My new folding workbench - I'm after some feedback!

[ardenwoodcraft]

Hello Coach Carpenter,
With regard to the posters who have voiced opinions about getting their bench, tools etc from their vehicle to the job site. Would it be possible to have a wheeled platform type accessory to turn the bench into a kind of sack truck so the bench and tools, transformers, etc could be carried to the job site as one package??

 

[coach-carpenter]

Far to many assumptions going on , the price is the price .
If I was selling these on Ebay I would price at £299 or best offer with free postage and forget listing the same item countless times it doesn't help and is against Ebay policy .Maybe consider putting one up for auction ?

Makes sense. The only reason i've posted the listings so many times is literally so i can see which area gets the most hits and the most watchers and preferably sell the most haha.

The postage thing makes sense. at the end of the day its going to have to be posted no matter where it is.

Thanks

 

[coach-carpenter]

I like the Idea, Like the design and I can see where it could be useful. But the biggest bug bear for me is the amount of time I spend getting tools and kit in and out of the Van. I notice in your vid that you made 3 trips from the Landrover which was only a few feet away. On some of the sites I use I would be lucky to get 800 feet away from the Job. So Extra trips would not be something I would want. So for that reason I'm out :mrgreen:

Thats something im working on. I bought a load of 2.5m black buckle straps and im looking ant how i can utilise the holes in the side to support the shelf and top and then a strap around the perimeter to hold it together.

It wihts 28kg all in so its about 2kg heavier than the standard mft3. So you can carry it all together
Your point also would rule out the axi then?

Thanks for your reply
Where are you based?

I wouldn't have the axi one either. I'm based in South Derbyshire. most of my work is Burton upon Trent, Swadlincote, Measham and Ashby-de-la-Zouch, with the Occasional trips out to Leicester, Nottingham and Birmingham.
Most of my work is Private sector Manufacture and fitting of Bedrooms and Kitchens with the occasional trip to help some friends out on site work.

I currently use two Stanley Plastic saw horses from Screwfix at £20 and A bit of 18mm MDF that I've drilled a series of holes using the Parf Guide system .
They can be carried at the same time in one arm while I carry something else like my transformer or drill box etc. etc.

At the end of the day if that works in your favour then why would you change? If I got on with my trestles and MDF top then i wouldn't of come up with this idea as i'd have no need for it. I couldn't and here i am, but I appreciate that this isn't going to be for everyone and I will never be able to please everyone as well thats impossible.

Cheers RogerBoyle
Coach Carpenter

 

[coach-carpenter]

Hello Coach Carpenter,
With regard to the posters who have voiced opinions about getting their bench, tools etc from their vehicle to the job site. Would it be possible to have a wheeled platform type accessory to turn the bench into a kind of sack truck so the bench and tools, transformers, etc could be carried to the job site as one package??

Certainly a possibility worth looking into and developing. Watch this space. At the end of the day what i want from this is to start a brand, that finds solutions for woodworkers who are otherwise not 100% satisfied with their current set-up. From there I plan on making a range of accessories which would suit say the kitchen fitter over a flooring fitter over a finish carpenter etc and if you're all of them then to have a base package in which different accessories can be used for different tasks.

 

[cantseeitfrommyhouse]

Put some mesh side panels on it and it can double as a travel cot

 

[cantseeitfrommyhouse]

Another option to consider is having the frame made out of glass fibre reinforced plastic. High tooling costs no doubt but possibly cheaper than messing about with CNC and expensive ply. The hinge could then be integrated into the mold.

What is the centre deflection like on the MDF top with no torsion box setup/ cross braces? I like my work table to be flat as a pancake.

 

[coach-carpenter]

Another option to consider is having the frame made out of glass fibre reinforced plastic. High tooling costs no doubt but possibly cheaper than messing about with CNC and expensive ply. The hinge could then be integrated into the mold.

What is the centre deflection like on the MDF top with no torsion box setup/ cross braces? I like my work table to be flat as a pancake.

Have a look at the video i uploaded on Youtube. With two of us jumping up and down on the workbench, the deflection is minimal really. infact it will be exactly the same as on an MFT3 - same size top but much thicker support rails. It's minimal enough for its intended purpose which is all I think that can be asked of it.

 

[coach-carpenter]

Put some mesh side panels on it and it can double as a travel cot

Always open to ideas... can't guarantee it will make it through r&d....

 

[petermillard]

Nice bench - looks like you've put plenty of thought into it, and how it works for you, but I think you're making a mistake if you think that everyone has the same issues that you do with existing portable benches.

