Planer/thicknesser/jointer confusion!

[accipiter]

Awesome, thanks everyone. The confusion of our North American cousins using planer for a thicknesser, and jointer for a planer (or surface planer) is now clear, as is the usage model for each. So combined you could have a planer/thicknesser (UK) and a jointer/planer (US), but the planer component of each is completely different. A mixed US/UK could be a planer/planer or a jointer/thicknesser. And our antipodean cousins would have a buzzer/thicknesser.

So for my £5-600 budget I could get a TSPL125 surface planer and a TPT125 thicknesser from Triton or a combined item from Metabo HB 260 C. I quite like the idea of two separate units and the Tritons - although looking very similar to others from Makita and unknown brands - do get really good reviews.

What's the views on 2 single units or 1 combo unit?

Thanks, Steve

I think you meant to put TSPL152... their 6" surface planer? If you can find one in stock then "maybe" it'll be over your £600 budget. If you haven't got the thicknesser then I'd be looking for a combined unit rather than two separates.

I had one - the 152 - on back order with Yandle's for a few months and eventually gave up. Searched on line for other stockists to no avail. Paid what I thought was a reasonable price at £250 'ish at Yandle's but decided for a refund not too long ago. I've already got the "lunchbox" thicknesser - TPT 125 - so it was one reason I was going for adding the 152. Didn't know they did one (maybe they don't anymore with no stock available? - but more likely delayed because of that Suez thing?) until I stumbled on a YT vid of it. Shame really as it looks and seemingly performs well. I've even tried contacting TRITON but had absolutely no response.

 

[Woodbee2]

Hi all,
I've done quite a bit of research on this but still not clear. I believe a surface planer is what our US cousins will call a jointer, and this has cutting blades on the bottom and is designed to create a smooth planed face and I think at 90 degrees to the edge.
But a thicknesser has the blades on top, and will plane the top face consistently to the same thickness.
Do I need both? I'm looking at using construction timber (sawn untreated) and also pallet timber to use in other items. I saw one video on the Triton side which suggested I should ideally have both, and their machines look pretty good, so maybe that's the way to go.
Or do I just use a thicknesser on all four sides?
Any advice and guidance welcome.
Cheers

You should ALWAYS start by getting the face, and face edge flat, and true, without any twist, then the thicknesser, to get the finished dimensions, parallel to both. If you just plane each face independently each surface will be flat but NOT parallel, it will be all over the place and almost unusable. You are going to create all sorts of problems for yourself. And any machine with BLUNT cutters (or blades) won’t ever cut true, and gets dangerous because you have to use excessive force. This makes really hard work of things....for the machine....and yourself!

Just met up with another keen hobby ’chipper’ today and he had a set of new blades in his planer/thicknesser, but he couldn’t understand why it wasn’t cutting cleanly...? The problem was easily identified....the blades are NOT sharpened properly until they have been honed. A few seconds with an oilstone cured it.
On starting it up, his Bandsaw was screaming....literally....unbelievable racket! Again the problem was quickly found. The bottom thrust bearing was much too far forward....but moving it back a few millimetres soon made it run smoothly. The side guides were also a bit too tight on the blade, pinching it slightly. And a tiny amount of oil resulted in a Bandsaw that was quiet, smooth and a pleasure to use. Result!
Hope this helps....
We’ve all been there at some point in the past, so I am always happy to offer advice, and on-the job, 1 to 1, hands on demonstrations, if others are struggling with something they don’t quite ‘get’, providing they aren’t too far away!
I live on the Kent/Sussex border.
Keep you’re machines/tools sharp...OK.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

OK so now I am confused lol, I thought the difference between a planer & a jointer was down to the infeed & outfeed tables rather than which side of the pond you lived,

definitely a misunderstanding

my understanding was that a planer had infeed & outfeed tables at the same level like a hand plane

That is a planer (jointer) that is currently having its knives checked for hight.

a jointer had an outfeed table that was adjustable but would generally be set higher than the infeed table,

That is a planer (jointer) that is set correctly
However both infeed tables and outfeed tables are adjustable in any quality machine.
The outfeed table is usually set a hair under the knife hight, so that a check steel ruler or perfectly flat piece of wood will be moved a millimetre or 2 when you rotate the cutter head. Once adjusted it is not changed until the knives are changed.

The infeed table is the one adjusted for cut hight, the lower it goes the greater the amount of material removed.

but these boards that were used to originally make the pallet were themselves thicknessed.
But its just basically softwood timber

It's usual that the boards making up pallets are rough sawn, the only time you would get thicknessed timber in a pallet is if the makers were supplying timber like that to their customers and using scraps to make pallets.
Also the timber used in pallets is totally dependent on where the pallets originated. If they came from tropical or subtropical countries they are very likely to be hard wood, often species that are never commercially available.

The reasons for that are that the cheapest available wood that's strong enough is used and softwood doesn't grow there, so the non commercially valuable wood is used, off cuts or trees that can't be sold into the local or export markets.

 

[TRITON]

It's usual that the boards making up pallets are rough sawn, the only time you would get thicknessed timber in a pallet is if the makers were supplying timber like that to their customers and using scraps to make pallets.
Also the timber used in pallets is totally dependent on where the pallets originated. If they came from tropical or subtropical countries they are very likely to be hard wood, often species that are never commercially available.

So what youre telling me is pallets never have planed boards, and some timber, like tropical hardwods cannot be planed or thicknessed.
Oh yeah, and all pallets contain boards that are basically offcuts.

