Rental properties and new EPC rules

[Doug71]

I own a small rental property, it's a lovely little cottage but very old, solid walls etc. When it had an EPC done a few years ago it was given the rating of D, just had it done again and now it's an E I wasn't there when it was done but it looks like they couldn't be bothered to look in the loft etc as it says they presume there is no insulation up there but there is and it's up to modern standards.

Anyway my question is about the new rules coming in 2025 where rental property has to have a minimum rating of C, not sure how I can achieve this without major work or adding solar panels etc, most of the walls in the property are drylined and insulated (think 50mm Kingspan but can't remember) and as said the loft is insulated also windows double glazed but I'm sure it still won't be rated C.

I have read that if it's going to cost over a certain amount to achieve a C you can be exempt but I'm sure this will end up being a grey area?

It seems the average rating for a house in this country is D, I'm sure there will be 1000's of rental properties which won't be able to meet the new rules and there is already a massive shortage of rentals so will these new rules even happen?

My agent doesn't seem very concerned about it all and has a bit of a wait and see what happens attitude but I would rather know what all the options are as I might even sell the place.

Anyone know more about the situation or doing anything about it?

Thanks, Doug

 

[Jacob]

I own a small rental property, it's a lovely little cottage but very old, solid walls etc. When it had an EPC done a few years ago it was given the rating of D, just had it done again and now it's an E I wasn't there when it was done but it looks like they couldn't be bothered to look in the loft etc as it says they presume there is no insulation up there but there is and it's up to modern standards.

Anyway my question is about the new rules coming in 2025 where rental property has to have a minimum rating of C, not sure how I can achieve this without major work or adding solar panels etc, most of the walls in the property are drylined and insulated (think 50mm Kingspan but can't remember) and as said the loft is insulated also windows double glazed but I'm sure it still won't be rated C.

I have read that if it's going to cost over a certain amount to achieve a C you can be exempt but I'm sure this will end up being a grey area?

It seems the average rating for a house in this country is D, I'm sure there will be 1000's of rental properties which won't be able to meet the new rules and there is already a massive shortage of rentals so will these new rules even happen?

My agent doesn't seem very concerned about it all and has a bit of a wait and see what happens attitude but I would rather know what all the options are as I might even sell the place.

Anyone know more about the situation or doing anything about it?

Thanks, Doug

On the face of it things are getting tougher for landlords. They are not all to blame of course but it's high time.
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/mould-and-damp.139943/#post-1622924Personally I'd be inclined to sell, unless you are prepared to take on the challenge!

 

[baldkev]

Hi Doug, don't stress.

A customer of mine with an old stone cottage here in devon has had his place tested. It failed to reach the requirements, but we put in extra loft insulation as the new minimum is 275mm of fluffy roll, layers to be laid in opposing directions and he had his water cylinder changed to a stainless one with good insulation. That pushed him over the line.

Originally there was talk of insulating the concrete floor with a product like space wrap in roofs, but that was found to be a no go because the edges of the room and stone walls would be uninsulated.... then it was solar panels but the old roof isnt up to it..... so they thought solar in the garden, but the survey showed it to be sub optimal....

How old is your boiler? Effectively you are trying to make your house more energy efficient, so replacing an old boiler can score you good points, led lights?

 

[Blackswanwood]

As I understand Doug the need to have a rating of C or better is proposed to apply to new tenancies from the end of 2025 and then all rental properties from 2028. I haven’t seen a clear explanation of the cost exemption.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

On the face of it things are getting tougher for landlords. They are not all to blame of course but it's high time.

Yes - around here nearly every case seems to be a housing association property.
https://www.cornwalllive.com/news/cornwall-news/cornwall-child-living-disgusting-mouldy-7880284
Incidentally we drove past dozens of houses with water running down the windows this morning - not one had a window open.

 

[Ollie78]

The EPC is a bit of a silly thing.
I didn't even bother looking at ours when we bought our house as I knew it didn't even have central heating.
It is a glorified tick list, double glazing, check etc.
I think there should be exemptions for older properties that cannot be improved any further by sensible means.
And if they are listed or in a conservation area then automatic exemption because the government actively stop you from improving the efficiency.

Maybe some form of scaling relative to age and construction type.
A bit like MOT's where they don't check the emissions on a 60's car to the modern standard or make you put seatbelts in a 1930's car.

Whatever the price for exemption just get a quote for the "work required "for more than that, it probably will be anyway

The agent is not concerned because they know its all nonsense.

Ollie

 

[baldkev]

@Blackswanwood touched on an important point that i didnt address..... the customer is a very officious guy abd acts very quickly, however when he was talking to the powers that be, they couldnt say if or when enforcement would actually happen, because there are going to be countless properties affected and some ( probably quite a few ) that are buy to let, with the landlord not being in a position to pay for upgrades.
Of course the property prices are currently high, but a lot of people are mortgaged right up.....

