Selling one-off pieces?

[Matt_S]

Ebay isnt generally good for selling crafted items such as this IMHO

Byron, have you looked at the etsy link I posted?

The format is one you could copy for furniturte. You wouldn't hold stock, like ebay in that it would just be a platfor to display picks. Etsy allows for you to show quantities of one item, temporarily remove if you are off to a show and lots more.

 

[ByronBlack]

Matt

I agree, ebay isn't the place to sell quality crafts, as ebay is basically there for bargain, I dont believe people would happily buy an expensive piece thats been handcrafted unless it was from a very prominent brand. Although having an ebay shop is a good way of gathering interest into the real website, even if ebay is used to sell the cheaper stuff as already mentioned like small turned items.

I've been looking at the etsy site for the last few mins or so, and think the model is an ideal one for this idea. The only problems I have with it though are the pricing and shipping.

I'm assuming the pricing is set by the maker, which is fine, but I noticed that some items were rediculous prices, for example $120 for some sandels!! while other products were quite cheap for example the 'city table'. I think there needs to be more consistent pricing in terms of time/materials and quality.

The second issue of the shipping, is that on etsy the buyer has to pick up (if the item is large - although this depends on the sellers willingness to pack and post). In teh states you can get away with it as each state has a large population, whereas here in the UK, someone from say Newcastle is unlikely to travel to Dorset to pick up a chair or a chest of drawers, so somewhere and somehow we're going to need to have a consistent delivery policy..

 

[Adam]

Adam/Rob, there would be no problem with a quality website. It's what I used to do for a living, and one area where i'm most skilled.

Keep the idea's coming fella's, I can feel something happening in my water!

How would the transaction in terms of holding of stock be done though? Say for example I set something up and display/sell items from you lot, do you ship the item, or do we have a central area to hold all items until sold?

I would suggest a commission based approach would be easiest. You do (IMHO) not want to get involved in the actual deal as are you liable, do you have insurance etc etc. Non delivery, post sale support (e.g. splits etc due to manufacturing / design faults.

You simply "front" a introduction between buyer and seller.

Storing things (imagine a large table or cabinet) would be a nightmare. Even if you had a garage - what happens if the roof leaks! A rat/mouse got in etc etc.

Adam

 

[Matt_S]

I think you're right about consistency on posting, on products its maybe a bit more down to the individual

Postage/delivery could be a sellers decision do they say pick up only or offer postage? The buyers could look and decide if pick up only if they would go that far. Admittedly posting a sideboard would not be appropriate but this seems to be something which cannot be got round if this is to stay as a small platform for forum members?

 

[ByronBlack]

Some good points there Adam,

I think maybe then just having a delivery 'policy' that all sellers agree with before listing their items is perhaps the way to go.

Also you are right in terms of liability. If there's a problem with the piece - say a table leg falls off (not saying it would, just an example) then the buyer can deal directly with the maker to sort out the situation.

Which brings to my next questions: returns - becuase wood is a natural medium, i guess we would have to make the buyer understand certain things, such as; how to care for the wood, wood movement and where not to store it (on top of a radiator, or in a damp room etc..) and the natural changes of tone of the piece - the reason why I think this is important is that so much crap is bought from Ikea that is made out of veneers and man made stuff that doesn't share the same attributes of solid wood so I'm not sure how many would be aware of basic 'care and maintenance' issues.

Matt - I'm thiking for larger pieces such as a sideboard could be sent via insured couriers, it might be possible to get an account with a trusted courier firm to handle this side of things, the maker only then has to pack the item.

 

[motownmartin]

Byron, a very interesting thread and one that might open up avenues for the amatuer woodworker, I think Adam is right and you have to be careful and a website/shop would have to be run very much like ebay with the seller taking responsibility for posting and quality, the webmaster would have to take a commision but would also have to vet any seller for the sake of the shop.

