Squeaky stairs safe to put screws?

[Georget79]

Hi all,

I'm fixing some squeaky stairs and having watched some YouTube videos I think putting some screws in the end of the tread boards down into the riser seems the best option.

But I'm wary of what may be nearby, wires or pipes etc. I fixed some floorboards on the landing and there were lots of wires and pipes. I guess there won't be many on the stairs but don't want to take any risks.

I've attached a photo of where I intend to put the screws if anyone can advise if this is safe or what I can do to make sure its OK, would be much appreciated. Photo is step at end of landing, need to do same with another 3 or 4.

 

[Bingy man]

I would be very careful ️ of driving in screws ( blind ) as you just never no what you will hit -not just pipes cables etc but nails used in the construction of the stairs could deflect the screw you are driving into the stairs . Also it’s more likely that the squeak is coming from the sides or back of the risers and you may not solve the original problem. Have a look at the recent thread on wobbly stairs. For a good long term repair you are best accessing the stairs from underneath if possible as you can then see the true extent of any damage ,splits, or cracks and repair once .

 

[Jacob]

Yes not good place for screws. If they are taking any load the next thing could be tread nosing splitting off.
Look underneath as @Bingy man says. You might be able to tighten wedges, fit glue/screw blocks, or even a bearer down the middle.

 

[Georget79]

Yes not good place for screws. If they are taking any load the next thing could be tread nosing splitting off.
Look underneath as @Bingy man says. You might be able to tighten wedges, fit glue/screw blocks, or even a bearer down the middle.

Unfortunately can't look underneath, it's just the ceiling in the downstairs hall which I can't take off

 

[paulrbarnard]

If you can’t get at the back you might be able to put a pocket hole screw into the riser at the back of the step. It’s more likely to be squeaking at the back than the front. Not ideal but could be a fix.

 

[Georget79]

If you can’t get at the back you might be able to put a pocket hole screw into the riser at the back of the step. It’s more likely to be squeaking at the back than the front. Not ideal but could be a fix.

Where would the pocket hole screws go in this case? Not where I've drawn the arrows in the pic?

 

[Bingy man]

A mastic gun and a tube or two of liquid nails and literally force it into any gaps or joints . Cut the nozzle to the no nails tube as small as you can get away with at 45deg and take your time . I’d do this before risking any drilling or screwing and last thing at night or first thing in the morning so the stairs are not in use for as long as possible..

 

[paulrbarnard]

Where would the pocket hole screws go in this case? Not where I've drawn the arrows in the pic?

At the back of the step. Where the riser joins the tread. The opposite side of the tread from where your arrows are.

 

[Fergie 307]

I fixed mine from underneath by gluing heavy beads at the joints. If you can't get to the back then I would go with bingy man's suggestion, if the cracks are narrow use pva, if larger then no more nails.

 

[llywmog]

How about expanding glue like Gorilla brand? Original Gorilla Glue | Gorilla Glue

 

[toolsntat]

The squeak can generally be caused by pressure upon the tread pushing the loosened riser down within it's housing or components of the stairs moving against fixings used in assembly.

With absolutely no access to the underside you can improve the situation by, with due diligence, making the tread and riser as one with screws and the application of PU glue in it's groove.

The riser may be as little as 3/8" thick and will need great care in drilling the necessary pilot holes.

Clearance holes with countersinking is a must.

To get glue all along the the groove I use bar clamps in a spreading action from the underside of the nosing being glued and the tread/surface below. This lifts the tread enough to introduce sufficient glue through the clearance holes. Ideally you will get "squeeze out" along the whole width when screwed tight.
NO IMPACT DRIVER SHOULD BE USED IN THIS TYPE OF WORK, you need to "feel" the resistance involved in this process.

A troublesome problem may be encountered where the riser shows resistance to lifting tight with just the screws. After checking for and cutting through any fixings, this can be overcome by applying a couple of blocks to the front of the riser and levering up.

For the above reason a test screw up might be advised along with noting witnesses marks of the original position.

Don't over do the amount of fixings to avoid creating a weakened nosing, I usually use 4 on a domestic stairs.

Cheers, Andy

 

[Georget79]

A mastic gun and a tube or two of liquid nails and literally force it into any gaps or joints . Cut the nozzle to the no nails tube as small as you can get away with at 45deg and take your time . I’d do this before risking any drilling or screwing and last thing at night or first thing in the morning so the stairs are not in use for as long as possible..

