Sand, plane or scrape?

[Anonymous]

Well, as i was working on the tail vice for the new bench This evening, i was using a cabinet scraper to square the edges of the recess and wondered about members' preferences for finishing.

Do you tend to use sandpaper to finish your work before applying the finish? I often give detail sections a hand-sand but prefer to avoid it wherever possible

Or, do you prefer to leave the planing as the last stage? I certainly do and love the 'glow' one gets from the wood after a Sharp plane has run over it. This is the way I complete most projects but sometimes I am forced to sand

Or maybe you power sand? YUK!!!!!!

Or maybe you like to finish with a card scraper? I really only use a card scraper as a cutting tool where a plane can't get in or the grain is so tough that the plane can't deal with it.

So what do you do? When and why?

 

[johnnyb]

i usually sand with a random orbit. i have an enormous vac that once connected means it is noisy but dust free and very quick with the vac on i can practically stick it to vertical surfaces such is the vacuum i had to make an adaptor with mini gutter downpipe and a heat gun...outstanding . i also sand finishes with this a 150mm dewalt ros, with a different type of disc. i have other sanders belt orbital etc but usually use the ros because of the extraction efficiency.

 

[Fecn]

I'm a power sanding man myself. Never used a cabinet scraper, and haven't used a hand plane since school - the planes they had at school never inspired me to buy my own ones.

 

[MIGNAL]

Sanding is a last resort for me. Plane or card scraper, tends to be a quicker way of finishing as well.

 

[Paul Chapman]

I hate sanding. However, sometimes it can't be avoided. I use an Elu orbital sander which is very effective and I've had it for years. Has a nice hole-punching gadget so I don't have to buy expensive, pre-punched papers and I can use a wider range of abrasives. Often I hand sand because that's less messy and more precise. However, last year I bought a Veritas cabinet scraper and I'm hoping that will lead to less sanding. I'm also considering a scraper plane. Whenever possible I prefer the finish left by a well-honed plane.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[garywayne]

Hi Tony.

Although I don't have a work shop up and running, and I do very little woodwork in my dinning room, I was taught by an ex Barnsley craftsman, and read a lot.

I was told that as long as your plane is honed correctly you shouldn't have the need to sand before finishing.

If one uses mechanical planers the stock will still need to be worked because rotary blades leave a scalloped effect on the stock which needs to be taken out either by hand planing or sanding. Again, If one uses a ROS which causes circular scratches on the stock and goes across the grain you still have to finish by hand sanding with the grain.

 

[Anonymous]

I However, last year I bought a Veritas cabinet scraper and I'm hoping that will lead to less sanding. I'm also considering a scraper plane.

Paul

Good point Paul. I forgot to mention that I also use a scraper plane quite a lot - anything that has a flat top usually meets with the scraper plane as the final finishing tool.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Tony.

Although I don't have a work shop up and running, and I do very little woodwork in my dinning room, I was taught by an ex Barnsley craftsman, and read a lot.

I was told that as long as your plane is honed correctly you shouldn't have the need to sand before finishing.

If one uses mechanical planers the stock will still need to be worked because rotary blades leave a scalloped effect on the stock which needs to be taken out either by hand planing or sanding. Again, If one uses a ROS which causes circular scratches on the stock and goes across the grain you still have to finish by hand sanding with the grain.

Hi Gary

Yes, that is one reason why I choose not to sand with powered sanders whenever I can avoid it. A peice of 3M sandlblaster paper wrapped around a block of wood cuts really quickly and precisely along the grain and lasts for ages (about 5-6 times normal sand paper - costs more though)

As you might have seen from my WIP posts here from time to time, I always hand plane after the thickness planer or the jointer - those macine marks look awful on a finished piece :?

 

[woodbloke]

I usually finish with a light scrape and then light hand sanding down to about 320g though oak is left at 150g as its open grained. Allot of the problems and frustrations of hand sanding come down to using poor quality paper - the stuff I use at the moment from 3M is superb.....problem is, I'm starting to run out - Rob

 

[Dad]

Final finishing is usually sanding with a cork block & a little bit of elbow grease.

I find this stage helps lower the old blood pressure after listening to a variety of (brush) motors clattering away for hours...

 

[Evergreen]

Tony

I just finish off with a minimum of scaping and sanding by hand. It's easy for me because I only do small projects these days. I share Rob's views on the importance of high quality abrasive paper. I used to soldier on with tatty bits of nondescript sandpaper for too long. Not any more.

