Making a simple and safe cross cut sled in 10 minutes

[Jacob]

Thinking about the earlier thread Riving knife with crosscut sled how would I make a sled if my sliding table seized up or something

Three pieces of wood. one base, one slider for the track, one fence

Screw base to slider

Make first cut and pencil line nice and square.

Clamp on fence ready for screws.

First cut to trim fence

Cut a bit more off so that the guard can go right down (for thin stuff etc)

Use an offcut up against the workpiece for no spelching out

Finished thing all ready to go

Hold the work piece (and /or the fence) with left hand and push stick in right hand closer to the blade.
Could be modified in all sorts of ways: clamp workpiece to fence, pivot fence for angles, attach holding cams to baseboard for no hands operation, bigger for other workpieces, could use two tracks if you have them, could be t'other side for a left hander etc.....etc etc
Key thing is pushing workpiece up to the fence so your hands are well clear and no leaning over, with blade well covered by the guard, no prob with riving knife, unlike most of the other examples around.

PS push stick is mdf copy of the standard model traced around

 

[Jameshow]

I'd make the fence out if 1x1"

 

[Jacob]

I'd make the fence out if 1x1"

I just picked up a few scraps but you could do it lots of ways.
If fence is higher you can clamp to it.
If you only did small stuff it could be lower.
It's so easy to make you can just knock one up for the job.
Could be wider and extend both sides of the blade, or could be sawn off with just one side etc etc.
Main thing is its much safer and you don't have to worry about riving knife or crown guard - up to the point where you want to do deep cuts.

 

[glenfield2]

And I now know the proper word for splintering out the edge of a crosscut - I thought it was oh ‘bo**ocks!’

 

[Sideways]

Nice one Jacob !
This would be a great complement to a 10 minute improvised router table.
When you need one, they aren't hard to knock up out of scraps.

 

[Jacob]

Nice one Jacob !
This would be a great complement to a 10 minute improvised router table.
When you need one, they aren't hard to knock up out of scraps.

I've used it a bit already. It's quite handy when you don't want the full monty sliding table.
It could be slightly more precise - I might spend 15 minutes making an improved version!

 

[TRITON]

Are you saving up dust for something ?

 

[Jacob]

Are you saving up dust for something ?

It was a rushed job!

 

[TRITON]

 

[Just4Fun]

I don't have a table saw so maybe this is a silly question, but why put the fence on the front edge rather than the back edge? It seems to me that the back edge would be safer because the action of the blade would push the work piece into the fence rather than ripping it out of the hands of a careless operator. What am I missing?

 

[Jacob]

.... What am I missing?

Mainly that with fence at the front you use push sticks which keep your hands away from the blade. Also you don't lean over, or reach over, with a hand holding a push stick.
Try it either way. I find it easier and the workpiece is more visible. A bit counter intuitive for the first minute or so!
Difficult to use a push-stick with a fence at the back - you have to use your hands.

PS Come to think - nearly all the difficulties over there Riving knife with crosscut sled seemed to be because they assume a sled has to be both sides of the blade with a fence bridging it. But in fact you only need it on one side to hold the workpiece - only the offcut falls off on the other side, and it's easier to cut away so that the riving knife and crown guard don't get in the way.
Otherwise you can end up with some pointless mad designs such as the Rockler Rockler Table Saw Small Parts Sled

 

[Agent_zed]

I don't have a table saw so maybe this is a silly question, but why put the fence on the front edge rather than the back edge? It seems to me that the back edge would be safer because the action of the blade would push the work piece into the fence rather than ripping it out of the hands of a careless operator. What am I missing?

I think this is still an ongoing debate and I am mostly with you on the thinking. I do have a similar thing to what Jacob has made and it works fine for most of what I want but it has it's limitations. I'm also not convinced that it is any safer than a correctly designed sledge and worst case I think it has more ability for things to go wrong as you have to hold the workpiece by hand and it is pushing back against nothing. It is also more likely to get chipout.

The other limitation with this design that hasn't been mentioned is that a sledge is designed in such as way that you can make multiple repeated cuts very easil, all you have to do is add a stop block. Jacobs example above requires the user to position the workpiece each time by manually aligning it and hoping you get it in the correct place. If you are cutting a tenon for example you want the cut to be perfect on each side to line up and that takes a lot more time if you are having to align to the front of the fence edge and hope that it doesn't move at all when you push it forward.

