Veneering a jewellery box

[Clippo]

Hi, I’m wanting to make my mum a jewellery box out of mdf and then veneer it and flock / line it. Can anyone on here please offer me any advice on the veneering process? Should I make the box first and then veneer or rip the sides down to the required widths and lengths and then veneer it before gluing it all together. Also, would you mitre the mdf corners or use a butt joint but cut the edge banding at 45 degrees to bake it look like the box has a mitres joint ?? Thank you

 

[MikeG.]

I'm struggling to see MDF as a suitable material for a box. You're either going to be lipping it, or veneering all the edges somehow, and you'll still be faced with trying to fit the hinges into the edge of the board, where screws don't really work. A mitred corner joint in MDF is doomed to failure, and a butt joint won't work with glue alone. I suspect that if you are asking these sorts of questions that you don't have the skills to successfully do the lipping or edge veneering, so my suggestion to you is to consider making a box out of wood instead.

 

[marcros]

welcome to the forum.

could I ask your level of experience and your reason for wanting to use mdf and veneer? what tools do you have at your disposal?

 

[Yojevol]

The base of his dressing table mirror is made 8mm mdf:-

The joints are all butts. I made the carcass first and got the drawers running nicely. I then applied the sandlewood veneer to all external surfaces. The corner edges were then routered off to provide a rebate for the faux ebony stringing. it was made about 18 years ago and has remained stable ever since.

Brian

 

[Glynne]

I'm struggling to see MDF as a suitable material for a box. You're either going to be lipping it, or veneering all the edges somehow, and you'll still be faced with trying to fit the hinges into the edge of the board, where screws don't really work. A mitred corner joint in MDF is doomed to failure, and a butt joint won't work with glue alone. I suspect that if you are asking these sorts of questions that you don't have the skills to successfully do the lipping or edge veneering, so my suggestion to you is to consider making a box out of wood instead.

For a beginner I would be inclined to agree, but a lot of the boxes made by Andrew Crawford and Ian Hawthorne (top end boxmakers) are veneered MDF. Yes some are lipped and mitred corners are reinforced but MDF is stable and you don’t need to worry about wood movement.
I’m sure there is a thread on here about box making books so perhaps a search might throw up some ideas?

 

[MikeG.]

The base of his dressing table mirror is made 8mm mdf:-View attachment 7View attachment 8The joints are all butts. I made the carcass first and got the drawers running nicely. I then applied the sandlewood veneer to all external surfaces. The corner edges were then routered off to provide a rebate for the faux ebony stringing. it was made about 18 years ago and has remained stable ever since.

Brian

Sure, but how does that help someone who asks for basic advice on veneering? You have to take posts in their context.

 

[Glynne]

Coincidentally I have just receieved an email from Fine Woodworking on veneering a jewellery box.
Most of the videos in the series are restricted to subscribers and the substrate used is plywood rather than MDF but you might find it useful.
Veneering a jewellery box

 

[woodbloke66]

Hi, I’m wanting to make my mum a jewellery box out of mdf and then veneer it and flock / line it. Can anyone on here please offer me any advice on the veneering process? Should I make the box first and then veneer or rip the sides down to the required widths and lengths and then veneer it before gluing it all together. Also, would you mitre the mdf corners or use a butt joint but cut the edge banding at 45 degrees to bake it look like the box has a mitres joint ?? Thank you

Good to speak on the 'phone just now and I'm glad you joined the forum. As discussed, you'll find plenty of really good help and advice - Rob

 

[OscarG]

Rob, just been stalking up your FlickR page! You've made some amazing items, the boxes are gorgeous.

I this one is my fave >> https://www.flickr.com/photos/137114367 ... 755961595/

What wood is that?

 

[deema]

The base of his dressing table mirror is made 8mm mdf:-View attachment 7View attachment 8The joints are all butts. I made the carcass first and got the drawers running nicely. I then applied the sandlewood veneer to all external surfaces. The corner edges were then routered off to provide a rebate for the faux ebony stringing. it was made about 18 years ago and has remained stable ever since.

Brian

Sure, but how does that help someone who asks for basic advice on veneering? You have to take posts in their context.

Veneering is a skill and it’s something usually learned towards the end of an apprenticeship. To be asking about veneeing probably suggests a mastery of the basic skills :lol:

MDF is a perfect substrate for veneering to!

 

[woodbloke66]

Rob, just been stalking up your FlickR page! You've made some amazing items, the boxes are gorgeous.

I this one is my fave >> https://www.flickr.com/photos/137114367 ... 755961595/

What wood is that?

