Photographers - help!

[Jacob]

EBay - search for canon eos ef-s (smaller body) generally simpler, but with the essential auto and manual functions, you’ll get one for £100-£150 with a kit lens and maybe another zoom lens thrown in. Then search for nifty fifty/ef 50mm, again, £40 should get you one. If necessary get an 150-200mm or use feet and walk closer and £10 for a memory card.

Will do all the basics well, loads of cheap accessories, lenses, flash, available.

Like tools and has been said, if hobby/course doesn’t stick, throw in cupboard or sell on eBay and lose a tenner; Or if does stick, work out which lens system you want to go with and buy the brand/body to suit. upgrading/swapping lens brand can become eyewateringly expensive.

Cameras can give you proper GAS.

Had to look up GAS; "gear acquisition syndrome" Dead right, just like woodwork!

 

[paulrbarnard]

Had to look up GAS; "gear acquisition syndrome" Dead right, just like woodwork!

Spare a thought for someone who suffers GAS in both hobbies…

 

[Amplidyne]

EBay - search for canon eos ef-s (smaller body) generally simpler, but with the essential auto and manual functions, you’ll get one for £100-£150 with a kit lens and maybe another zoom lens thrown in. Then search for nifty fifty/ef 50mm, again, £40 should get you one. If necessary get an 150-200mm or use feet and walk closer and £10 for a memory card.

Will do all the basics well, loads of cheap accessories, lenses, flash, available.

Like tools and has been said, if hobby/course doesn’t stick, throw in cupboard or sell on eBay and lose a tenner; Or if does stick, work out which lens system you want to go with and buy the brand/body to suit. upgrading/swapping lens brand can become eyewateringly expensive.

Cameras can give you proper GAS.

Yep. The settings will be in different places, but it's the user that matters not the camera so much.
Any decent camera, of any decent system is capable of giving good results.
I've sold images online now for getting on for 20 years through online agencies. I've never had terrifically expensive gear, and I've managed to avoid the thing of "mine is the only brand to own, and this camera is the best."
I've made a lot more money than I've ever spent.
The main seller I use, used to be incredibly fussy about quality, both technically and artistically.
Oh and I've never used Photoshop, or Lightroom either. I refuse to have their hands in my pockets for a sub. I've used open source software.

And as said, it's the same with woodwork or anything else. You read the magazines, or look online, and it's "You've got to have this"
No you haven't.
Sometimes it does help, but a lot of the time it'll sit in a cupboard.
I used to make furniture with a Luna combination machine, a morticer and a drill. As well as a good bench, and literally a handful of hand tools that I used day to day. (Although I admittedly have other tools) India stone and a strop made from old leather belting dressed with fine valve grinding paste for sharpening.
Again, I made a lot more money from it than I ever spent.

You can always spend money. It doesn't guarantee results that reflect that money spent.

 

[Spectric]

Don’t buy an SLR.
At this point they are obsolete technology.
They are big, heavy and won't offer him the experience needed as all camera makers going forward will producing mirrorless.

Have you seen the size and weight of the Z9 , the mirror was not a heavy component so did not contribute much to the overall weight and whether it has a mirror or not will not have much effect on someones photographic journey as the basic principles remain the same, aperture and duration give exposure.

Also even with all the modern camera technology you can still learn an awful lot from understanding black and white photography, after all your RAW image has no color, look at people like Ansel Adams zone system and his work as well as people like the late Galen Rowell and Thom Hogan for inspiration as they have done some amazing work.

What you have to grasp is that the camera is just a tool and that it is the user who makes the decisions and takes the image so buying the best and most expensive camera can just produce high quality technically perfect rubbish images as @Amplidyne has said above and is why I am no longer into photography because I have the technical side but not the creative side.

 

[MikeJhn]

I love my Sony Alpha, but do miss the look through finder as the LED screen is impossible to see outside in daylight.

 

[Delaney]

I'd set a budget for camera/case/strap and lens (or 2), decide what the lens requirements are (e.g. a 50mm f1.4 for "street photos" and a low end zoom (70-200?) for wildlife etc. then head to Park Cameras site to see what they have in the budget. A used semi pro DSLR body a couple of generations old will be a great learning tool, capable of producing images of a quality that underline that megapixels isn't everything (or even a major factor, once you get up to say 20MP) compared to (a) decent lens (b) knowing the how and why of the settings to produce the image you want.

But budget is everything. The next zoom lens I want is £1k, and that's used.

50mm 1.4! What kind of budget is this?

A Nikon 50mm 1.8 z used is about £500
A 1.4 would be nearer £2,000.

You could buy an older 1.4 lens but it won’t be much use for any video work as the focusing drive will be too slow and noisy.

 

[Delaney]

From this I assume he's chosen photography as an option, rather than it having been a passion for years.
As such he'll only need a basic camera as it may well end up unused on a shelf in three years time after he's finished his course.
My daughter did A level photography, got an A*, and never used her DSLR again, just her iPhone.

Photo enthusiasts can be absolute gear heads and upgrade kit with almost no use on a regular basis, so there are some fabulous secondhand cameras for bargain basement prices if you avoid the nonsense of buying new. Depreciation can be huge.
Any of the older Canon/Nikon/Sony DSLRs from the last ten years will be fine. Generally if a camera looks OK, rather than totally beaten up, it will be fine and give good service.
There still are a few decent camera shops in central London selling s/h kit. I'd suggest you drop by, preferably when they're not busy at the weekend or lunchtime and have time to help, and ask what they recommend for your budget and have in stock. You should be able to pick up something very decent for less than £500 with a guarantee.

Worth noting that the most successful jobs now and going forwards are someone who can do videography and tell a story.

