Moore & Wright Square question

[sihollies]

Hi all

Probably an simple question for most here, but I am unaware of the correct answer.

I bought an old, small boxed Moore and Wright square several years ago that has 'inspection' etched/scribed on the stock.

Could anyone please advise on the definition of the word 'inspection' in this circumstance?

I'm assuming it is similar to a second class product or similar, because I managed to buy it at a very low cost, but it appears to be perfectly square.

many thanks in advance for your input.

Simon

 

[Inspector]

In machining you can get some tools in several grades or classes. Tool room, inspection, calibration etc. Your square would be a grade better than toolroom, as an inspector would be using it for acceptance.

Pete

 

[sihollies]

Thanks Pete,

You state, 'Your square would be a grade better than toolroom, as an inspector would be using it for acceptance'.

I have no knowledge of toolroom, calibration standards, & sorry to appear naive, but would you say my square, labelled 'inspection' is of high or medium accuracy?

Thankyou in advance,
Simon

 

[TFrench]

It should be VERY high precision. Or at least it was when someone etched it! Theory is the guys on the shop floor use standard (cheaper) equipment, whatever they've made goes to the inspection room to be checked with the REALLY accurate kit, which is in turn checked by the calibration standards which live in a box and only come out to check the measuring equipment.

 

[sihollies]

Many thanks TFrench, that was described perfectly.

Simon

 

[Spectric]

I have no knowledge of toolroom, calibration standards, & sorry to appear naive, but would you say my square, labelled 'inspection' is of high or medium accuracy?

It can only be classed as being of the higher grade if it has had a recent check because it may no longer be the same as it was due to any number of reasons, such as misuse so it's history plays an important part. It is like any instrument or tool that has to meet a certain level of precision or accuracy in that it has to have an upto date traceable calabration certificate.

 

[HamsterJam]

Could it be as simple as a mark added post manufacture to indicate it belonged to the ‘inspection’ team?

 

[D_W]

In the US, inspection is a tool classification for manufacturing / quality control.

Stuff below calibration in plates is B (tool room for general checking), inspection for quality control and I haven't seen anything else for plates, but in squares, certified or calibration level stuff.

But if you get an older tool and it's certified, it doesn't have any real value for that purpose unless it's been checked recently.

I have a 24" certified starrett try square. I have no clue how much one of those would cost. $2000? It's retired from the US navy and somehow found itself into the hands of a university professor who appeared to ask for anything that was no longer in use, and then someone sold it for him after he died. It brought $27 or something on ebay where I got it, or $24. One of those was the item cost, one was the shipping cost. It's fabulous but it's not bright and clean and I'd imagine just the discoloration on it and handling marks would require that it be completely refurbished to be certified again.

It's very unlikely that it's a "b-grade" mark, though. I would also guess that we got our terms in the US from England, just like most other conventions that we use.

The guy who got me into woodworking worked at a mining tool company (think big stuff). They constantly had inspection grade straight edges, etc, coming off of their useful life and one of the things he has is a 48" straight edge that most woodworkers would love to have for power tool setup. I asked him how much it would cost and he said "it's worthless. It's too old to be worth anything in a real shop".

 

[sihollies]

Thanks for all the information, it's really interesting and informative!

I'm not really concerned about the value of the square or the need for certification, as the square is spot on for my needs.

The initial question was really to glean your knowledge as to what the etching/scribing meant

Many thanks again
Simon

 

[yetloh]

The guy who got me into woodworking worked at a mining tool company (think big stuff). They constantly had inspection grade straight edges, etc, coming off of their useful life and one of the things he has is a 48" straight edge that most woodworkers would love to have for power tool setup. I asked him how much it would cost and he said "it's worthless. It's too old to be worth anything in a real shop".

It may be worthless in a "real shop" but I have little doubt that it would do a lot better than that on ebay if properly described. I bought a Grade A Moore and Wright 3' straight edge from a used tool dealer some years ago in excellent cosmetic condition and it has proved to be very useful. If I remember correctly it cost me about £80; I wonder what it would cost me now.

Jim

 

[D_W]

It may be worthless in a "real shop" but I have little doubt that it would do a lot better than that on ebay if properly described. I bought a Grade A Moore and Wright 3' straight edge from a used tool dealer some years ago in excellent cosmetic condition and it has proved to be very useful. If I remember correctly it cost me about £80; I wonder what it would cost me now.

Jim

I told him I would take it!! He declined to give it to me

I later ended up buying a 385-48 starrett for a reference straight edge, but when I did, they weren't nearly as costly as they are now. It remains that so that my "tool room" straight edge can be checked and I can identify unseen and otherwise un-found burrs and file them off.

Retired uplevel tools make great woodworking stuff that is often more accurate, better working and harder than junk sold at woodworkers. and at a lower cost.

 

[D_W]

Btw, what used to be about $220 in a 4 foot beveled straight edge is now over $400 with tax. No clue on the M-W, but it's not hard to find what a starrett version costs.

English measuring stuff doesn't show up here in great amounts because it's modern enough that there was a lot of northeast american manufacturing of the same stuff. But I do have a moore and wright square that I found at a booth flea market (understanding that's a foreign concept there - it's just a permanent retail area where sellers rent a block of space and the owner of the market takes a cut but does the upkeep of the retail area and the selling of the wares).

The M-W square that i have is only negligible amounts out of starrett certified square territory and it's nicely finished. It was really cheap in a booth where used starrett stuff wasn't as cheap.

 

[HOJ]

I inherited this M&W square, trouble is its too heavy to really have much use in a wood shop.

 

[yetloh]

Yours is even bigger than mine!

Jim

 

[Inspector]

Yours is even bigger than mine!

Jim

It isn't always about the size. How you use it is important too.

Pete

 

[HOJ]

It isn't always about the size. How you use it is important too.

I have no idea of its intended use, its unwieldy & heavy, any ideas ? reasonable answers please...

 

[Tony Zaffuto]

I have no idea of its intended use, its unwieldy & heavy, any ideas ? reasonable answers please...

I would say some huge metal machining tool, such as a planer.

 

[cowtown_eric]

I also have a large machinists square...

Use it for proofing carpenters squares, or even cheapo try squares . You'd be suprised how many of them ain't square.

It don't get used too often, but that keeps it from accidental damage...It is housed in wood and almost takes two men and a boy to lift.

To me, it is a total sin to allow and out of swaure square in the workspace. It only leads to frustration or disaster!

 

[yetloh]

You'd be suprised how many of them ain't square.

I wouldn't actually, but I agree entirely with the rest of what you say.

Jim