Thanks Oscar, much appreciated. That's a piece of Turkish Walnut that was destined to be a shotgun stock and there was just enough in there to get out a jewellery box for my daughter's birthday present. There's a tale in the telling here, 'cos she's a professional archeologist and her learned colleagues (no offence intended to anyone in the profession btw) tend to smoke 'roll ups', have beards and wear big muddy boots. I sent it to her workplace and deliberately wrapped it in pink girlie paper with a suitable ribbon and bow. When she unpacked it from the outer box, the pink package was laid bare on her desk for all to see, to much ribald comments! When she opened the package and they saw what was inside, she unquestionably had the last laugh! - Rob

 

[Yojevol]

The base of his dressing table mirror is made 8mm mdf:-View attachment 7View attachment 8The joints are all butts. I made the carcass first and got the drawers running nicely. I then applied the sandlewood veneer to all external surfaces. The corner edges were then routered off to provide a rebate for the faux ebony stringing. it was made about 18 years ago and has remained stable ever since.

Brian

Sure, but how does that help someone who asks for basic advice on veneering? You have to take posts in their context.

I'll let Clippo decided whether my contribution is relevant to his context or not

 

[Clippo]

welcome to the forum.

could I ask your level of experience and your reason for wanting to use mdf and veneer? what tools do you have at your disposal?

Hi, I gave previously built a box using walnut oak and ash splines. I have table saw, many routers, bandsaw, bobbin sanders belt sanders plus lots and lots of hand and power tools. I wanted to have a go at veneering and I know a lot of boxes are done this was, mdf or plywood

 

[Clippo]

The base of his dressing table mirror is made 8mm mdf:-View attachment 7View attachment 8The joints are all butts. I made the carcass first and got the drawers running nicely. I then applied the sandlewood veneer to all external surfaces. The corner edges were then routered off to provide a rebate for the faux ebony stringing. it was made about 18 years ago and has remained stable ever since.

Brian

This is beautiful Brian. So do you think it’s reasonabke to build a box from mdf and veneer ?? I hadn’t thought of the hinges and screwing into ply or mdf as raised by another comment

 

[Hornbeam]

MDF or a good quality birch ply will make a very good base for veneering. The general rules with veneering are that whatever you do to one side you should do to the other to balance.
If you have a router table and a mitre lock cutter I would use that for your corner joints otherwise a plain mitre with internal reinforcing spline.
Veneer inside first, then joint.
I would fit base and lid into simple rebates
When you cut the box to separate lid and base you will then need a lipping on both cut edges to cover substrate. Dependent upon the visual you want the lippings can be applied before or after the external veneers,.
Once veneered I would cut a 2 to 4 mm rebate in all corners and fit a corner stringing to provide visual contrast and protect the edges
Ian

 

[Yojevol]

This is beautiful Brian. So do you think it’s reasonabke to build a box from mdf and veneer ?? I hadn’t thought of the hinges and screwing into ply or mdf as raised by another comment

I haven't much to add to what Ian has just contributed. If I were making a box it would, like you Clippo, be for the first time and I would follow the construction methods used in the mirror base. I would avoid mitre joints if using MDF. Mitre joints are a pain to get accurate and glue up at the best of times and if the joint is to hidden by veneer, then butt joints will suffice. The veneer will add to the integrity of the joints.
The real problem with MDF, in any situation, is the attachment of hinges. Hence the often suggested use of edge lippings. This also applies if you want to have close fitting, unattached lids. One solution to keep things simple is to have a loose fitting lid (like an upturned tray) which slips over the box base. The thing about MDF is that you really have to think through the detailed design to cope with its limitations.
Brian

 

[Hornbeam]

If using simple but joints for the corners, I would use a rebated joint such that the depth of teh lap was the same as the corner stringing. That way you will avoid any risk of the joint telegraphing through the veneer
ian

 

[Eric The Viking]

Hinges: Much depends on what type you intend using, but if they are close to a corner, you can simply drill into the edge and let in a dowel at right angles to the hinge screws.

I do it in softwood when I need to put a screw into end grain, and it works well. On a jewellery box scale, I'd probably use a Mahogany-ish hardwood because of the fine pitch of the screws, but once cut off flush with the side there is very little chance of it telegraphing through your veneer, as it will move across its width and only by a tiny amount.

Furthermore, most MDF has a harder "crust" on the flat faces, and is a bit lighter density in the middle of the board thickness, so again there is a slight room for movement (depending on thickness). I think it's more pronounced in MR MDF.

For what it's worth, the author of one veneering primer I have strongly recommends MDF as a ground for veneering projects, because of its stability. The book itself isn't brilliant as a primer (so not wholeheartedly recommended), but his work (and Brian's!) proves that MDF is a good choice.

I also watch a lot of Thomas Johnson's stuff on YouTube. He's an American furniture restorer, and a huge amount of his work seems to be repairing veneered work that's been done on a natural wood ground, which in turn has shrunk in a modern home. Some of the damage - shrinking and splitting is rather soul-destroying to see (but he regularly seems to manage the impossible!). MDF does move about, very slightly, but far less than natural materials.