Sharpening Turning Tools: Options for the Beginner.

[miles_hot]

The tru-grind can also sharpen wood chisels, drills, carving tools etc ...
Can't tell you anything about the Sorby.. but thats what the tru-grind does :wink:

can it do plane irons and other more odd ball things like knives etc? I notice that one one site they were selling some platform which appeared to attach to the jig slide - might this help out with this sort of thing?

thanks

Miles

 

[Jenx]

Miles - this may help ----

http://www.philironswoodturning.co.uk/i ... &Itemid=69

Its from Phil Irons site / online shop ...

I e-mailed him a couple of questions about it, when going through the process of buying... he was back with full answers within an hour.

I can't say about plane irons etc, as it wasn't something I needed to find out about... but Phil will know straight off.

I thought Plane irons were for the domain of the oilstone & hones .. but I don't use them, so I'm really not sure


HTH , Jenx.

 

[miles_hot]

Miles - this may help ----

http://www.philironswoodturning.co.uk/i ... &Itemid=69

Its from Phil Irons site / online shop ...

I e-mailed him a couple of questions about it, when going through the process of buying... he was back with full answers within an hour.

I can't say about plane irons etc, as it wasn't something I needed to find out about... but Phil will know straight off.

I thought Plane irons were for the domain of the oilstone & hones .. but I don't use them, so I'm really not sure


HTH , Jenx.

Good call - I got s wrapped up in finding out what people thought I forgot to ask the supplier about the capabilities!

Thanks

Miles

 

[user 5053]

Never used any grinding jigs prefering to sharpen freehand. Time is money and feel these things are aimed at the hobby end rather than the serious turning fraternity.

 

[wizer]

I know I'm wasting my time here. But what part of the serious turning fraternity are you from Soulfly? What sort of work do you do?

 

[Jenx]

"Time isn't Money" to me laddie ...
Time is leisure where my turning's concerned.


I''ve neither the aspiration, ability or desire to make a penny from what I do ... I don't expect to make money from my motorcycle, from my guitars, or from my fishing.... and the turning is no different for me, and I suspect many like me.

Just a small question for you ....
would you know what a bit of wood was, if it jumped up and bit you in the Ar5e ?

I strongly suspect not
( and I don't reckon I'd be alone in that either)

 

[TEP]

I don't like getting in on this bickering, and you may prefer to sharpen free hand Soulfly, and long may your wheel turn. But MANY registered turners on the demonstration circuit use a jig. As do many who man the stands at the shows around the country. Many of these jigs are home made, but more seem to use a jig for sharpening than not IME.

 

[Richard Findley]

Hi Wizer,

I use a veritas grinding platform like this:

It's about £35 from Axminster. With this you can grind ANYTHING!

I bought this before I bought Kieth Rowley's book so I hadn't seen his platform. I have since made one for our club grinder. As you have the kit Wizer, you wouldn't have anything to lose (except an hour or so and a few nuts and bolts) in having a go at making one. I could probably scan the picture from the book and email it over if for some reason you haven't bought his book yet.

The main reasons I use this method over a jig are:

a) I'm a woodturner and so by nature a little tight so 100 odd quid for a jig seemed a bit steep

b) with my joinery background I was pretty confident with a grinder already so kind of taught myself to use it

As for Mr Soulfly's comment, I'm not sure how valid it is. I know of a number of highly regarded pro's that use jigs or Tormeks, most say it's because of the repeatability of a jig (Jimmy Clewes) and others of the razor sharpness of the Tormek (article by Dave Register)

Personally I'm not convinced you need turning tools to be as sharp as a Tormek can make them but if you've got one I see no reason not to use it.

Sorry to go on, but you did ask!!

Cheers,

Richard

 

[wizer]

Thanks for this Richard. I do have a copy of Rowley's book and have seen the platform your talking about. As yet I'm still not completely decided which method I'm going to use. Funds are limited, so it probably will be grinder and jig to begin with. As Jenx was intimating, most of us are hobbiests, so if a jig saves us time and we are happy to spend the money on one, then I don't feel bad about buying/using one. I have no intention to turn for a living, I doubt i'd ever be good enough. I'll leave that to the professional turning fraternity.

 

[Anonymous]

Wizer you seem to have sussed out the likely best bits within your current budget... try before you buy

the professional/amateur sharpening debate goes on ... and on... and is largely irrelevant unless one enjoys trolling :lol:
If you're ever in my neck of the woods I'd be happy to show you the simple way of sharpening that works for me...
(that offer is open to anyone on this forum :!: )

 

[glenn lucas]

Hi all,
In my own business I only sharpen free hand as it is the most flexible way to get exactly the grind I want. Practice is what it takes to get it right.
I personally get frustrated with grinding jigs because of their limitations and I never get exactly what I want.
However I would recommend the use of a grinding jig to anyone who cannot perfect the tool grind because if you don't have a good edge you can not make fine work.
In my classes I have the tru grind grinding jig for students which also takes a bit of practice but it allows each person to keep the profile on the tool and cut cleanly when used correctly.
In short get a jig if you have a problem sharpening.
There is a lot of choice on the market.
My preference would be for the woodcut or Oneway systems.

I hope this is of some help.

Regards,

Glenn

 

[big soft moose]

Never used any grinding jigs prefering to sharpen freehand. Time is money and feel these things are aimed at the hobby end rather than the serious turning fraternity.

someone should tell dave register and keith rowley (and numerous others) presumably they arent part of the serious turning fraternity either :roll:

IME a true pro will use anything that makes the job easier and faster - time being money and all some use rests some dont, but there is no need to disparage those who do

 

[wizer]

Cheers Graham that's a kind offer.

