sash clamps, dakota or irwin record? + regarding rutlands

[J_SAMa]

hi all,

im about to build myself a workbench, and of course gluing up large projects like this one requires a couple of sash clamps.
ive heard a lot of good things about RECORD clamps, but im not sure if they were referring to the old record ones or new IRWIN ones (afaik many products have gone worse after the companies behind them were accquired by irwin). so please give your opinion on them if youve used them. they are quite expensive so i dont want to take a gamble that may or may not pay off...
i stumbled across some dakota clamps on rutlands the other day, and i simply cant resist their prices:

these ones have steel bars and small jaws:
http://www.rutlands.co.uk/hand-tools/cl ... ash-clamps

these ones have aluminum bars and large jaws
http://www.rutlands.co.uk/hand-tools/cl ... -duty-jaws

im worried about the quality because of their prices, the discount is huge (just under 60% off for the steel bar ones), in my opinion way too huge... so id like to ask for your opinion on these clamps if youve bought any of them, and tell me the custom service and crediblity of rutlands if you can. i heard rutlands is similar to fine-tools, as in all the tools sold on fine-tools are well selected and you cant really go wrong with things purchased on it. is it true, is it safe for me to buy whatever i want on rutlands without wasting my money?

Sam

 

[neilyweely]

Hi
I have some old record sash clamps which are excellent. And I have some new ones, which whilst not being quite so good are still excellent. (mine are the T-bar ones, the new ones, and the plain steel bars for the old ones).
I also have some alu ones, which I use far more than I thought I would; I use them for quite heavy clamping, which they are not really meant for, and to be fair they lasted quite well. There were four, now there are three. I guess I should have used the steel ones but the alu ones live in the WS whereas the steel ones live kinda next door in the 'store room'. Theres just too many of 'em to bring 'em all in the WS - someone once told me you can never have too many clamps. Yeah, thanks for that. :roll:
Rutlands have a bit of a perpetual sale on, so don't feel hurried into buying them now 'cos they'll probly be on 'sale' next week too. If not those ones then another just as good. Its a bit of a marketing gimmick for them; I think they think we will all think (wow, did you get that) YAY, we must rush out NOW and buy those. Some of us do. I did once, never again. But thats a different story.
If I was going to buy anymore clamps I would search ebay for used sash clamps in my area and stick to those. Just my 2p.

Hope this helps. I guess I am saying it depends what you are going to use them for. The steel ones are for heavy clamping, the alu ones for less so.

Neil

ps -I run the risk of ridicule for this but I id buy some T-bar ash clamps from silverline, which it has to be said are still going strong, very cheap too. Then you could consider the Axminster parallel jaw f-clamps, which I think were very good. As good as my Bessey versions. But I am not sure they sell them anymore, at least not the same ones.

 

[Bradshaw Joinery]

I bought two packs of four t-bar clamps from rutlands when they introduced them, ther were £60 for four. quality is good. some of them have a slight sideways bend in them...... to make them better. i had to replace the chains with some heavier guage to tether the pins (kept falling off) and also gring the inserts to fit properly so the threads screwed in and out properly. but for £15 each they are great clamps, and will last a lifetime now.... basically i think there seconds from the record production line..... ie not quite met the tolerances.

 

[Webby]

i got mine from Screwfix and have to say so far they are doing what i want them to do

Dave

 

[Mike.S]

I bought the steel ones from Rutlands a few months ago (same 'sale' price i.e. £10 each) and have used them regularly since.

As might be expected - given the price - they are not without fault! Overall, they are of solid construction and I've had no problems at all with their robustness and clamping action e.g. smooth clamping action. The weakness is with the jaws: none were square. By that I mean the jaws are convex from side- to-side and not at right angles to the steel bar (they grip at the bottom - nearest the bar - and leave a 0.5-1mm gap at the jaw tip). My simple work around was to use pieces of scrap wood as cauls. I'm sure this would be a faff for frequent/professional use but for DIY use it was fine.

Longer term I may grind them flat/square or, more likely, epoxy small hardwood pieces to the clamp faces in order to have a square face.

On the other part of your question I've used Rutlands several times and had good service. As others have mentioned, do wait for their regular sales - 'normal' prices aren't the most competitive.

