thank you for your help! This additional information about Alex Coutts helps. Let me see if I understand correctly. My Great Grandfather probably bought the level from Mr. Coutts, who put his stamp on it. Mr. Coutts was basically the reseller of the level.

Just my guess. The maker would have put Coutt's stamp it. Common in Sheffield - lots of different brands on tools or parts thereof, made by one workshop.

Then who was the manufacturer? I have to have that for my donation to the museum. Thank you for your help! Martha

Maybe you have to search all Glasgow tool makers of the era and see if any of them do levels? Or maybe an "instrument" maker as they are very different from iron and steel cutting tools?

 

[joshvegas]

Alex MAthieson & sons were a big glasgow toolmaker, including levels.

Could be local supplier to the tool shops

 

[MarthaBear]

Just my guess. The maker would have put Coutt's stamp it. Common in Sheffield - lots of different brands on tools or parts thereof, made by one workshop.

Maybe you have to search all Glasgow tool makers of the era and see if any of them do levels? Or maybe an "instrument" maker as they are very different from iron and steel cutting tools?

Thank you for your reply Jacob. So if it's common for the manufacturer/maker to put the workshop's / reseller's name on the tool - "Alex R Coutts", "Mathieson", and "Bennet B. Burley" all as examples, and the various forms of these names. This helps, this explains why the same tool has different stamps or no stamps on it. One part was solved. Thank you!

Now the last part, who was the original manufacturer of the level? How could I find out who was making tools at that time in that area?

Thank you for your help! Martha

 

[MarthaBear]

Alex MAthieson & sons were a big glasgow toolmaker, including levels.

Could be local supplier to the tool shops

Hello Josh, thank you for your reply.

I had wondered if Alex Mathieson was the manufacturer and the reseller of the levels. When I look up the Mathieson history on Wikipedia, they date back to when it is possible. Do you think for the museum donation I could put A Mathieson as the Manufacture?

Alexander Mathieson & Sons - Wikipedia

Thank you fo your help! Martha

 

[joshvegas]

Eh you might of missed my post...

The big Glasgow toolmaker was mathiesons. Absolutely in action by then.

 

[Jacob]

Thank you for your reply Jacob. So if it's common for the manufacturer/maker to put the workshop's / reseller's name on the tool - "Alex R Coutts", "Mathieson", and "Bennet B. Burley" all as examples, and the various forms of these names. This helps, this explains why the same tool has different stamps or no stamps on it. One part was solved. Thank you!

Now the last part, who was the original manufacturer of the level? How could I find out who was making tools at that time in that area?

Thank you for your help! Martha

Forgot to say - there's Tools & Trades History Society who might know more, and there are dozens of books, best known being Dictionary of Woodworking Tools
I'll have a look if I can find my copy its in a heap somewhere!
PS found it! Two pages about levels but no makers hints. Picture of a decorative one like yours says it's "Lancashire pattern".
Different makers using same design? The plot thickens!

 

[MarthaBear]

Eh you might of missed my post...

The big Glasgow toolmaker was mathiesons. Absolutely in action by then.

Hi Josh,
Thank you! I think you are right that it probably was the Mathieson family, was the manufacturer and the reseller of the levels. From looking at Wikipedia for the Mathieson's it dates back to the appropriate time frame. I am going to go for it and say they were the manufacturer. Thank you so much for your help!! Martha

 

[MarthaBear]

Forgot to say - there's Tools & Trades History Society who might know more, and there are dozens of books, best known being Dictionary of Woodworking Tools
I'll have a look if I can find my copy its in a heap somewhere!
PS found it! Two pages about levels but no makers hints. Picture of a decorative one like yours says it's "Lancashire pattern".
Different makers using same design? The plot thickens!

Hi Jacob,
Thank you so much for your help! Woo Hoo! Now I can add the type of pattern on the level! I am going to go with what Josh has and say the Mathieson family was the manufacture and reseller of the level. From what research I have done it seems to tie in with the dates. Thank you for your help!! Martha

 

[Droogs]

Hello Jacob,
Thank you for your help! This additional information about Alex Coutts helps. Let me see if I understand correctly. My Great Grandfather probably bought the level from Mr. Coutts, who put his stamp on it. Mr. Coutts was basically the reseller of the level. Then who was the manufacturer? I have to have that for my donation to the museum. Thank you for your help! Martha

The manufacturer was in all probability Mathieson at their main Saracen works near Glasgow Cross. They made their own branded tools there (most notably planes) along with contracted unbranded production runs for other resellers.. More info below:
https://www.mackintosh-architecture.gla.ac.uk/catalogue/browse/display/?sysnum=s138

and I think you can obtain one of their catalogues from here:
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/ce411664-a1c2-4adc-89e5-803f542f7ff0

 

[jcassidy]

Here's an example of one.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

Nothing has changed in 2022.

Bandsaws, lathes, thicknessers, dust extractors etc etc etc are often made to a common design, possibly, in the same Chinese factory.

They are fitted with different generally very minor parts (eg: handles and knobs) to create the illusion of uniqueness, given a specialised paint job and brand decals.

They are then sold as Axminster, Charnwood, Scheppach, Einhell. Sealey, Clarke etc - dressed up versions of pretty much identical machines.

 

[MarthaBear]

The manufacturer was in all probability Mathieson at their main Saracen works near Glasgow Cross. They made their own branded tools there (most notably planes) along with contracted unbranded production runs for other resellers.. More info below:
https://www.mackintosh-architecture.gla.ac.uk/catalogue/browse/display/?sysnum=s138

and I think you can obtain one of their catalogues from here:
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/ce411664-a1c2-4adc-89e5-803f542f7ff0

Hello Droogs,
Thank you so much for your help! This is amazing! Thank you for verifying Mathieson as the probable manufacturer. It is incredible that you found a catalog, I will see if I can find a way to look at it. All of this should be enough for the Musume to accept this item. I could not have done this without all of your help! Thank you so much!! Martha

 

[MarthaBear]

Here's an example of one.

View attachment 147612

Hi JCassidy,
Thank you for your image. I did find some similar to this one too. Thank you for confirming what I found, this helps!

 

[MarthaBear]

Nothing has changed in 2022.

Bandsaws, lathes, thicknessers, dust extractors etc etc etc are often made to a common design, possibly, in the same Chinese factory.

They are fitted with different generally very minor parts (eg: handles and knobs) to create the illusion of uniqueness, given a specialised paint job and brand decals.

They are then sold as Axminster, Charnwood, Scheppach, Einhell. Sealey, Clarke etc - dressed up versions of pretty much identical machines.

Hello Terry - Somerset,
Thank you for your reply. It does appear that the same manufacturer made the item and then they added different stamps, for the resellers. It is very true this practice still happens today, with store brands for example. Thank you for your input and for verifying this information, it helps!