We considered turning our current house into a rental and trying to buy another house with some of our equity as a deposit, but with so much uncertainty, ive binned that idea for the moment and if anything went wrong, we don't have a backup amount of cash to pay for stuff

 

[Terry - Somerset]

There are some "get out clauses" for properties which do not meet a C or E rating based on cost, listed buildings, practical difficulty (eg: insulating or putting a cavity in a solid wall!) etc.

Encouraging improvements in housing energy efficiency is sound and needs a regulatory, not voluntary approach. It remains to be seen how balanced the application of exemptions will be.

If applied with excessive rigour landlords are likely to sell unimproved property, probably at low prices, to people who will find upgrading difficult to afford. The rental market will shrink, increasing rents for those that remain available. Energy efficiencies are unlikely to be achieved.

Applying intelligence would leave exemptions fairly easy to obtain initially, with the bar being raised progressively over the following decade. But governments of all shades tend to place dogma and public opinion above common sense - so who knows!!

 

[Blackswanwood]

Regardless of the improvements people may feel could be made to EPCs they are very much a fact of life in the housing market and here to stay. Increasingly mortgage providers won't lend on properties with poorer ratings as the government are pushing them to set targets to have an improved average rating across their book of properties held as security.

The EPC may be a blunt instrument but it's a key tool being used by government to improve the quality of housing stock and move towards net zero.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

When we moved to a bungalow the EPC suggested we could move up from iirc D to C if we changed all the lighting to low energy. There was one bulb in the whole place that was an incandescent, the rest were CFls (now all very quickly installed LEDs, which weren't so common eight years ago). It did however suggest we dug up all solid concrete floors and put insulation under them (the payback would have been hundreds of years). It completely ignored a 24' wall of single block between the garage and the bungalow, which shouldn't have passed building regs. when it was built (since clad with 95mm PIR.)

 

[Jacob]

....The rental market will shrink,

But the housing market would expand

increasing rents for those that remain available.

Not so likely as we would have decreasing house prices for those hoping to buy.

Energy efficiencies are unlikely to be achieved.

The lower the house price the more money available for improvements.
The free market system we have at present is not fit for purpose

 

[Doug71]

It is good to have some kind of standard but it feels like landlords are being picked on, there would be riots if the government announced that every house in the country had to be C rated by 2028 or the owner could be fined £30.000.

Comparing my previous certificate which was D and the new one which is E the main differences are the loft insulation and hot water/heating system. The loft insulation has gone from very good to very poor, I guess either the assessor didn't look (maybe not allowed to climb a step ladder to look through loft hatch?) or the previous tenants took the loft insulation with them. The hot water and heating system has gone from good to average, maybe it's down to the assessors opinion or maybe the goal posts keep moving, who knows.

Quick google and it looks like a 2 day online course and you can be an EPC assessor, probably the cheapest option for some landlords.........

 

[Terry - Somerset]

But the housing market would expand
You are right. Sadly it would be mainly by the addition of poorly insulated, expensive to run properties deemed uneconomic to upgrade by the previous landlord. Whether they would sell (who would buy them) or sit empty is debatable.

Not so likely as we would have decreasing house prices for those hoping to buy
If in balance, it assumes those currently renting would be able to buy if the price of houses fell. My guess - buyers would not match the reduction in rental properties. Outcome - those still needing rental properties would find supply reduced and rents higher.

The lower the house price the more money available for improvements.
Lower prices for substandard property no longer occupied will not make more money available. Buyers of these properties will mainly be those unable to afford something better (DIY enthusiasts aside) and unlikely to find further upgrades affordable.

 

[Jacob]

But the housing market would expand
You are right. Sadly it would be mainly by the addition of poorly insulated, expensive to run properties deemed uneconomic to upgrade by the previous landlord.

Could be. Better to give somebody else a chance of doing a proper job.

Whether they would sell (who would buy them) or sit empty is debatable.

Market forces would not allow many to sit empty for long

Not so likely as we would have decreasing house prices for those hoping to buy
If in balance, it assumes those currently renting would be able to buy if the price of houses fell. My guess - buyers would not match the reduction in rental properties. Outcome - those still needing rental properties would find supply reduced and rents higher.

A wild guess. The opposite is most likely and apparently is already happening.

The lower the house price the more money available for improvements.
Lower prices for substandard property no longer occupied will not make more money available. Buyers of these properties will mainly be those unable to afford something better (DIY enthusiasts aside) and unlikely to find further upgrades affordable.

But better off than having a slum landlord on their backs.
PS Have to say I enjoy you posts Terry - you seem to be the archetypal "conservative" who warns against any change at all, in the expectation that whatever it was would likely be worse.
This is the basic conservative "philosophy" as expressed by Lord Salisbury and others: "Whatever happens will be for the worse, and therefore it is in our interest that as little should happen as possible”.
It's really an excuse for preserving the status quo and the privileges of the wealthy over the rest of us, and/or in the case of politicians; the avoidance of risk to reputation and career.
https://www.alistairlexden.org.uk/news/why-do-we-need-change

 

[Holdstrong]

I own a small rental property, it's a lovely little cottage but very old, solid walls etc. When it had an EPC done a few years ago it was given the rating of D, just had it done again and now it's an E I wasn't there when it was done but it looks like they couldn't be bothered to look in the loft etc as it says they presume there is no insulation up there but there is and it's up to modern standards.