Not a lot of knots present on a pallet, ever notice that

 

[sometimewoodworker]

So what youre telling me is pallets never have planed boards, and some timber, like tropical hardwods cannot be planed or thicknessed.
Oh yeah, and all pallets contain boards that are basically offcuts.

Not a lot of knots present on a pallet, ever notice that

Do re-read what I posted. virtually nothing in your post is what I said or even true

 

[TRITON]

Do re-read what I posted. virtually nothing in your post is what I said or even true

OK
So how is this then ?
" It's usual that the boards making up pallets are rough sawn "
Indeed, but some are not.

" if the makers were supplying timber like that to their customers and using scraps to make pallets. "
Hardly 'scraps' given for starters they're knot,split or shake free, the timber is obviously being chosen to a standard. OK its not furniture Grade A, but given the weight on a pallet can exceed 1500lbs, the timber has to be of good standard.

" If they came from tropical or subtropical countries they are very likely to be hard wood, often species that are never commercially available. "
Yup, i'd agree with you there. Many manufacturers of pallets look to choose timbers such as, which are cheap and easy to source, but have spent time choosing the right timber for the job at hand.
Oak and pine, but mainly pine are the timbers many pallets are made form. I can confirm this as when thicknessing pallet wood, there is a distinct pine smell.

" Also the timber used in pallets is totally dependent on where the pallets originated "
Isn't that a bit of a catch all answer ?

 

[Jameshow]

You must have fancy pallets over there. Most of the pallets I see are rough sawn, and often with not very parallel faces.

Cheers, Vann.

The only pallet wood I've found useful are the bearers that come underneath the packs of wood. Sometimes these have been hard wood 3x3....not a bad catch if you can get them.

Cheers James

 

[sometimewoodworker]

OK
So how is this then ?
" It's usual that the boards making up pallets are rough sawn "
Indeed, but some are not.

That is a better summary

" if the makers were supplying timber like that to their customers and using scraps to make pallets. "
Hardly 'scraps' given for starters they're knot,split or shake free, the timber is obviously being chosen to a standard. OK its not furniture Grade A, but given the weight on a pallet can exceed 1500lbs, the timber has to be of good standard.

I stay with the scraps description, but you are thinking of scraps from the wrong point of view. Sawmill scraps are the ends of the boards that are too long for the packs that are being cut or too narrow, nothing about the ones being used for pallets are rejected from the sawmill for defects, though I've seen quite a few knots and several splits in pallets

Oak and pine, but mainly pine are the timbers many pallets are made form. I can confirm this as when thicknessing pallet wood, there is a distinct pine smell.

Absolutely, I don't doubt that the ones you get are like that, but that doesn't mean that people getting pallets originating from other areas have the same experience.

" Also the timber used in pallets is totally dependent on where the pallets originated "
Isn't that a bit of a catch all answer ?

If by "catch all" you mean correct and accurate, then yes it is.

For example for any pallets made around here I can guarantee are not any verity of Pine or Oak as those species are very expensive locally as they are all imported, that is unless one of the large manufacturers is actually shipping in wood for pallets

 

[Chris_Pallet]

My 2 pence -
You definitely need both.

I was in the same predicament,
I bought a cheap Chinese planer thicknesser and ended up sending it back - mostly due to the advice on here (thank you again)

So rather than rush out and stich myself up on axminster credit, I waited and kept and eye on the bay and forums on here, even on the wanted section.

To my joy a user from here got in touch, I now have a pristine dewalt planer thicknesser, which I have fitted blades and aligned , a DIY refurb / service,
It runs like a dream and I couldn't be happier.

10x better than the cheapo one I bought previously.

Take all advice given on here as it done my a right favor,

Get a decent planer thicknesser wait a few months and save up more, get the best what you can afford is what I always do now.
It will pay off in the long run..

Good luck.....

 

[danst96]

My 2 pence -
You definitely need both.

I was in the same predicament,
I bought a cheap Chinese planer thicknesser and ended up sending it back - mostly due to the advice on here (thank you again)

So rather than rush out and stich myself up on axminster credit, I waited and kept and eye on the bay and forums on here, even on the wanted section.

To my joy a user from here got in touch, I now have a pristine dewalt planer thicknesser, which I have fitted blades and aligned , a DIY refurb / service,
It runs like a dream and I couldn't be happier.

10x better than the cheapo one I bought previously.

Take all advice given on here as it done my a right favor,

Get a decent planer thicknesser wait a few months and save up more, get the best what you can afford is what I always do now.
It will pay off in the long run..

Good luck.....

I'd agree. 2sheds you would have seen my messages on the other thread, avoid getting low cost new machines. You are much better getting an older second hand machine which may be many years old but I can guarantee you won't regret it as older machines, especially those made in UK and Europe are made to last and will get you years and years of use whereas a lower cost Chinese model like the Tritons will leave you regretting the purchase in a short while from my experience.

 

[sometimewoodworker]

You are much better getting an older second hand machine which may be many years old but I can guarantee you won't regret it as older machines, especially those made in UK and Europe are made to last and will get you years and years of use

I am absolutely with you on that. I have an English made plainer/circular saw combination that was older than I was when I bought it about 45 years ago, it’s still in use today and works as well as it always has.

 

[Chris_Pallet]

I also found a 500kg solid standing planer on the bay, text my mate who won it for £60!
We hired a van to pick up.
It purrs like brand new!

There's not one bit of plastic on it, brass handles, solid bolts etc.
This is propa machinery as above says in this instance the older the better...