By definition, you're trying to sell a finished product (with all that entails - warranty issues, returns, VAT, carriage etc...) to people who are good at making things, and for whom the existing portable benches don't work well enough; how big a market is that, in this country? I see lots of guys using a pair of sawhorses with an mft-style top, or those keter workbenches, or just old workmates, or maybe - being good at making stuff - they made their own to suit their needs. Here's mine, from 2008:-

I made it narrow so it fits on the front paths or hallways of the London terraced houses I mostly work in, with pull-out hooks for doors. Made it short to fit in my van, and it folded up so you can easily carry it one-handed. I still use it today (not as pristine, mind!) because it's perfect - for me. For others, it may be too small, or not sturdy enough, or too low, or whatever. Point is that you've made yours to suit you - it folds up so it fits in your trailer, for example - and not everyone wants what you want.

On top of that, you're asking a few hundred quid for something that, with respect, a lot of people may feel they could easily make from a couple of sheets of ply or MDF. Now maybe there's more of a market there than I think, but even Ron Paulk, after selling 'thousands and thousands' (video) of plans for his benches since 2011 has only just (last month) announced availability of a smaller bench made in association with FastCap, available in kit form or fully assembled. Not to discourage you, but here in Britain with a smaller addressable market and higher costs, I think a one-man-band startup would struggle to sell in significant numbers - but totally happy for you to prove me wrong!

Have you considered selling plans? I feel it may be a simpler way to start.

Best of luck with it - let us know how you get on.

Pete

 

[brianhabby]

The plans idea that several people have mentioned is certainly worth looking at. Making & selling the benches either fully assemble or as a kit pretty much restricts your market to where you can ship them (the UK) but selling plans your market suddenly becomes global - and a lot less work for you.

I saw this video you may find interesting.

regards

Brian

 

[cantseeitfrommyhouse]

Thinking about it, as I have been, plans may not work as it only really works as a CNC cut acurate thing. If you were to build your own it would take ages to set up router templates for all the cuts. just wouldn't be worth it, especially factoring the wastage of ply.

Also, as it stands it only works on flat ground. These days there are some really nice quality sawhorses with adjustable legs (eg: toughbuilt) that you can make an 8x4 table in similarly quick time. (perhaps even out of site materials rather than lugging it from your van).

 

[coach-carpenter]

Nice bench - looks like you've put plenty of thought into it, and how it works for you, but I think you're making a mistake if you think that everyone has the same issues that you do with existing portable benches.

By definition, you're trying to sell a finished product (with all that entails - warranty issues, returns, VAT, carriage etc...) to people who are good at making things, and for whom the existing portable benches don't work well enough; how big a market is that, in this country? I see lots of guys using a pair of sawhorses with an mft-style top, or those keter workbenches, or just old workmates, or maybe - being good at making stuff - they made their own to suit their needs. Here's mine, from 2008:-



I made it narrow so it fits on the front paths or hallways of the London terraced houses I mostly work in, with pull-out hooks for doors. Made it short to fit in my van, and it folded up so you can easily carry it one-handed. I still use it today (not as pristine, mind!) because it's perfect - for me. For others, it may be too small, or not sturdy enough, or too low, or whatever. Point is that you've made yours to suit you - it folds up so it fits in your trailer, for example - and not everyone wants what you want.

On top of that, you're asking a few hundred quid for something that, with respect, a lot of people may feel they could easily make from a couple of sheets of ply or MDF. Now maybe there's more of a market there than I think, but even Ron Paulk, after selling 'thousands and thousands' (video) of plans for his benches since 2011 has only just (last month) announced availability of a smaller bench made in association with FastCap, available in kit form or fully assembled. Not to discourage you, but here in Britain with a smaller addressable market and higher costs, I think a one-man-band startup would struggle to sell in significant numbers - but totally happy for you to prove me wrong!

Have you considered selling plans? I feel it may be a simpler way to start.

Best of luck with it - let us know how you get on.

Pete

I understand where you are coming from but I have to say i don't agree. yes the people who buy these things will have the skills and equipment to build their own of course... how ever they probably lack the time, or want to do that. At the end of the day you essentially saying there's no market - if that was the case then UJK would never have bothered, neither would festool. We can all make a bench - but how many of us actually do?

I have thought many times about plans but as previously said its a last resort for me. I don't see the longevity in it - I'm thinking longer term with this.

I hope I can prove you wrong haha but either way unless I try i'll never know right?

Cheers

Coachy.