Thanks, I will definitely look into this, along with other methods mentioned

 

[Georget79]

How about expanding glue like Gorilla brand? Original Gorilla Glue | Gorilla Glue

I actually bought some gorilla glue for this but haven't used it yet. Because I can't see any gaps that it would fit into, but may use clamps to lift up the nose a little as mentioned in other comments

 

[Georget79]

At the back of the step. Where the riser joins the tread. The opposite side of the tread from where your arrows are

The squeak can generally be caused by pressure upon the tread pushing the loosened riser down within it's housing or components of the stairs moving against fixings used in assembly.

With absolutely no access to the underside you can improve the situation by, with due diligence, making the tread and riser as one with screws and the application of PU glue in it's groove.

The riser may be as little as 3/8" thick and will need great care in drilling the necessary pilot holes.

Clearance holes with countersinking is a must.

To get glue all along the the groove I use bar clamps in a spreading motion from the underside of the nosing being glued and the tread/surface below. This lifts the tread enough to introduce sufficient glue through the clearance holes. Ideally you will get "squeeze out" along the whole width when screwed tight.
NO IMPACT DRIVER SHOULD BE USED IN THIS TYPE OF WORK, you need to "feel" the resistance involved in this process.

A troublesome problem may be encountered where the riser shows resistance to lifting tight with just the screws. After checking for and cutting through any fixings, this can be overcome by applying a couple of blocks to the front of the riser and levering up.

For the above reason a test screw up might be advised along with noting witnesses marks of the original position.

Don't over do the amount of fixings to avoid creating a weakened nosing, I usually use 4 on a domestic stairs.

Cheers, Andy

Thanks, the bar clamps sound good. There is actually a couple of steps I can access from the cupboard under the stair to measure width of riser, and I can see its 1.5cm thick so hopefully wide enough

 

[Doug71]

I renovated a staircase recently that had a few squeaks and movement between the treads and risers, the risers had dried out/shrunk over the years so they were no longer supporting the treads as they should.

Rather than screwing down into the riser (which often just pulls the middle of the tread down as the ends are fixed) I fastened a scotia mould under each bullnose, gluing and pinning it to the tread and riser. It seemed to sort the problem and made things feel much more solid.

 

[Georget79]

I renovated a staircase recently that had a few squeaks and movement between the treads and risers, the risers had dried out/shrunk over the years so they were no longer supporting the treads as they should.

Rather than screwing down into the riser (which often just pulls the middle of the tread down as the ends are fixed) I fastened a scotia mould under each bullnose, gluing and pinning it to the tread and riser. It seemed to sort the problem and made things feel much more solid.

View attachment 156962

Aha, so that's what those are. There were actually some of those already attached but I took them off. Maybe new ones would work better, or old ones fixed on tighter as they maybe came loose

 

[Doug71]

Aha, so that's what those are. There were actually some of those already attached but I took them off. Maybe new ones would work better, or old ones fixed on tighter as they maybe came loose

I think originally they were normally there just as a decorative feature but can be used to give a bit of extra support

 

[naughtymoose]

The squeak can generally be caused by pressure upon the tread pushing the loosened riser down within it's housing or components of the stairs moving against fixings used in assembly.

With absolutely no access to the underside you can improve the situation by, with due diligence, making the tread and riser as one with screws and the application of PU glue in it's groove.

The riser may be as little as 3/8" thick and will need great care in drilling the necessary pilot holes.

Clearance holes with countersinking is a must.

To get glue all along the the groove I use bar clamps in a spreading action from the underside of the nosing being glued and the tread/surface below. This lifts the tread enough to introduce sufficient glue through the clearance holes. Ideally you will get "squeeze out" along the whole width when screwed tight.
NO IMPACT DRIVER SHOULD BE USED IN THIS TYPE OF WORK, you need to "feel" the resistance involved in this process.

A troublesome problem may be encountered where the riser shows resistance to lifting tight with just the screws. After checking for and cutting through any fixings, this can be overcome by applying a couple of blocks to the front of the riser and levering up.

For the above reason a test screw up might be advised along with noting witnesses marks of the original position.

Don't over do the amount of fixings to avoid creating a weakened nosing, I usually use 4 on a domestic stairs.

Cheers, Andy

That's useful info. Cheers!