Ebay has come up a few times in this discussion, and I think this is not the place to sell hand crafted furniture or any hand crafted items, a friend of mine tried to sell some stuff and made a loss, so next time he put a reserve on it and nobody was interested.

If I was looking to buy Quality stuff then I wouldn't look on ebay, but I would search the internet only to be unsure of what it really looked like and if the quality was good, the place that i would buy from would be a craft fair.

To summarize, a quality website/shop that would guarantee quality products, you have to give it a go Byron.

 

[ByronBlack]

If I set something like this up, would sellers be happy to haul their behinds to various shows/events to share the costs of setting up a stall/tent?

 

[Bodrighy]

How would the transaction in terms of holding of stock be done though? Say for example I set something up and display/sell items from you lot, do you ship the item, or do we have a central area to hold all items until sold?

If you have a central area you are in effect double transport costs. If you were acting as an agent for various craftsmen who would be responsible for package and post the buyer could have direct contact with the maker regarding any problems etc.
The need for aftercare is a valid one. I have found that with turned items placing a natural wood piece in a modern house with dry cenrally heated air can quickly cause problems if not treated properly. This would be something that presumably would need to be spelt out prior to purchase possibly on the web site.

Pete

 

[motownmartin]

If I set something like this up, would sellers be happy to haul their behinds to various shows/events to share the costs of setting up a stall/tent?

If it's limited to furniture, No, but if you were looking to show other items such as jewellry boxes, mirrors, ornaments and turnings then there would be more interest, it has certainly got me interested but then I work stupid shifts that take up most of my weekends.

 

[Bodrighy]

I also feel that there would be a lot of interest if it is for natural wood raft and not just furniture. Not all of us are as gifted as you and in any case a stall or tent that is designed to display quality wood work would allow a wide variety of different things to be on display. Specialised stalls e.g. furniture, turning, boxes etc would only attract people who are intereste in those specific things. Display wise you could virtually have a room set up, say a bedroom with all quality things including furniture, dressing tasblke accessories etc.

This whole idea is infectious :lol: I am supposed to be working here.

Pete

 

[patl]

Well, I can't speak of selling wood at a craft fair, but my wife has made jewellery as a hobby for many years and we've spent a couple of years on the craft fair circuit with it and the closest we came to making money was breaking even at 1 (out of around 30) craft fair.
My experience of craft fairs is that they're better as a shop front for the slightly unusual, I've seen turners, potters and chair caners get a lot of interest and leave with a lot of potential commissions because they're demonstrating their art. But I rarely see anyone actually sell very much (unless they're selling something child friendly and relatively cheap ('mum, can I have one of those')).
Surprisingly, most of my wife's sales come from ebay, ok, she's not going to make a living from it but there are plenty of people there who are willing to buy what they like, rather than just buy cheap indian silver. Its also noticable how much more quickly her gold jewellery sells (there aren't as many people making affordable gold jewellery) than her silver stuff.
As far as website sales are concerned, I'm not sure there have ever been any, other than repeat business and people driven there via ebay, but then I've always thought part of the reason for that is that the joy of buying craft is of knowing something about the person that made it (and there is, to me, something slightly more personal about an ebay transaction, than a website), as soon as its commercialised, I might just as well buy cheap and cheerful.
I don't know if/whether any of the above translates into wood though...

 

[ByronBlack]

patl - thats some great feedback, much appreciated!

I agree 100% about the personality aspect. I think if I were to do this, I would make a feature of each of the makers, with a bio, some pictures, in-progress shots etc.. I believe that would be one of the unique attributes of such a venture and give a potential buyer more of a connection with the piece.

 

[devonwoody]

I think the only way anyone makes a bomb or a living is to use or have a seller.
I'm thinking, the person who is already set up in business as a home designer.
Like that .......... with the long shirt sleeves on that TV program.
There are lots of home designers in the high end of the market and they most probably have a supplier base that needs breaking into.

 

[ByronBlack]

Good point DW, interior designers would certainly be an outlet..