 

[coach-carpenter]

The plans idea that several people have mentioned is certainly worth looking at. Making & selling the benches either fully assemble or as a kit pretty much restricts your market to where you can ship them (the UK) but selling plans your market suddenly becomes global - and a lot less work for you.

I saw this video you may find interesting.

regards

Brian

Yeah like i said I already have the plans - it was the first thing i did and my first idea but as mentions above... i'm looking at the long term. Also previous example was Ron Paulk who has only just started selling his benches in kit form - but he's done that because he also believes there's a market for it.

And thanks for that video i was watching it the other day actually I'm subscribed to Marius' videos. I like him and he is entertaining. I've made a set of cam clamps on the band saw but I need to get some more CNC cut.

Coachy.

 

[coach-carpenter]

Thinking about it, as I have been, plans may not work as it only really works as a CNC cut acurate thing. If you were to build your own it would take ages to set up router templates for all the cuts. just wouldn't be worth it, especially factoring the wastage of ply.

Also, as it stands it only works on flat ground. These days there are some really nice quality sawhorses with adjustable legs (eg: toughbuilt) that you can make an 8x4 table in similarly quick time. (perhaps even out of site materials rather than lugging it from your van).

Well the CNC would help with the accuracy but i built my first prototype in the shop and still use it now - it works fine aslong as you take your time marking out.

As for the not working on level ground i'm not sure where you get the idea that you can't use it on un-even ground? I use it all the time outside on uneven paving slaps. If the ground is that bad I stick wedges under the leg - keeps it all flat and sturdy, it's simple and you really don't need anymore than that. Imho usually when working on a site you don't need a dead level workbench - you need it flat and you need it strong

I have always made make shift benches out of saw horses and trestles - most people do and a lot of happy with that. a lot of people however aren't happy with that. especially if the piece of ply you made your bench top out of is the last one that you need to finish the job

Coachy

 

[ColeyS1]

I think the bench is really smart !
To be honest though the only issue I see with making the same, would be getting the holes in the right place. A few notches, cuts and some piano hinge and i can't warrant the price tag. For me,to buy it,the cost would have to be for me to not worth replicating. At 300 quid I could save money by cutting it by hand myself. I admire your ambition, perhaps the hole placement is a unique selling point?

Coley

 

[petermillard]

At the end of the day you essentially saying there's no market - if that was the case then UJK would never have bothered, neither would festool.

Not at all - I'm suggesting that the market is small, and increasingly competitive, e.g. from the UJK and Triton tables you referred to earlier up the thread, from people on eBay with access to a CNC, from people making their own, etc... FWIW I have an MFT but don't use it at job sites as it's way too heavy/unwieldy for me (note space constraints mentioned previously) and is particularly good at things I simply don't need on an install.

FWIW I think your pricing is pretty good, and as I said earlier it's a nice-looking bench that you've clearly put a lot of thought into - if you made one in a size I wanted, I'd probably be interested in buying rather than building, as I know a/. how much birch ply costs, and b/. what my time is worth - but not everyone will see it that way.

We can all make a bench - but how many of us actually do?

Well, you do, and so did I and quite a few other people I know! Seriously, I'm not trying to discourage you or come across as negative at all, and I genuinely wish you all the best with it - just be aware that you're playing in an increasingly crowded field, that IMHO was pretty small to start with.

Cheers, Pete

 

[lurker]

It's nice and you my well sell a few to time poor site chippies and one man shows.
I think your price is decent given the timber and and time saved.

Peter Millard has a good argument as to why you may struggle with your target market.

I would target the "hipsters" who are wealthy, live in pokey rented flats and are into making things not necessarily wood based. It is perfect to use and knock down a few months later when you move flats.
Get on the current fad of these folks "repurposing" ( making carp) .
It's sellable as a "bit of design" in its own right I think.

 

[lurker]

By the way, I'd not sell plans.
You will get them ripped off in no time at all.

 

[lurker]

I have just been watching the u tubes.
A thought struck me, have you ever used pipe cramps like those very popular over the pond?

I bought several of these years ago.... About 10 dollars a throw in Home depot, I think pony brand, Axminster sell a knock off.
A plumber mate "acquired" the pipe in various lengths
They are very versatile and look just the things for your bench

 

[coach-carpenter]

I have just been watching the u tubes.
A thought struck me, have you ever used pipe cramps like those very popular over the pond?

I bought several of these years ago.... About 10 dollars a throw in Home depot, I think pony brand, Axminster sell a knock off.
A plumber mate "acquired" the pipe in various lengths
They are very versatile and look just the things for your bench

I don't think i have - can you give me an example? I', intregued.