Latest F&C

[Nick Gibbs]

I think that is outrageous. I'm sure there's a vein of truth in what you say, but your comment lacks imagination. It's your loss, and exhibits a blatant lack of understanding of the balance between promotion and contribution.

I've put the miles in answering questions (not as many miles as many, but some miles all the same), and I've tried to promote UKW as often as I can in British Woodworking. I'm not trying to undermine or exploit UKW. I think its independence is vital.

Through my magazines I'm trying to achieve what UKW is trying to achieve in another medium. We're trying to provide the best woodworking information and entertainment we can, and survive financially. I'd do far better working for Tesco, Jake, but I believe I have contribution to make, to share the stories and ideas from woodworkers all over the place. UKW can do many things, but there are some things magazines can do better (and vice versa). Long may that unholy, and informal alliance survive.

Nick

 

[big soft moose]

I am sure the many fans will find that an outrageous thing to say,

 

[Jake]

How predictable, fanboys.

This is a thread slagging off another magazine. Are you really so naive?

Anyway, as I said, it's just my view.

 

[Martin Brown]

Jake I am sorry however I have to disagree with your comments. In my view Nick is pretty fair in his coverage. Please understand it is very hard to avoid talking about what you do, and I have bitten my lip many times.

I have known Nick for many years and I know he would be sorry to hear your comments.

I am not a fan. Put me down as an admirer.

Martin

 

[Jake]

I am sure the many fans will find that an outrageous thing to say,

Childish.

 

[Nick Gibbs]

Perhaps I shouldn't have said what I did. I was very emotional about what people were saying in a thread about another mag and wanted to show that it means a lot to me (not just financially, I promise). I wanted to thank members for their support.

Email me your postal address, Jake, and I'll send you a copy or two.

Nick

 

[wizer]

So you're saying we praise Nick's mag just because he's a member here?

I might not be so bright when it comes to woodworking. But I think I'm intelligent enough to realise that I'm sucking up to someone and believe me if I saw something I didn't like in BWW, I'd freely talk about it here.

 

[wizer]

Email me your postal address, Jake, and I'll send you a copy or two.

I hope that was tongue in cheek Nick :lol:

 

[Jake]

Jake I am sorry however I have to disagree with your comments. In my view Nick is pretty fair in his coverage. Please understand it is very hard to avoid talking about what you do, and I have bitten my lip many times.

There are loads of commercial posters who use this forum, some are mods even, the degree of use and exploitation varies. Would you jump in on a thread about a competitor, and thank those who happened to have mentioned you? I suspect not, but that reflects the fact you know (and care) that it is a delicate balance.

I have known Nick for many years and I know he would be sorry to hear your comments.

It isn't the end of the world, he has gained plenty of readers. I'm probably a one off, slightly old school, usenet type of person.

I am not a fan. Put me down as an admirer.

I'm sure he's a lovely bloke just trying to make a living.

 

[Jake]

Email me your postal address, Jake, and I'll send you a copy or two.

I hope that was tongue in cheek Nick :lol:

So do I - utterly shameless :roll:

 

[Nick Gibbs]

I hope that was tongue in cheek Nick :lol:

No. I'll send a copy to anyone. If you're mad enough to put your head above the parapet it's a good idea to share coffee with snipers.

Nick

 

[Shultzy]

Getting back to the thread, maybe the mags have not kept up with each of our knowledge of woodwork. The more we become "experts" in a subject the less extra knowledge is available. Magazines have to appeal to a large x-section of experience and maybe we (or a few) have moved out of the range of some mags.

 

[big soft moose]

I am sure the many fans will find that an outrageous thing to say,

Childish.

thats a troll - in case you didnt get the point :roll: (what else should we call posting outrageous comments while expecting an adverse reaction ?)

