The neverending Table Saw decision

[MikeJhn]

I have read a lot about the Axminster TS 200-2 and the 250-2, the reviews are a bit of a mixed bag as some love it and others don't. But it definately looks like a capable compact saw.

Does the TS-200/250 use a standard mitre slot?

I found the TS82 in Norway at almost 2x the price. Converted : 1060,- Looks nice though.

It depends on what you mean by standard. If you mean the US 3/4", then no. Details and pdf manuals are on the Axminster site

Sent from my MI 3W using Tapatalk

If by a mixed bag you are referring to the reviews on the Axminster site, I would take most of them with a pinch of salt, some of the comments are very dubious to say the least, one reviewer using an 86kg saw as a site saw? another taking off the internal dust housing and then complains the belt does not last long? another so obviously has never seen or bought the saw its painful, I don't know what they hoped to achieve by their reviews, but I applaud Axminster for publishing them. Its a lot like any Forum, where a number of people give advice on a product they don't own or have ever seen. (hammer)

Bodgers: At last someone else who realises that American 3/4" is not standard, in Europe metric is our preferred measurement, manufacturers are you listening, especially in those in Asia.

Mike

 

[memzey]

I have read a lot about the Axminster TS 200-2 and the 250-2, the reviews are a bit of a mixed bag as some love it and others don't. But it definately looks like a capable compact saw.

Does the TS-200/250 use a standard mitre slot?

I found the TS82 in Norway at almost 2x the price. Converted : 1060,- Looks nice though.

It depends on what you mean by standard. If you mean the US 3/4", then no. Details and pdf manuals are on the Axminster site

Sent from my MI 3W using Tapatalk

At last someone else who realises that American 3/4" is not standard, in Europe metric is our preferred measurement, manufacturers are you listening, especially in Asia.

Mike

Metric is not my preferred standard and I’m in Europe. I’d prefer all my making related items to be in standard imperial I.e. thicknesses of ply/mdf, chisel widths, etc. Manufacturers are you listening?

 

[Brandlin]

At last someone else who realises that American 3/4" is not standard, in Europe metric is our preferred measurement, manufacturers are you listening, especially in Asia.

Mike

That's nonsense.

I am the biggest proponent of metric over imperial you will find, but the whole point of a 'standard' is that it's a standard! What matters is that slots are the same width so that tools and jigs can be interchanged. Whether that is 3/4", 19.05mm or the internationally accepted measurement of the wavelength of a wet fart doesn't maatter. as long as they are the same.

 

[MikeJhn]

To perpetuate the imperial measurement system in a metric world is nonsense, the only reason most mitre slots are a non standard measurement of 3/4" is that most Asian manufactured saws are made for the American market, no other reason, the added confusion that comes into play is where a few enlightened manufactures realise we live in a metric world and make a table with a metric slot, this is bemoaned, incorrectly IMO, to be non standard and the problem is perpetuated on Forums like this.

Mike

 

[memzey]

Nonsense. Standards can be based on any system of weights and measures. What matters is that items made to that standard are all the same. As for metric or imperial- I suspect we will never agree but for my money imperial works perfectly for making. Metric strikes me as being more suited to simple counting. Whatever you prefer but please don’t presume to speak for me by saying we in Europe prefer metric. I think it’s the devil’s work!

 

[Brandlin]

Nonsense. Standards can be based on any system of weights and measures. What matters is that items made to that standard are all the same.

Couldn't agree MORE.

As for metric or imperial- I suspect we will never agree but for my money imperial works perfectly for making. Metric strikes me as being more suited to simple counting. Whatever you prefer but please don’t presume to speak for me by saying we in Europe prefer metric. I think it’s the devil’s work!

Couldn't agree LESS.


The argument between metric and imperial is dominated by discussions between people brought up under one system or the other. It is driven by FAMILIARITY and almost entirely by those that use the systems only for very basic things like the measurement of lengths, or weights.

However it is a simple fact that the interchangeability of the ISO metric system is far superior when doing anything more complex, from forces, pressures, power and energy to electronics the relationship between the units is clear and does not reuire the memorising of a large number of adhoc ,conversion factors. That's its power and simplicity.

The issue we have in britain is that having started metrication we didn't go the whole hog. We have a stupid relationship to both methods which has promoted this ludicrous halfway house that simply confuses and costs money.