This sledge in the following vid is certainly not perfect as I advocate strongly for a blade cover (which could be easily incorporated) and a blade exit cover on the rear fence so the blade is not exposed and you can't put your hands where the blade exits. The addition of C channel for clamps also would allow you to clamp your workpiece in place which is always a good idea. N.B. riving knife in this example is still in place.



Note how easy it is though to cut accurate repeated cuts. You can easily have your hands just as far away from the blade as with a pushstick and instead of holding the workpiece it could be held by a clamp so if something starts going wrong you can remove a hand to turn the machine off. Something that is less easy to do if you are holding a pushstick with one hand and the workpiece with the other.

 

[Jacob]

I think this is still an ongoing debate and I am mostly with you on the thinking. I do have a similar thing to what Jacob has made and it works fine for most of what I want but it has it's limitations. I'm also not convinced that it is any safer than a correctly designed sledge and worst case I think it has more ability for things to go wrong as you have to hold the workpiece by hand and it is pushing back against nothing.

I hold it with two push sticks or left hand and one push stick nearer the blade. Thats what it's pushing against

It is also more likely to get chipout.

You drop in an off-cut behind the cut. Very easy to hold in place with the push stick

The other limitation with this design that hasn't been mentioned is that a sledge is designed in such as way that you can make multiple repeated cuts very easil, all you have to do is add a stop block.

Can add stop blocks in exactly the same way of you make the whole thing double sided like your vid. The big plus of the single front fence is that it doesn't need to bridge the blade. The base plate doesn't get cut right through and the fence just needs enough cut out for the riving knife and crown guard.

 

[Agent_zed]

Can add stop blocks in exactly the same way of you make the whole thing double sided like your vid. The big plus of the single front fence is that it doesn't need to bridge the blade. The base plate doesn't get cut right through and the fence just needs enough cut out for the riving knife and crown guard.

So then it become a sledge that is not quite as strong as the usual designed sledge and cuts on the opposite edge to 'normal' which kind of defeats the point. It would then again provide the potential for putting hands where you shouldn't if someone is tempted to push on the other side of the sledge, rather than use a pushstick on the workpiece.

I'd agree more if it was only the back fence as it would still likely allow the native blade guard to stay in place as it would rise up over the rear fence which wouldn't need to go further than the tallest part of the blade. With the fence at the front the fence would need to go past the tallest part of the blade and continue until the end of the workpiece. I can't see how that can happen with a blade guard in place that is mounted on the riving knife unless you do as you have done which is to remove a section of the fence. This then means you don't have a zero clearance fence and the cut edge is not supported on either side.

There is no doubt what you have made will work, as I use something similar on occasion, but it is missing some advantages of a full sledge.

 

[Jacob]

There is no doubt what you have made will work, as I use something similar on occasion, but it is missing some advantages of a full sledge.

Not that I can see!
n.b. one way to get repeat cuts with a normal one-sided sliding table or sled is to use the table saw fence and set the end of the workpiece to it, with each pass. A short fence is good - you set the position but the off-cut falls free beyond the end of the fence, not between fence and blade. Difficult to describe I'll do a photo later.
But there are lots of ways - my Minimax combi has two stops on the sliding table fence, with spring loaded centre stops which you can use, or override by pressing them in with the workpiece. Could have more stops and have a whole range of settings available, say if you wanted to do half housings etc.

 

[Agent_zed]

Not that I can see!
n.b. one way to get repeat cuts with a normal one-sided sliding table or sled is to use the table saw fence and set the end of the workpiece to it, with each pass. A short fence is good - you set the position but the off-cut falls free beyond the end of the fence, not between fence and blade. Difficult to describe I'll do a photo later.
But there are lots of ways - my Minimax combi has two stops on the sliding table fence, with spring loaded centre stops which you can use, or override by pressing them in with the workpiece. Could have more stops and have a whole range of settings available, say if you wanted to do half housings etc.

Fair enough, at the end of the day it comes down to whatever you are comfortable doing and believe gets you the results you want.

As long as we are all conscious of the safety aspects of the tool in question and how to best avoid injury then each to his own.