 

[J_SAMa]

well it seems that dakota clamps just don't cut it
what clamps would you oldies recommend? im just a beginner but i really dont wanna deal with unsquare clamps

 

[Paul Chapman]

I have found the ones made by Record Power are very good http://www.recordpower.co.uk/category/sash-clamps

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[neilyweely]

SAMa
Not sure why you'd say the dakota ones don't cut it, from the entries on this thread I think they have been universally rated as good for the money. As with anything like this there will be good and not so good from the same factory - thats just the way it goes. But i think the point is that as long as you don't expect engineering precision they are pretty good.
The Rutlands clamps ARE the Dakota ones, just in case you've misunderstood. Dakota are sold in the UK pretty much exclusively by Rutlands; they may even be their brand name, not sure. However I too think they are pretty good. I used 8 or 9 sash clamps last night to put a biscuited oak table top together and there were 3 or 4 record and the rest were a mix of dakota and silverline. I had no need to make sure the records were in any particular position, in other words for this job they were all much of a muchness.
HTH
Neil

 

[J_SAMa]

SAMa
Not sure why you'd say the dakota ones don't cut it, from the entries on this thread I think they have been universally rated as good for the money. As with anything like this there will be good and not so good from the same factory - thats just the way it goes. But i think the point is that as long as you don't expect engineering precision they are pretty good.
The Rutlands clamps ARE the Dakota ones, just in case you've misunderstood. Dakota are sold in the UK pretty much exclusively by Rutlands; they may even be their brand name, not sure. However I too think they are pretty good. I used 8 or 9 sash clamps last night to put a biscuited oak table top together and there were 3 or 4 record and the rest were a mix of dakota and silverline. I had no need to make sure the records were in any particular position, in other words for this job they were all much of a muchness.
HTH
Neil

Hi Neil,
well, i just didnt want to buy something that might or might not be perfectly straight... i dont like taking risks 8)
but since most people arent having major problems with them, i think i might give them a try...
so, yep, the final decision is the steel ones.

Sam

 

[neilyweely]

i was readin the other day about the law of diminishing returns, and I think this applies here. The rutlands ones are not as good as Bessey, and maybe not quite as good as record. But are the Bessey clamps three times as good? It depends what you are going to use them for; I use mine for mostly pulling panels together, when biscuited and glued, and they are perfect for this. I don't think the Besseys could really do any better. I am aware that I should not need to use a strong clamp to pull planks together into a board; my jointing should be good enough to get by with just a light duty clamp, but am I really the only one who turns the clamp with all his might to get squeeze out the whole way along the edge? i doubt it.
I have an old ship clamp that is a type of sash-ish clamp, it is id'd in Salaman and it is for pulling the bow of the boat around the timber frame, so these clamps have historically been used for HD work. Makes me feel better anyway. :wink:
So, I guess the real question is are they going to suffice? If so then I think you should go for them; you will be fair pleased with them I think. I have made some fairly precise, cabinety projects with mine and they have ALLbeen fine, so.......

All this being said I hope you DO like them; I'll be off if you don't!! :?

Thanks

Neil

 

[gwd]

Hi,
I've got some Silverline, old Record and some new Marple sash clamps. The Silverline do the job but are not as square or work as smoothly as the Record or Marples ones. I'd recommend buying some old Record clamps from a car boot sale or ebay.

Geoff

 

[Triggaaar]

22 clamps purchased :shock:

Rutland:
10 6" G clamps
6 54" sash = £100
I managed to turn it down, until the 10% offer turned up, then I gave in. That's a lot of clamping for £90.

I've also bought some Axminster axe-pandandable sash cramps (£9 each for 36", £10 each for 48").

I don't expect them to be very good, but assuming they don't break, that's pretty cheap for a lot of clamping.

 

[Webby]

Clamp away :wink:

 

[Derek S]

I have http://www.rutlands.co.uk/hand-tools/cl ... -duty-jaws and i do not rate them very highly at all infact i'm replacing the full set for some sash clamps possibly the record power range as they seem relatively good value i was considering the set of 6 from rutlands but i'm a bit hesitant based on the quality of the ones posted above.