Whilst I wanted this info for myself I also wanted it to be a resource for future turners. Something that can be referred to when the next newbie says "How do I sharpen this tool". I think it's achieved a good balance of replies.

 

[big soft moose]

I know I'm wasting my time here. But what part of the serious turning fraternity are you from Soulfly? What sort of work do you do?

now now tom , we already know that hes from the very creme de la creme of the serious turning fraternity, up in the stratosphere whose work is too perfect to be shown to the eyes of meer mortals such as us. :roll:

 

[big soft moose]

Wizer - my first 18 months as a turner i used a cheap chiawanese thing (10 quid from b&poo), with the keith rowley platform, but the wheels were so narrow that it was difficult to roll a large gouge across them.

I looked at buying some wide wheels from axi but by the time i added the cost of these together it would have been cheaper to just buy the wide wheel grinder from them.

which was what i was going to do , until i spotted a second hand cruesen for sale on here and bought that instead.

( If money is really tight it is possible to just sharpen with a diamond slip stone, but if you are going to do any ammount of turning I'd strongly reccomend getting a wide wheel grinder - it will be money well spent in the long run.)

 

[PowerTool]

I sharpen freehand on a wide-wheel grinder,and have a couple of diamond files for honing.Skews get done on a diamond stone or an ordinary oilstone.
It's horses for courses - suits me,but that doesn't make it right or wrong :wink:


Andrew

 

[miles_hot]

the razor sharpness of the Tormek (article by Dave Register)

Personally I'm not convinced you need turning tools to be as sharp as a Tormek can make them but if you've got one I see no reason not to use it.

Richard

Do you feel that the tormek gets tools sharper that other systems (e.g. jigs on slow speed wheels)?

Many thanks

Miles

 

[TEP]

Sharpening has always been a controversial subject with woodturners!

My experience is that IF you only wish to sharpen for turning, a bench grinder is more than enough. BUT it must have a decent wheel. I tend to use white/pink stones, a 100 and a 60 grit, but as the 100 wears down I have been looking for another and as yet I have not found any, they all seem to stop at 60 grit.

The benefits of a slow/half speed bench grinder are such that as a learner it gives you more time on the stone before over heating, but I think this small benefit is outweighed by the cost of such machines. Especially as all it takes is a little practice and you won't burn the tool anyway.

Slow wet grinders such as the Tormek are great tools but IMO not for woodturning, I base this on the fact that as much as it is nice to have the sharpest edge possible, it just doesn't last long when you have the surface of a piece of timber passing it at yards per second in some cases. The Tormek will give a sharper edge than a grinder, and if you posses one, great I would use it, but they are very expensive to buy just for turning.

Another of the great failings of beginner woodturners is that they don't sharpen their tools often enough. I watch folks at a club I go to and they will turn for a couple of hours and never approach the grinder. When working at home I know within a few minutes how often I will need to redress the tool while working on a certain piece of wood. You should never sharpen when the tool is blunt, you always sharpen the tool before it gets blunt. Even if it means going to the grinder every 10 minutes. Then ALWAYS sharpen before doing the last cut, that way you are getting the best surface possible from the tool.

I used to sharpen all my tools free hand, on a flat platform (aka K Rowley) but after watching Jimmy Clewes, Mick Hanbury and the like I now sharpen my gouges using a jig. I still sharpen all my other tools on the flat platform, but my 3/8" and upwards bowl gouges, and my spindle gouges are all done on a jig.

SO IMO if you are a turner and cost concious a bench grinder is fine, if you have the money buy the best but I don't think your turning will benefit. As with all things in life nothing is that easy and all hobbies need a little patience and perseverance when learning a skill. I'm sorry to say it is not something you can buy.

On this note I will finish, but if anyone is really struggling and wants a bit of help with their sharpening, or anything else. (turning only :twisted: ) Get in touch and we could maybe arrange to spend an afternoon going over bits were you think you are struggling. As with all turners, my way is the best way O so I can only show you how I do it.

 

[mikec]

Just to add my 2p worth.

In support of Teps comments about sharpening often enough, I was in that situation until recently when I decided to give all my tools a sharpen. Scrapers that I thought were more than sharp enough now shear scrape beautifully and skew chisels produce the finest hairs of shavings.

I thought all my tools were adequately sharp, even touched them up with a diamond file, but one session with a grinder, (Record 8" with wide white wheel, Sorby jig) proved otherwise.

I'm now trying to work out how I can have the grinder near the lathe :?

Regards,

Mike C

 

[Mark Hancock]

I've been following this thread with interest as I'm in the process of assessing the Tormek system having attended a very informative demo of it recently. Very interested to see George's comment about the use of both dry grinding and the Tormek. That's the way I'm thinking at present.

When training 20 years ago I was taught to grind freehand on a dry grinder. Since then we've had the introduction of the Celtic/Irish/Swept Back/Long Grind/Ellesworth/Fingernail grind which the majority of professionals use in it's many forms. I only know of 2 very well respected international turners who are able to sharpen this freehand. Consequently I don't believe the comment that the jigs available are aimed at hobby turners and not the "serious turning fraternity". That's certainly not my experience over the past 10 years.

For the beginner because of the cost implication of the Tormek system (about £500) I would suggest a good dry grinder with a wide wheel at least 1 inch, good grinding stones and a jig.

EDIT: I was responding to a PM and now have just seen Glenn's comment. That's 3 well respected international turners