But keep in mind, I'm not thinkig of this as away to make mega bucks nor having a living of it, just simply a means to help fund a hobby and maybe make a little money on the side to invest back in for timber and tools etc.. anything else on top would be a bonus. I think as soon as it becomes a 'business' there are too many pressures involved and it soon becomes a burden rather a hobby..

I would like to do this for myself and maybe give other makers an chance to showcase and maybe sell a few one off's, I like all the idea's and input so far so keep it coming!

 

[Woodmagnet]

B.B. very interesting. =D>

 

[Bodrighy]

If you have the skill to create a proffessional looking website, there are enough really skilled caftsmen on here to provide one off items varying from boxes to gazebos plus the things made by the turners and scrollers, what you would have is a display of top quality craftwork at it's best. The problem as I see it is how to get the idea publicised. There seems little point in advertising in craft fairs, woodwork magazines etc as it is taking coals to Newcastle. (come to think of it you don't get coal from Newcastle any more do you?) You know what I mean. The people you would need to reach are those who want hand made crafted items. How do you reach them?

Pete

 

[ByronBlack]

I did a little research today in the local ASDA at their magazine isle. It seems there are quite a lot of 'country home' and 'interior design' magazines available, I think they would be ideal to publicise in.. i'll need to think more on this.

What about the commision issue, how best to handle that? I don't like the idea of having the buyer paying for it up front, me taking out the commision and then paying the maker - too many steps involved and too much admin, but the other way means trusting the maker to hand over the percentage of commision when they receive payment from the buyer.. I'll have to sleep on that one..

 

[mr]

What about the commision issue, how best to handle that? I don't like the idea of having the buyer paying for it up front, me taking out the commision and then paying the maker - too many steps involved and too much admin, but the other way means trusting the maker to hand over the percentage of commision when they receive payment from the buyer.. I'll have to sleep on that one..

As the business owner you have to handle the payment the only other possibility that I can see at the moment is to use an escrow service, which adds further (unwanted IMHO) complexity. But regardless it's a bit of a mistake to think that there's nowhere for small makers to exhibit and sell. It's not easy but there are routes to market.

Cheers Mike

 

[ByronBlack]

But regardless it's a bit of a mistake to think that there's nowhere for small makers to exhibit and sell. It's not easy but there are routes to market.

Cheers Mike

Do you have some idea's regarding these routes? I would love to know more!

 

[Sgian Dubh]

ebay doesn't work. Tried it. Waste of time and effort.

People don't buy high quality one-off furniture off a website, especially if you have no recognition as an artist, designer, maker. But they might buy a piece seen on a wbsite if they get to see it in person, or they might ask you to build something.

Galleries generate occasional sales but, more importantly, if they are a good gallery they can and do generate orders--- your speculative pieces have to be considered as adverts that you might even work on for several weeks, plus the cost of the materials which can get into the 100's of pounds. That's a lot of investment for a small business.

Be wary of galleries because bad ones treat your furniture as display stands for the crap produced by other 'artists'. They damage your table and cabinet tops by putting scratchy bottomed pots from the other 'artists' on them and slide them about until they look right. Then the gallery phones you and tells you you need to remove your piece of work because the tops damaged and it looks unsightly. I had one gallery that crammed so much crapola on one of my pieces that it was almost completely hidden. Gallery visitors didn't realise there was a piece of exhibition furniture 'on display' underneath all the junk.

Exhibitions at the right locations quite often do generate sales and also sometimes generate commissions. The wrong location for high end furniture is craft fairs, agricultural shows, etc, where you're competing with impulse buy tat like crudely turned £5- £10 wooden knick-knacks, £5 earrings made out of monkey metal, wooden noddy toys, bark covered bird boxes and other gee-gaws.

The right location for exhibitions are art/3D/product galleries, upper market auctioneer showrooms as an adjunct to a forthcoming sale of art/furniture, and some sympathetic businesses that like to sponsor art events in their reception areas, eg, banks, insurance companies, etc. Slainte.