Joseph Marples try squares
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Not sure on those. I got a small one from eBay which I find invaluable. It is similar to http://bit.ly/1d4BS6i (if link works) but didn't have the card and was a couple of quid cheaper. I seem to think it was from eBay USA.
It is really handy for small pieces and machine fence setting.
Once you have one decent one you can take it to wherever to check the next one you buy. A 6" one is also handy.
The ones you show will probably be fine. Alternatively look at what axminster offer. Engineers squares seem to be better than carpenters ones. Even the b grade engineering ones will be fine for wood.
It is really handy for small pieces and machine fence setting.
Once you have one decent one you can take it to wherever to check the next one you buy. A 6" one is also handy.
The ones you show will probably be fine. Alternatively look at what axminster offer. Engineers squares seem to be better than carpenters ones. Even the b grade engineering ones will be fine for wood.
RB61
Member
marcros":3g4fsga8 said:
Thanks for the link. I have been looking for a double square also.
Since I am in the US, I assume Axminster may be too costly due to shipping, but I will look.
condeesteso
Established Member
They are nicely done, and from an excellent stable (nicely seasonal, that). I have a large one (10" approx from memory) and use it occasionally. But for everyday joint etc work I use engineer's squares (cheap, robust and do the job very well I think). I also have one of these Japanese squares which I like a lot, partly because it is bombproof:
Another gem is the budget Rolson 4" sliding square - around a tenner and invaluable for marking out (I have an expensive Starrett 6" but tend to use the Rolson more as its size suits my joint sizes better and it fits the pocket.
I don't know about you, but I do occasionally drop these things. experience has led me to the robust and/or economic options :lol:
Another gem is the budget Rolson 4" sliding square - around a tenner and invaluable for marking out (I have an expensive Starrett 6" but tend to use the Rolson more as its size suits my joint sizes better and it fits the pocket.
I don't know about you, but I do occasionally drop these things. experience has led me to the robust and/or economic options :lol:
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Preston
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I like the Joseph Marples Marking, Mortice and cutting gauges, they make some special additions for our shop but I have chosen not to stock the Try squares. The Japanese squares above are excellent particularly for veneer work otherwise we use Fisher engineers squares 2",3",4" for Dovetail and small joint work, 6" for bench work and 9" and 12" for large setting out. We have tested cheaper squares which just aren't square and have used more expensive but with no real workshop benefit. A good quality engineers square should last and stay accurate for a lifetime, the Marples are more attractive but I would not be confident of the accuracy over the long term.
Graham Orm
Established Member
Bahco combi squares. I have a couple. Good quality and value for money. They come in different sizes. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bahco-CS400-C ... 35c3f338a4
David C
In Memorium
Peter,
Where do you get your Fischer squares from please?
David
Where do you get your Fischer squares from please?
David
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David C":2m6o1eee said:
Hi David
We get them from the manufacturer and carry them all in the tool shop along with the Satin Chrome rules.
Cheers Peter
custard
Established Member
I can very much recommend the marking/cutting gauges that Peter makes from the standard Marple versions. You could make them your self but it's a bit of a faff, and as Peter's version are so well executed there's little point in not using his.
Cheshirechappie
Established Member
Just in case anybody is slightly confused, the firm of Joseph Marples is NOT the same as the William Marples the prolific chisel and plane blade maker, now sadly absorbed into the Irwin Tool empire. Joseph Marples have been independent since 1840, and have always specialised in marking-out tools for woodworkers. Their website is http://www.marples.co.uk/
The squares shown in the photo above are from their premium 'Trial 1' range, except for the little 3". Their website states that their squares are made to slightly better accuracy than stated in BS3322, and are square on both inside and outside to better than 0.01mm per 10mm of blade length, so a 6" square should be less than 0.15mm (6 thousands of an inch) out of square over it's full blade length. (I think I'm right in saying that BS3322 only calls for squareness on the outside of the blade, and sets no standard for the inside. Marples clearly do better than this.)
I'd say they should serve well - but despite the manufacturer's assurances, it would pay to check for squareness when you first receive the tool, and return for replacement if it's off the mark. The easy way to check is to find a nice clean board, joint an edge straight, then set the square against it, and with a DEAD SHARP pencil, strike a line on the board on both the inside and outside of the blade, being careful to keep the pencil at the same attitude to wood and blade for the full stroke. Then flip the square over, and carefully compare the marked lines to the edges that marked them. They should be bob on.
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The squares I find most useful are a Marples 6" I use for 'near enough' jobs such as setting out rough stock, a little 2" engineer's square for laying out joints and fiddly work, and a 12" Marples for bigger stuff. I need to add a really big square for carcase work, but I think I'll make one (about 24" or a bit bigger) from some nice, stable hardwood, and use it only with pencils and for checking. A steel roofing square world be an alternative, but I've heard too many tales of gross out-of-squareness from budget ones, and I'm far too tight to shell out for a premium one.
For anybody thinking about an engineer's square, Moore and Wright, Mitutoyo, Starrett and Browne and Sharp are considered the 'premium' makers. The Fisher squares mentioned above will be perfectly satisfactory for even fine cabinet work, but do be a tad careful with budget Ebay ones - they may be fine, but check on receipt.
