new stanley premium planes

[Vann]

I thought it was interesting that Tilgear do not list the 'Grant' brand planes in the new 2009 catalogue. Presumably either (a) they're so good world demand is so high they can't secure a regular supply, or (b) they had so many returns after their last flyer they said "never again".

Or (c) they accepted that such obvious direct copies of LN and Veritas planes was unethical and decided to no longer offer them.

Does anyon know if the Dakota planes will accept LN frogs?

I must admit to wondering if the LN high angle frogs would fit a Clifton. :shock:

Cheers, Vann.

 

[beech1948]

Or (c) they accepted that such obvious direct copies of LN and Veritas planes was unethical and decided to no longer offer them.

Vann,
There is no ethical issue involved at all. Anyone is commercially able to replicate Stanleys designs as LN and LV have done with whatever additional baubles thery want to add. Its that simple.

Anything else is merely the imagination of the commenter.

regards

Alan

 

[TrimTheKing]

Vann, There is no ethical issue involved at all. Anyone is commercially able to replicate Stanleys designs as LN and LV have done with whatever additional baubles thery want to add. Its that simple.

Anything else is merely the imagination of the commenter.

regards

Alan

Absolutely correct. Stanleys patents expired long ago so anyone has the right to copy them (as LN and to a lesser degree LV have both done) absolutely identically to the last dimension if they so desire, without any legal recourse (so I'm led to believe )

 

[Vann]

Vann, There is no ethical issue involved at all. Anyone is commercially able to replicate Stanleys designs as LN and LV have done with whatever additional baubles thery want to add. Its that simple.

Absolutely correct. Stanleys patents expired long ago so anyone has the right to copy them (as LN and to a lesser degree LV have both done) absolutely identically to the last dimension if they so desire, without any legal recourse (so I'm led to believe )

Hmmm, well I'm on thin ice here, having purchased the Grant edge plane :shock: (and subsequently the Veritas LH edge plane) :shock: .

I'd agree that there's nothing unethical or illegal in copying Stanley's designs - the patents on these expired years ago (about the time Record launched their range in the 1930s I believe).

However the Grant is not an direct copy of the Stanley, it's a exact copy of the Veritas, including a few Veritas inovations. I don't know if that's illegal (that depends on whether LV patented those innovations) but it's not ethical. No way, IMHO.

This has all been discussed before on this forum, and even Rob Lee has expressed an opinion on exact copies of his company's work.

Cheers, Vann.

 

[bugbear]

Vann, There is no ethical issue involved at all. Anyone is commercially able to replicate Stanleys designs as LN and LV have done with whatever additional baubles thery want to add. Its that simple.

Anything else is merely the imagination of the commenter.

regards

Alan

Absolutely correct. Stanleys patents expired long ago so anyone has the right to copy them (as LN and to a lesser degree LV have both done) absolutely identically to the last dimension if they so desire, without any legal recourse (so I'm led to believe )

Copying the Stanley designs is fine. It's copying the cosmetic details of LN in an attempt to imply similar build quality which is dodgy, and close to "passing off".

BugBear

 

[ivan]

LN frogs don't fit Cliftons, unfortunately.

 

[Vann]

LN frogs don't fit Cliftons, unfortunately.

I thought it was a long shot . With which size plane did you try it (if any)?

Vann.

So now I'm wondering if a HA L-N frog would fit a Stanley bedrock - not that I have a Stanley bedrock - just wondering that's all . (I hope there's a cure for this obsession.... :lol: :lol: )

 

[mpooley]

Has anyone actually tried one of these planes?

I would be very interested if they were decently made.

Mike

 

[ivan]

Rutlands have replied that LN frogs will not fit their planes. So as a matter of interest, someone didn't pass the Chinese a LN sample with a request to make this for $5.

Vann, neither the 2" nor 2 3/8" LN frogs will fit Cliftons. Clifton said they didn't think the market big enough for their own when their range first came out, so I have LN 4, 41/2 and 51/2 with high angle frogs. Would rather have given my money to Clifton, but there you are.

 

[Mikey R]

Vann, neither the 2" nor 2 3/8" LN frogs will fit Cliftons. Clifton said they didn't think the market big enough for their own when their range first came out, so I have LN 4, 41/2 and 51/2 with high angle frogs. Would rather have given my money to Clifton, but there you are.

So we have two options:

1) Get enough people to enquire to Cliffton about high angle frogs that they put them into production;
2) Get someone to machine us a high angle frog to fit a Cliffton.

 

[matthewwh]

I use a second blade with a slight back bevel in my smoother, which has exactly the same effect on the geometry as a high angle frog but is much less expensive, easier to swap over and gives you the freedom to alter the pitch to anything you like.

You can even try it out on the supplied blade first. If you're happy, keep that as your back bevelled blade and keep the new one flat, if not, just grind it back past the back bevel and everything is back to normal.

I tried mine at 5 degrees (york) but ended up going much steeper - up around 10-15. It takes a little more effort to push for the same thickness of shaving, but produces a beautiful finish on burred timber and some of the really hard tropicals. In fact, I liked it so much I sold my Norris.