Anyway my question is about the new rules coming in 2025 where rental property has to have a minimum rating of C, not sure how I can achieve this without major work or adding solar panels etc, most of the walls in the property are drylined and insulated (think 50mm Kingspan but can't remember) and as said the loft is insulated also windows double glazed but I'm sure it still won't be rated C.

I have read that if it's going to cost over a certain amount to achieve a C you can be exempt but I'm sure this will end up being a grey area?

It seems the average rating for a house in this country is D, I'm sure there will be 1000's of rental properties which won't be able to meet the new rules and there is already a massive shortage of rentals so will these new rules even happen?

My agent doesn't seem very concerned about it all and has a bit of a wait and see what happens attitude but I would rather know what all the options are as I might even sell the place.

Anyone know more about the situation or doing anything about it?

Thanks, Doug

The EPC is a tick box exercise very often carried out by people that do the course with no building / technical experience. It works well if you have a standard uniform box type house but introduce anomalies and extensions etc the assessor has to make assumptions which the computerised assessment may or may not reflect the true energy efficiency of the building. The only way to know is do your own calcs using U-values but they don’t count.

If you think the assessment is wrong it can be challenged. The assessors name and contact details are given but in my experience rarely (don’t !) reply. I expect there will be a procedure to escalate if they fail to respond.

Where the thermal characteristics cannot be determined by visual inspection they use the age of the property so may have used a “representative” thickness for insulation in the loft and the same for the walls where they may not have considered any internal insulation that has already been installed. The assessor will be able to tell you the assumptions made. I believe there are ways to input calculated U-values but thats far too technical for most of the assessors and would take too long.

Getting from a D to a C is quite a points gap so it depends where you are starting from. Getting a condensing boiler gives you around 10 points and a heat pump would be better along with solar panels (which you may be able to claim the credit or sell the rights to a company to install - if such companies still exist). Other tips to gain a few points (yes its a points exercise) are to have LED bulbs in each light fitting (doesn’t matter if they are changed back after), thermostatic radiator valves, room thermostat (who said it needs to be connected !). The assessment certificate will list some measures that can be taken to increase your points along with an indicative cost.

I can recall looking on line in the past due to a house being overrated and also one where the rating was very low. Best to go online “Guide to Energy Performance Certificates” which should give you some idea of the best way to gain points.

I think you can download the program try “EPC software” but when I looked in the past it was not easy to understand the input parameters – probably because I was trying to model a non standard property and had other more pressing issues at the time.

Hope the above helps. Good luck.

 

[deema]

EPC is a complete shambles. Done by the incompetent for the illiterate and pushed by those who know less than nothing.
Advocating insulating the wall and floors on a 1800’s built house with no damp course, solid walls lime plaster and cement is ridiculous, but needed to gain those points. Oh the mould and damp?? Well never mind, it’s got a C rating!

 

[Jacob]

EPC is a complete shambles. Done by the incompetent for the illiterate and pushed by those who know less than nothing.
Advocating insulating the wall and floors on a 1800’s built house with no damp course, solid walls lime plaster and cement is ridiculous, but needed to gain those points. Oh the mould and damp?? Well never mind, it’s got a C rating!

Everybody knows it's nonsense so nobody takes much notice when they are looking at houses to buy etc.
But it's a start and what is certainly needed is much more sensible regulation especially in the rental sector.

 

[Ollie78]

Maybe you could pay the £1000 to get certified as an EPC assessor then just provide your own assessment.
Might be cheaper ....

Ollie

 

[Terry - Somerset]

We are moving house and needed an EPC. The last was 18 years ago but valid for only ten years.

There were significant assumptions made - particularly (property is a 1970s build) with reference to insulation in flat roof extensions and cavity wall insulation. The tick box stuff was easy - LED lights, radiator thermostats etc. Overall it came out as a "C" - much as expected.

The report also made recommendations for improvement - the most laughable of which was to insulate the floor slab which would take 80-100 years to pay for itself.

The vendors of the property we hope to buy were ill advised by their estate agent. Their old EPC did not reflect loft insulation, a new CH boiler, and an old conservatory with a UPVC double glazed job. They would have had a much better rating with a new survey.

The intentions of EPC are entirely sound. The implementation is quite flawed. To its credit the cost is fairly trivial - I think I paid ~£80.

To base legislation on rented properties around a flawed EPC rating system is (I suspect) doomed to challenge and failure unless applied in a more pragmatic way than seems likely at the moment.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

The EPC is a tick box exercise ...

If you think the assessment is wrong it can be challenged. The assessors name and contact details are given ...

In reality you're challenging the computer programme, not the assessor.