Regards.

 

[Jez]

id like to scrape but i just can't seem to get the cards right.

i bought a pair of LN scrapers but i didn't buy a burnisher and i asked my lecturer at collage how to burnish them as id never done it before and he used a screw driver shaft and it created a slight burr, but when i try to scrape i have to get it at a lower angle than 45 to get it to do anything, and then it just digs in to the wood.

I don't know if this method of burnishing is bad, or its me :x

but i tend to hand sand since i just cant get it right !
and i dont own any planes..

 

[pidgeonpost]

I normally try and clean up first with a finely set plane, then - especially on any areas where the grain doesn't want to play - I then get straight on with a scraper, followed by hand sanding from 180 grit onwards. I have used a random orbit sander on large areas, but usually it's hand sanding all the way. Most of the stuff I make is small enough so I don't go off my trolley doing it this way.

 

[dedee]

Ever since I was shown how to sharpen a card scraper properly, by Chris, I have used them for final pre-finish finishing. But that is only about 2 projects so I'm no expert. The 50 scraper plane is also used and was used extensively on last years chisel cabinet.

I've only ever used them on oak, beech & walnut BTW,

Andy

 

[Anonymous]

I alwauys think that wood likes to be cut cleanly not ripped to shreds hence my preference for a fine set ECE reform smoothing plane or even a block plane for fine finish cuts, reading the grain as carefully as I can and trying to focus and concentrate to avoid "rubbing the cats hair the wrong way". If theres very wild grain I'm quite happy to use varuious home made scraper's to deal with a awkward spot even if it takes a while. I use sandpaper as little as poss, (I hate the shrieking hissing sound) but if I DO have to especially for something that will be finished with primer/undercoat/gloss etc, I use mirka or 3m, no crappy chinease imports for me. I use scothcbrite pad's to rub down betwen staining's and oilings (danish etc) on chair's

 

[woodbloke]

Jez - the main thing to have with a card scraper is a square edge. File the edge square with a small 6" fine file and use (if you haven't got a burnisher) the back of a half round file where there isn't any teeth to make a burr on each edge of the steel. Place the scraper upright in a mechanics vice and place the burnisher horizontal with about a 10 deg slope to one side on it. Three or four strokes should produce a burr that you can feel with your finger nail - Rob

 

[Paul Chapman]

id like to scrape but i just can't seem to get the cards right.

i bought a pair of LN scrapers but i didn't buy a burnisher and i asked my lecturer at collage how to burnish them as id never done it before and he used a screw driver shaft and it created a slight burr, but when i try to scrape i have to get it at a lower angle than 45 to get it to do anything, and then it just digs in to the wood.

I don't know if this method of burnishing is bad, or its me :x

but i tend to hand sand since i just cant get it right !
and i dont own any planes..

Jez, this illustrated article might help http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/pages/w00007.asp?

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Jez]

thanks alot !

 

[Anonymous]

id like to scrape but i just can't seem to get the cards right.

i bought a pair of LN scrapers but i didn't buy a burnisher and i asked my lecturer at collage how to burnish them as id never done it before and he used a screw driver shaft and it created a slight burr, but when i try to scrape i have to get it at a lower angle than 45 to get it to do anything, and then it just digs in to the wood.

I don't know if this method of burnishing is bad, or its me :x

but i tend to hand sand since i just cant get it right !
and i dont own any planes..

Jez, I just flatten the edges on an old DMT and then run the spaces over the DMT quickly so that the card has nice, perpendicular edges. I then burnish in two strokes with a router bit or burnishing tool at about 5 degrees.

 

[David C]

The sharper the square edges of the card scraper before burnishing/turning a hook are the better. Some sort of honing on all three surfaces is essential.

The burnisher must be very hard and smooth. Personally I have no faith in screwdriver shafts or the backs of old gouges.

If the sharp edge of the scraper bites into the surface of the burnisher it is too soft.

If you work with thin film finishes which need sanding between coats, the surface of the work must be very flat or you will sand through the film on the high spots of the work.

This is a powerful argument for some light sanding to finally level the surface before applying finish. Wide hand planed surfaces have minute scallops which need removing, and card scrapers are an invitation to produce hollows where the problem areas exist. This is why I prefer scraper planes for large veneered surfaces.

My sanding routine is 240, 320 and maybe 400 in some fine grained timbers. The levelling is done with the 240.

Card scrapers are fantastically useful on compound curved surfaces.

David