 

[MikeJhn]

We will have to agree to disagree, but brought up under the Imperial system, but changed to metric in 1963 when I started work so have been using it for a fair amount of time.

The devil's work is Cling film or as I call it the Devil's spawn. :twisted:

Apologies to the OP for the massive thread drift. :ho2

Mike

 

[memzey]

Nonsense. Standards can be based on any system of weights and measures. What matters is that items made to that standard are all the same.

Couldn't agree MORE.

As for metric or imperial- I suspect we will never agree but for my money imperial works perfectly for making. Metric strikes me as being more suited to simple counting. Whatever you prefer but please don’t presume to speak for me by saying we in Europe prefer metric. I think it’s the devil’s work!

Couldn't agree LESS.


The argument between metric and imperial is dominated by discussions between people brought up under one system or the other. It is driven by FAMILIARITY and almost entirely by those that use the systems only for very basic things like the measurement of lengths, or weights.

However it is a simple fact that the interchangeability of the ISO metric system is far superior when doing anything more complex, from forces, pressures, power and energy to electronics the relationship between the units is clear and does not reuire the memorising of a large number of adhoc ,conversion factors. That's its power and simplicity.

The issue we have in britain is that having started metrication we didn't go the whole hog. We have a stupid relationship to both methods which has promoted this ludicrous halfway house that simply confuses and costs money.

Interchangeability is no doubt a strength of the metric system. No argument there. Of course you can do the same with imperial but more mental arithmetic is required. In terms of familiarity; I’m 42 and went to school when the metric system was being heavily pushed and the imperial system was barely touched on. I have always found imperial measures to be more relevant and relatable when it comes to making. That may not be true for you as well but I strongly suspect I’m not alone.

 

[Emstuv]

As long as the wavelength of a wet fart will be further discussed, I'm ok with the thread drift.

However I am looking more into the Scheppach TS82, granted it is expensive there in Norway but it does appear solid. Trying to locate reviews on it. It doesn't reeeaaally fall into the smallish/compact style though.

Ugh, I need to stop looking at the festool site......man they are nice and small. Good dust extraction and nice matt aluminium.

As for Imperial and Metric, my wife is American and I promise myself everytime we fly over not to get bogged down in a metric discussion. Never happens, everytime someone asks me to pass them 123/678 inch ratchet I snap. Or paper!!!! How difficult is the system used here. A0 - A1 - A2 etc...... the US thing ARGH.

Isn't the Imperial system based on some dried grains of barley or something? Sounds like an accurate system to me.

 

[sickasapike]

Darn, i had a look to see how much Screwfix would deliver to 'other EU' for, they pointed me at the screwfix.eu site, which doesn't have any Sheppach saws at all, there is a Geman .de Screwfix site, but they only have 2 budget Sheppachs and a decent Bosch.

 

[Emstuv]

Received email from Screwfix EU, they don't deliver to Norway.

 

[MikeJhn]

Axminster do! http://www.axminster.co.uk/machinery/sa ... aw-benches

Mike

 

[Brandlin]

Interchangeability is no doubt a strength of the metric system. No argument there. Of course you can do the same with imperial but more mental arithmetic is required. In terms of familiarity; I’m 42 and went to school when the metric system was being heavily pushed and the imperial system was barely touched on. I have always found imperial measures to be more relevant and relatable when it comes to making. That may not be true for you as well but I strongly suspect I’m not alone.

As i said the argument is based on FAMILIARITY and TRADITION.

If you had been brought up on the wavelength of wet fart system i suggested above you would no doubt be arguing for that, as it would be the way you were conditioned to work.

The facts are very clear. the metric system is DESIGNED to allow units of measure of varying things to work together. the Imperial system is not.

I'm 49 and was brought up on imperial in the home and metric at school. I'm an engineer and i cannot for the life of me fathom how people are supposed to work in imperial for doing anything more than measuring something with a tape measure and weighing things on bathroom scales. You can use any unit you like to do those simple tasks - hell some very impressive things like cathedrals were built before standardised measures whether they be imperial or metric. But if you want to do anything more complicated then chose a measurement system

Anyway the wavelength of a wet fart is the same as the width of one *non-standard* mitre slot - simple.


I see norway is suffering from the "we are in europe but we aren't" argument that the uk is going to need to get used to...



* please note, the term "non-standard" remains undefined as there is no "standard" definition.

 

[MikeK]

Standards are important, which is why I use my own. :mrgreen:

 

[Emstuv]

I didn't want to bring up the exit strategy..... yes you might end up in the same boat as us.

