Rope Warming

[Woodchip Wilbur]

In our cold and damp bell tower we have a rope warmer that dries out the bottom ends of the ropes so they are flexible enough to use. It consists of an octagonal ply tube, 200mm diameter and 1.5m tall with 2 x 100w incandescent bulbs in the bottom.
It works well.
I have three problems:

1. Incandescent bulbs are getting more difficult to find.
2. The bulbs fail rather more frequently than my purse likes
3. I constantly get messages: "You've left a light on in the belfry!"

I'd like to replace the bulbs with a heater. ! can buy 100w cabinet heaters (at a rather eye-watering price) - or I can buy 100w "basking heaters" for a terrarium. There may be other options. Question is, does a 100w dedicated heater give off more heat than a light bulb? I really don't want to cook our expensive bell ropes!

 

[Gordon Tarling]

100 Watts is 100 Watts, whether from a light bulb or a heater, so two of those 100W cabinet heaters will give as much heat as the 2 x 100W light bulbs. Perhaps place a thermostat somewhere near the top of the octagonal tube to keep the temperature to a reasonable level?

G.

 

[eribaMotters]

Will a greenhouse tube heater fit? Dimplex Thermostatic Tubular Heater IPX4 2ft 80W (toolstation.com)
I have a smaller version fitted in hall cupboard that has an outside wall. They also have a built in thermostat so only come on when needed.

Colin

 

[Cabinetman]

You could use a desiccant type dehumidifier, this would warm the ropes up, and remove the moisture.
Probably more than you want to pay though at about £130. Ian

 

[TRITON]

You live and learn. Warming ropes for bell puller people. Who'd have thought...

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

100 Watts is 100 Watts, whether from a light bulb or a heater, so two of those 100W cabinet heaters will give as much heat as the 2 x 100W light bulbs. Perhaps place a thermostat somewhere near the top of the octagonal tube to keep the temperature to a reasonable level?

G.

I think that you are pretty well correct - but not totally. If a device is giving off 100w, 100% of this is emitted as radiation - but only some of that (OK, OK, almost all - but not quite!) is heat. There is a good deal of light emitted that escapes the box through the open base (and is the basis of one of my problems) that will NOT result in a heating effect.
Yes, I agree that that's a very small loss. I don't know the efficiency of an incandescent bulb. If it was 10%, perhaps, it means that as a heater, we could take it as 90% efficient.

But, actually, the bigger question I was asking was about whether I should look at devices other than a vivarium heater or a cabinet warmer.

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

You live and learn. Warming ropes for bell puller people. Who'd have thought...

Live and learn indeed! There's a whole world of campanology out there, awaiting discovery...

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

Will a greenhouse tube heater fit? Dimplex Thermostatic Tubular Heater IPX4 2ft 80W (toolstation.com)
I have a smaller version fitted in hall cupboard that has an outside wall. They also have a built in thermostat so only come on when needed.

Colin

Not easily. It could run the length of the tube - but then the tube would have to be bigger to accommodate the ropes, the tube and a guard to keep the ropes off the hot tube. That's a rebuild - but crucially, it makes a bigger, more difficult object to manhandle in a limited space.

Ian,
I've looked into the dessicant plan too. That's probably great if you could run it to dry the whole ringing chamber, but, with an ill-fitting outer door, another opposite it into the church and the consequent draught - as well as a ceiling some 30ft or more high and a large stained glass window, I think that the potential supply of moisture will exceed anything we are likely to be able to run (or collect - no chance of draining to the outside!)

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Rig something up with a cheap hair dryer?

 

[MARK.B.]

Just a thought that may or may not be worth considering could you use a Soil heating cable or similar inside the tube

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

Just a thought that may or may not be worth considering could you use a Soil heating cable or similar inside the box

Well worth a thought... I wonder - does it need to be buried in soil (in the same way as a fish tank heater must be submerged)? Is this something that will get past the H&S officer* and the PAT tester?

*Oh, yes! That's me!

 

[MARK.B.]

I don't think they need to be in soil to operate safely and you get a fitted thermostat on most. I was thinking 1 or possibly 2 of them winding up around inside the tube would give a steady heat over the full length . There are cables used for trace heating i think in industry and sure i read on here where they have been used on lathes etc to keep rust away so maybe something along those lines would do the trick

 

[Gordon Tarling]

There's plenty of choice of heaters on the RS website - one or two of these cabinet heaters might do the trick. There's also plenty of other heaters on the RS site, including tape/cable heaters.

G.

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

I don't think they need to be in soil to operate safely and you get a fitted thermostat on most. I was thinking 1 or possibly 2 of them winding up around inside the tube would give a steady heat over the full length . There are cables used for trace heating i think in industry and sure i read on here where they have been used on lathes etc to keep rust away so maybe something along those lines would do the trick

One VERY attractive part to this is that I already HAVE a soil warming cable that I'm not using!

 

[profchris]

I had to look up 'basking' heaters - they seem to be radiant heat lamps, which don't seem appropriate to me. These heat the surfaces on which their light falls, rather than giving off steady heat by convection.

Enclosure heaters (I guess the same as cabinet heaters) are designed for this kind of work, so should be safe to be left on for indefinite periods. The RS site (also linked previously) sells them in various wattages, giving the surface temperature which might be helpful to you. The 100w is the coolest, surprisingly, at 85 degrees C, and would fit. £32 plus delivery, so more than a heat lamp but I'd guess a lot cheaper than a single bell rope

 

[MARK.B.]

Now if you just had a infrared warming blanket instead that might work too

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

Now if you just had a infrared warming blanket instead that might work too

Fresh out of infrared warming blankets!

 

[Sandyn]

I would purchase a 200W 12V supply UL listed, and replace the bulbs with a vertical array of resistors. Easy peasy!! Use the same housing. Safer than using light bulbs That was a real iffy design safety wise!!

 

[Sandyn]

100 Watts is 100 Watts, whether from a light bulb or a heater, so two of those 100W cabinet heaters will give as much heat as the 2 x 100W light bulbs. Perhaps place a thermostat somewhere near the top of the octagonal tube to keep the temperature to a reasonable level?

G.

I knew what you meant!!

 

[Woodchip Wilbur]

I would purchase a 200W 12V supply UL listed, and replace the bulbs with a vertical array of resistors. Easy peasy!! Use the same housing. Safer than using light bulbs That was a real iffy design safety wise!!

Ah! I like what I understand. But I don't understand much...

• 200W 12V supply UL listed... Fine! Got that.
• Replace the bulbs with a... Absolutely - the whole point of this useful thread.
• ... resistors ... Yup! I've come across a number of different formats of these
• ... vertical array ... Lost me there, I am afraid.

I'm aware that the light bulbs are less than ideal; I can understand what I'm doing with enclosure heaters; I follow what @profchris says about the radiant "heat lamp". But here, I think I risk going where angels fear to tread; easy peasy or not!