That person will make good money and
have a very for filling career because everyone now can be famous.
All those beautiful vloggers need a cameraman
Whether you should date one or not is another story

 

[Delaney]

Have you seen the size and weight of the Z9 , the mirror was not a heavy component so did not contribute much to the overall weight and whether it has a mirror or not will not have much effect on someones photographic journey as the basic principles remain the same, aperture and duration give exposure.

Also even with all the modern camera technology you can still learn an awful lot from understanding black and white photography, after all your RAW image has no color, look at people like Ansel Adams zone system and his work as well as people like the late Galen Rowell and Thom Hogan for inspiration as they have done some amazing work.

What you have to grasp is that the camera is just a tool and that it is the user who makes the decisions and takes the image so buying the best and most expensive camera can just produce high quality technically perfect rubbish images as @Amplidyne has said above and is why I am no longer into photography because I have the technical side but not the creative side.

Sure but I would think video work is a conditional part of of any photography course and an SLR won't be able to do that.

And how is he gonna get laid with an slr?

Have a heart man!

It would be like buying him a high viz vest amd pair of Golas to go off to uni in.

 

[MikeJhn]

Would a Minolta 50mm x 1.2 be worth anything now days?

 

[paulrbarnard]

Would a Minolta 50mm x 1.2 be worth anything now days?

About £50. I’ve got a 1.4.

 

[dickm]

Do feel a bit left out of this discussion! Been using Pentax kit since the 1960s, and my comically old fashioned K30 DSLR with a Tamron zoom does all I will ever need. Can even use screw thread Pentax lenses if necessar! Have also got a little Fuji X20 which has a proper viewfinder and so can be used in bright sunlight. Don't suppose all my accumulated kit would add up to £1000.
It's never the camera, it's the user that counts.

 

[Amplidyne]

About £50. I’ve got a 1.4.

I shoot a Pentax as well. A K5. Getting on a bit now but does everything I need. Have a mix of Tamron and other lenses.
TBH, I don't shoot as much as I did these days.
I've got a Sony RX 100 as well. Only a Mk 1. Great little pocket camera though.

 

[MikeJhn]

About £50. I’ve got a 1.4.

When I dug it out just now to find out the aperture I also found the adaptor to fit my Sony alpha, did not remember how many Minolta lens's I had, I sold all the colour processing equipment to a student a long time ago, I don't want to think how long ago.

 

[scooby]

Professional grade lenses to match run £1000 to £1500 apiece new. You don't actually need a lot of them. A working photographer might get by with a 24-70 wide angle zoom plus a 70-210mm telephoto zoom, and the 24-70 is the more useful of those.

Definitely agree. a 24-70 (especially on a full frame) is an excellent choice. Easily my most used lens.
I've also got an old D80, even with the app-c sensor, its still a very useable range.

 

[paulrbarnard]

When I dug it out just now to find out the aperture I also found the adaptor to fit my Sony alpha, did not remember how many Minolta lens's I had, I sold all the colour processing equipment to a student a long time ago, I don't want to think how long ago.

I think a lot of us did the same. I had a full colour darkroom setup but sold it all off when I went digital. I still have some A-mount as I still shoot the Minolta 7 from time to time. I now get the film processed and scanned. I have a cannon pro-1000 A2 printer.

 

[Sideways]

As we've all rather mugged @Jake 's thread for him and turned it into a general photography thread far beyond the original question, I beg his forgiveness and ask people to chip in brief posts about what type of photography they did / do and what lenses they find most useful for that.
The hope is just to show off different aspects of photography that his son may become interested in.

Delaney's posts above are very valuable here because what most of us have been interested in as amateurs, you can't make a living from and it's important to bear that in mind.

Me, I got into photography as a kid, zenith and olympus film SLRs, then just took snaps with compact cameras for years but when I began to travel abroad a lot for work I got a DSLR to take quality photos of the world abroad to bring home and share with family. Landscapes, nature, urban.
I use a 24-70 f2.8 wide zoom most, two 70-210 tele zooms f2.8 and f4, a 300mm tele (a lot), 20mm wide and a 50mm 1.4 hardly ever.

Jake, if this is boring or unhelpful, just say and I'll delete this tangent.

 

[MikeJhn]

I love nostalgia, but it does make me feel my age.

 

[ey_tony]

Definitely agree. a 24-70 (especially on a full frame) is an excellent choice. Easily my most used lens.
I've also got an old D80, even with the app-c sensor, its still a very useable range.

The Nikon 24-70 was the pap's and wedding photographer's favourite. An excellent lens.
I still have the 90's pro favourites ...a 20-35mm, 35-70mm and 80-200mm all F2.8 plus a 12-24mm and 50mm f1.4 and they can cover most events and still churn out pro quality images.
The low magnification of the zooms meant that they produced very low distortion images and gave results near enough the same image quality as a fixed focal length lens,

 

[imageel]

Son is doing A level photography and needs a digital SLR. I know zero.

Any recommendations of a quality camera and basic lens (second hand fine if you get more bang for buck)

Deffo recommend MPB for 2nd hand kit, have used them often for both selling and buying and thoroughly recommend them.
I wouldn't get too hung up on make/model but you can't really go wrong with major brands like Nikon or Cannon where there is a plentiful aftermarket for 2nd hand lenses.
If he wants to upgrade later on he'll be able to trade it in for little less than you paid for it

 

[Katomi woodsmith]

Canon
The EF , the full frame lenses will fit the crop sensor EFS cameras… But not the other way round
Be careful about the m series as I hear the range on glass in that is limited
The new r series can be used on some older canon cameras. I don’t know details as I am an old fossil who uses older canon EFS and ff DSLR.s and have not ventured into newer teck
Save your cash until after Christmas new year sales and peeps trading in older cameras and lenes