With regards to the saw, the standard/non-standard slots on the TS-200/250 is the one thing that deters me a little. To be able to add say UJK/Incra (take your pick) will involve some machining of the slots. That said, a branch of my company does have a rather large machineworkshop, so maybe a bottle of something might win them over to mill it out of the top. I do like the idea of the compact size and the induction motor to reduce the noise.

I might be leaning towards a DW745 which is a very capable say, but does have a 95dB output. By far the cheapest option.

The Festool CS50 does intrigue me. I do own a TS55R, the CMS is an option. It will require to be mounted as needed though.

The TS82 is still in, albeit more expensive/same price as a CMS-GE +the TS55 insert or the CS-50 EB.

 

[MikeJhn]

If you go the TS-200/TS-250 route and have the sliding side table option you don't need the mitre slots, the only time I have used them is when lining up the blade and thence the fence other than that I don't even know if the mitre gauge fits its on top of a cupboard, I think.

Mike

 

[memzey]

Interchangeability is no doubt a strength of the metric system. No argument there. Of course you can do the same with imperial but more mental arithmetic is required. In terms of familiarity; I’m 42 and went to school when the metric system was being heavily pushed and the imperial system was barely touched on. I have always found imperial measures to be more relevant and relatable when it comes to making. That may not be true for you as well but I strongly suspect I’m not alone.

As i said the argument is based on FAMILIARITY and TRADITION.

If you had been brought up on the wavelength of wet fart system i suggested above you would no doubt be arguing for that, as it would be the way you were conditioned to work.

The facts are very clear. the metric system is DESIGNED to allow units of measure of varying things to work together. the Imperial system is not.

I'm 49 and was brought up on imperial in the home and metric at school. I'm an engineer and i cannot for the life of me fathom how people are supposed to work in imperial for doing anything more than measuring something with a tape measure and weighing things on bathroom scales. You can use any unit you like to do those simple tasks - hell some very impressive things like cathedrals were built before standardised measures whether they be imperial or metric. But if you want to do anything more complicated then chose a measurement system

Anyway the wavelength of a wet fart is the same as the width of one *non-standard* mitre slot - simple.


I see norway is suffering from the "we are in europe but we aren't" argument that the uk is going to need to get used to...



* please note, the term "non-standard" remains undefined as there is no "standard" definition.

Not sure where my answer indicated either a previous familiarity or tradition of using the imperial system? I thought I pointed out quite the opposite in fact. As it turned out my further misadventures in making exposed a preference for use of imperial, without any heritage leading me towards that direction. I maintain that the imperial system is perfectly good for making things such as I and many others do. No doubt the metric system has its advantages but they are yet to make themselves apparent in my shed.

PS your repeated references to the wavelength of a wet fart actually reminds me of the standard definition of a metre - the one that was adopted after the French realised they had got their sums wrong as regards the distance from the North Pole to the centre of Paris!

 

[MikeJhn]

C'mon guys give it a rest now, the OP must be loosing the will to live, if you want to carry on discussing this may I suggest you move it to the General Forum and start a new thread.

And I don't need reminding that I started this.

Mike

 

[Bodgers]

I didn't want to bring up the exit strategy..... yes you might end up in the same boat as us.

With regards to the saw, the standard/non-standard slots on the TS-200/250 is the one thing that deters me a little. To be able to add say UJK/Incra (take your pick) will involve some machining of the slots. That said, a branch of my company does have a rather large machineworkshop, so maybe a bottle of something might win them over to mill it out of the top. I do like the idea of the compact size and the induction motor to reduce the noise.

I might be leaning towards a DW745 which is a very capable say, but does have a 95dB output. By far the cheapest option.

The Festool CS50 does intrigue me. I do own a TS55R, the CMS is an option. It will require to be mounted as needed though.

The TS82 is still in, albeit more expensive/same price as a CMS-GE +the TS55 insert or the CS-50 EB.

Maching the slots shouldn't be needed.

If you are into the pricey incra stuff, they also do mitre bars that adjust to the size of the slots...

I have just made my own cross cut sleds etc, and the slots aren't a problem.

 

[Bill Derr]

.
I might be leaning towards a DW745 which is a very capable say, but does have a 95dB output. By far the cheapest option.

Very happy with mine, admittedly mostly site use but has proven to be accurate - the fence is the best feature.