I understand that you probably dont like being called a troll but then i'd hazard a guess that nick doesnt care for being called a spammer either.

presumably you will also shortly be taking a pop at philly for answering questions about plane making

 

[big soft moose]

Getting back to the thread, maybe the mags have not kept up with each of our knowledge of woodwork. The more we become "experts" in a subject the less extra knowledge is available. Magazines have to appeal to a large x-section of experience and maybe we (or a few) have moved out of the range of some mags.

thats pretty much it i'd guess - as i said to in reply to ed its a shame theres not a "proffesional woodworker" magazine for the more advanced- but i guess the market share wouldnt be big enough

 

[Nick Gibbs]

Couldn't agree more. Generally, readers of specialist magazines buy a mag for 2-3 years before they outgrow that particular publication and either move on to a more 'advanced' mag, or turn to books etc... I think the Internet has changed that entirely. I think the basic building blocks and questions that need to be asked by a novice can be provided for free through forums and websites. My idea is that you provide a magazine that is interesting to read, that has thought-provoking articles, and keeps changing. Once I'm really up and running (it may take a few years) we'll provide articles on how to cut a tenon on our website (with video to be used in the workshop on your iPad), and our magazines will be really good reads you take to the bog or the bath or the train. Hopefully, with a following wind and some good fortune, I'll make that happen.

Nick

 

[Jake]

I am sure the many fans will find that an outrageous thing to say,

Childish.

thats a troll - in case you didnt get the point :roll: (what else should we call posting outrageous comments while expecting an adverse reaction ?)

I understand that you probably dont like being called a troll but then i'd hazard a guess that nick doesnt care for being called a spammer either.

I'm not upset, I just think you are being small-minded and slightly ridiculous. It isn't trolling simply to anticipate the fact that people like you would react exactly that like, just that as a father to a toddler, it is predictable.

To be a troll, the point of my post would have had to be to provoke people like you into a reaction.

 

[Nick Gibbs]

Oh, and I forgot to mention, my vision is for something British, not American.

Nick

 

[big soft moose]

Oh, and I forgot to mention, my vision is for something British, not American.

Nick

too right - nothing turns me off faster than murrican magazines (and dvds etc) not least because they seem to consider a three car garage workshop to be small.

IMO you are well on the way with BWW - the impressive thing for me was for example the length and breadth you gave over to ollys article , which runs to about 6 pages plus a couple of tests, wheras some of the other magazines ive read in the past would have tried to cram it into a 2 page spread

 

[Nick Gibbs]

I'm not a vindictive man generally. I thought sending a free copy of British Woodworking to Jake might be seen as a hand of friendship. He has refused to accept my offer, not once but three times. Strange.

See some of you, I hope, at Rycotewood. That's not spam, just a friendly greeting. Good night.

Nick

 

[wizer]

Jake I rather think Pete's hit the nail on the head. Being that Nick was saying thank you for unprovoked praise, it couldn't be called spamming in any way shape or form. Did you even read Nick's initial post? I'd like to know what you thought was spam? You even said in your original post that you knew people would disagree and find your comments outrageous, which they where. Trolling is when someone posts provocative comments meant only to stir up angry or hostile debate. You then go on to insult those of us who have praised Nick's magazine by calling us fanboys. Rather than just calling us childish or arse lickers, can you explain exactly what Nick has done to offend you? Is it just Nick's participation that offends you or will anyone who owns a woodworking related business immediately loose your custom because they post here, sometimes mentioning their products.

Maybe it's the fact that we are slagging off one magazine without slagging off his? Well I'm sure Nick's magazine has it's faults, there are still editorial issues IIRC. But in general the whole feel of the magazine is slightly different to all the others and appears to put more emphasis on articles rather than patronising how-tos. His review style is also more down to earth and trustworthy. Maybe you should read a few copies to find out why we enthuse about it. Is it that you are suspicious of a product when lots of people praise it?

Like so often, people talk more loudly about things they don't like, which is why this thread has attracted attention. However, F&C is the only other mag that I will buy from time to time and I do enjoy some aspects of it. They appear to have an interest in modern furniture and what's going on with UK makers. Personally that's one aspect I wish they'd concentrate on more. To be honest the reviews of bigger machinery isn't too much of an issue to me. Someone has to write for the pro end the market and I think this is where F&C should aim. Whoever said it's gone down hill since Colin are probably right. Their sister mag Woodturning is well edited by Mark Baker and I enjoy that very much.