The squares shown in the photo above are from their premium 'Trial 1' range, except for the little 3". Their website states that their squares are made to slightly better accuracy than stated in BS3322, and are square on both inside and outside to better than 0.01mm per 10mm of blade length, so a 6" square should be less than 0.15mm (6 thousands of an inch) out of square over it's full blade length. (I think I'm right in saying that BS3322 only calls for squareness on the outside of the blade, and sets no standard for the inside. Marples clearly do better than this.)
I'd say they should serve well - but despite the manufacturer's assurances, it would pay to check for squareness when you first receive the tool, and return for replacement if it's off the mark. The easy way to check is to find a nice clean board, joint an edge straight, then set the square against it, and with a DEAD SHARP pencil, strike a line on the board on both the inside and outside of the blade, being careful to keep the pencil at the same attitude to wood and blade for the full stroke. Then flip the square over, and carefully compare the marked lines to the edges that marked them. They should be bob on.
-------
The squares I find most useful are a Marples 6" I use for 'near enough' jobs such as setting out rough stock, a little 2" engineer's square for laying out joints and fiddly work, and a 12" Marples for bigger stuff. I need to add a really big square for carcase work, but I think I'll make one (about 24" or a bit bigger) from some nice, stable hardwood, and use it only with pencils and for checking. A steel roofing square world be an alternative, but I've heard too many tales of gross out-of-squareness from budget ones, and I'm far too tight to shell out for a premium one.
For anybody thinking about an engineer's square, Moore and Wright, Mitutoyo, Starrett and Browne and Sharp are considered the 'premium' makers. The Fisher squares mentioned above will be perfectly satisfactory for even fine cabinet work, but do be a tad careful with budget Ebay ones - they may be fine, but check on receipt.
Jacob
What goes around comes around.
One really handy feature is to have a square which will sit on the work without falling off, so the balance of blade width/length against stock length is crucial. It may seem a detail but if you have a lot of marking up to do it really helps e.g. a sash window or anything with a lot of components.
Most of them don't do this so it's worth comparing them and having at least one which will stay still. I've got one which does - an old 4" Marples type which I use a lot. The newer ones may not have the same geometry.
Other than that I use an old Rabone combi and/or a variety of odds n ends of squares, set squares etc.
For woodwork marking-up only the outer edge of the blade is used so it's easy to straighten up a dud one if necessary.
Most of them don't do this so it's worth comparing them and having at least one which will stay still. I've got one which does - an old 4" Marples type which I use a lot. The newer ones may not have the same geometry.
Other than that I use an old Rabone combi and/or a variety of odds n ends of squares, set squares etc.
For woodwork marking-up only the outer edge of the blade is used so it's easy to straighten up a dud one if necessary.
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I use both the inside and outside of the square. The outside for marking and the inside for testing for squareness of planed timber etc.
As for balance whist on the work the Incra squares are designed and made with a rebated stock for just this purpose.
http://incra.com/product_squareangles.htm
Cheers Peter
As for balance whist on the work the Incra squares are designed and made with a rebated stock for just this purpose.
http://incra.com/product_squareangles.htm
Cheers Peter
RB61
Member
Cheshirechappie":3n0mllcm said:
Thanks for the clarification regarding the Marples name. Industry "consolidation" like this makes life frustrating for people that are new to the craft and potentially expensive if one has to buy a tool twice.
Ray
condeesteso
Established Member
Jacob's point about balance / stability is well worth noting and almost always overlooked by the makers I think. Obviously the square is held whilst actually marking, but the number of times I have wanted to leave it there while I reach for something or wander away - maybe that is why I have dropped the odd one sometimes :shock:
Re J Marples, I greatly respect their continued independence and the tools are a million miles from the Irwin Marples offerings - but I would personally like to see them investing (I mean effort, not simply capital) in evolution - most of the marking tools they offer have not changed in many decades whilst newer competitors have been evolving and innovating. You don't have to like the 'new fangled' variants, but what others have been doing is taking sales from J Marples surely? They could do both - keep the Trail One series for traditional quality, and develop some newer variants. They are one of the very few remaining toolmakers in Sheffield - I would like to think they will be thriving decades from now.
Re J Marples, I greatly respect their continued independence and the tools are a million miles from the Irwin Marples offerings - but I would personally like to see them investing (I mean effort, not simply capital) in evolution - most of the marking tools they offer have not changed in many decades whilst newer competitors have been evolving and innovating. You don't have to like the 'new fangled' variants, but what others have been doing is taking sales from J Marples surely? They could do both - keep the Trail One series for traditional quality, and develop some newer variants. They are one of the very few remaining toolmakers in Sheffield - I would like to think they will be thriving decades from now.
Sheffield Tony
Ghost of the disenchanted
The remaining tool manufacturers on Sheffield - Joseph Marples, Thomas Flinn, Clifton, Crown, Henry Taylor, Footprint all make mostly traditional tools. Well, if you exclude the oddball Crown multi-angle square thingy ! I suspect that they have done their market research and have chosen to cater for those wanting tools like they used to be. The alternative puts you in competition with lots of newfangled - and more mass produced stuff.condeesteso":1lm4r76o said:
I've got a Trial 1 mitre square. Very nice and traditional. I got it to replace a Silverline 44 degree square :wink:
