Is a multi function workshop a flying submarine?

[TRITON]

Hi Triton,

And Hi back
Before we get into it, just to say i didnt see you'd finished the pics and very nice it looks too, though a little sparse, which believe me will change, if everyone elses workshop on here is anything to go by
A first suggestion, given the amount of space you have and positioning of machinery, might i suggest looking for a big extractor and ducting, and also some sort of air cleaner. Once you start routing, sanding and using that mitre saw, the ultra fine dangerous dust is going to go everywhere. Best make allowances off the bat for that, before you really get into the big projects.

that's interesting - are you worried you might regret taking the wheels off in the long run?

Not a lot of choice really, wheels, even 8(4 per) kind of make a bench a bit wobbly, especially when planing, hammering etc, and im kind of used to a big immovable 9x4 joiners bench.
Plus the tops of these things is a simple 12 or 15mm thick top thats little good for anything. My option was always to use an mft and I bought the parf system for it, so if you add that on height wise, the height is a lot higher than im used to. These steel drawer units arent meant for woodworking really. The tops have no overhanging edges which makes clamping pretty much impossible.
It is 2 of these units im using back to back.
https://www.homebase.co.uk/36-mobile-workbench-with-tool-storage/12840868.htmlSo taking everything into account, adding the mft, plus space underneath it, the height would have been way too high and the only way to lower it to a safe and comfortable height is to remove the wheels and wheels off gives me an extra 160mm to play with. More than enough for an mft unit with tool space even a couple of drawers beneath.

Everything else will be on wheels and can be moved about. If the bench is offset rather than the middle of the room, I can use the wider area for something like thicknessing/planing, the drum sander or whatever, then have the actual bit i stand at opposite side meaning im not too encroached. I should have access all around, maybe 3' one side, 2' on the others and a bit tighter where the bigger machines will sit.
Its tight, but beggars cant be choosers and i can make do.

All wall units will start at a height of 4 or 5 feet above the floor. Mostly flat shelves to take the festool boxes, an area for clamps*- sash/G/F QR, and higher up maybe small cupboards for the thousand other bits you seem to collect over 20 years.

* On the subject of clamps. You appear to be missing 50 of them

I do actually have a 3rd bedroom, currently its classified as 'the bike room'. Im a multi bike cyclist with all the bike kit and tools to build and service my own. I can utilize some of that space for timber, or other things i wont need as much.

 

[Wildman]

I have done a bit of thinking recently about workshop design, and it occurred to me that other people may find this interesting so sharing my ideas and thought process here. You may find this particularly useful if you have a tendency for over planning and going round in circles and not getting things done. In fact that is probably the only reason you would find this interesting because there is not a lot of actual knowledge in there.

BACKGROUND

I now have my 4m x 3.5m workshop space ready. When I say ready its not really ready - its a mostly bare room (essentially) and it needs some further work to make it usable. I have been going around in circles a little bit with the next stages of the planning and the reasons for that are (I think) as follows:

• There is a lot of information out there about different workshop design options
• I have a general tendency to overplan things and not commit to ideas for fear of them not being perfect
• I have multiple 'functions' that I want out of the space, and this is adding ambiguity and complexity inside my head

PICS OF CURRENT STATUS
View attachment 142014
View attachment 142021

View attachment 142016
View attachment 142017
View attachment 142018

Having spent time on youtube, and also in books, reviewing different workbench / storage options I realised that I was starting in the wrong place and also analysing in the wrong direction. I was starting with the solutions and then applying them to my potential 'problems', without even knowing what my potential problems/needs were. Give a man a hammer and everything will look like a nail!
Problem is not really the right word, it is more 'functions' i.e.

What do I want the space to do for me? Or...
What are its 'functions'?

So, I realised that it wasn't 100% clear what my workshop 'solutions' looked like because I wasn't 100% clear what my needs (functions) were. I decided to list them all out. And then it became clear how ridiculous my 'requirements' or intended functions were. There appeared to be a lot of incompatibility between them all. No wonder I was going around in circles :-D

Here is my list

FUNCTIONS
1. Workshop (configurable)
2. Office
3. Exercising
4. Relaxing

*I have decided that the configurable element is really a sub-function of the workshop part only and therefore have embedded it there as opposed to a separate 'fifth' function

With the functions clear, I then broke it down into physical things. What I mean by that is what physical objects will I need in order to satisfy all the functions and is it even possible to have all those different things in one space.

THINGS

Workshop
Workbench(s)
Storage (SIZE: large / medium / small TYPE: drawers / shelves / cupboards)
Dust extraction
Castors (makes it configurable - applies to all 'floor' components)
*I have oversimplified this for now, restricting myself to high level categories, so I can at least plan out all the basic functions without getting bogged down in details like I normally do

Office
Desk
Chair
Monitor (not essential)

Exercise
Floor space + mat (for calisthenics)
Weights / bench (not essential)

Relaxing (optional / nice to have)
Comfy chair
Relaxing space (no dust, no clutter)
Access to 'relaxing stuff' (books / headphones etc)

CONCLUSIONS AT THIS POINT
So after listing out all these things and giving it some further thought, there appears to be quite a lot of 'stuff' that would need to fit into the space. So here are my current thoughts on my priorities:

• Function 1: it has become clear that primarily this is a workshop. My plan is to get more into woodworking as a hobby, and the space was always created as a workshop, so I must not lose sight of that and allow that to be compromised too much
• Function 2: I do also need it to be an office, but more for occasional use, say one day a week, rather than a 5 days a week type thing. This means the office part should not dominate or compromise the workshop part
• Function 3: I would like to be able to exercise in there, not sure how regularly yet - I may end up with a separate gym membership in future which would pretty much eliminate the need for this function
• Function 4: I would like to be able to use the space as a place to just go and relax, sit down with a book or listen to music - to do that it needs to be free of dust and clutter (because I have a heightened sensitive to clutter). I have set this as a 'nice to have' function due to the obvious incompatibilities with the workshop, but it would be great if I can get this to work alongside the other things.

SHORT VERSION
The space will be optimised for workshop use with provisions for office use, and will have exercising and relaxing options thrown in if they don't compromise item 1 and 2.

CONSIDERATIONS
• You need a bench to build a bench - its probably not realistic to try and build an 8ft Roubo on a B&D workmate, so I should start with something simple and go up in stages.
• Dust from the workshop creates problems for the other functions so need to think about that - putting certain things in cupboards (monitor), and/or having good extraction
• Compromise - I dont have the space or budget for everything I might want in an ideal world (birch ply, valchromat, Benchdogs MFT shiny stuff, Incra fences/router lifts etc) so I need to be realistic / sensible. Ooh ooooh, I'm not good at that normally...
• Over planning - I need to overcome my normal tendencies and not put TOO much thought into this. It's probably too late in reality but I can at least stop it spiralling further out of control. Or can I....
• I have decided not to design in any provision for a table saw - I will manage with a track saw and this saves me some space and money.
• I am not planning on spending much time thinking about 'workflow' and positioning of machines to optimise that - in a small space like mine and for hobby use, it doesn't matter much I don't think. Especially as its all on castors and hence can be changed anyway...
• I will however think about location of certain machines in terms of infeed and outfeed space, but again, its not really that important as everything will be mobile, so I can work that stuff out on the fly and change it accordingly.
• I will situate the mitre saw and bandsaw near the french doors so i can extend my infeed or outfeed easily - I was cutting 4m long skirting boards the other day and this ended up as the natural place for the mitre saw to be.
• I dont want to create big cumbersome things like a fixed mitre saw station, I would prefer to have a slimline cart for a mitre saw that can be combined with other vanilla (modular) benches of the same height so i can easily create a mitre saw station, only when needed.
• In general, because this is a small space, I want to maximise every bit of space - if I get sloppy with the design, I feel I will run out of space really quickly.


GENERAL PLAN
Staged approach: I am going to start by building a very basic bench that has some storage - this will get me a usable flat surface to work on and also a basic amount of storage so I have access to tools I use frequently. From there I can start to expand my empire, building additional storage and if needed more advanced benches. By advanced I mean pointlessly complex.
Desk / bench: Having a 'traditional' desk (4 legs and a top) is wasteful on space and I would like to look at the alternatives. Either a fold up / fold out type thing, or a hybrid desk / bench with storage space included. The key thing is being able to get my legs underneath, which makes a 'normal' bench unsuitable - I need to think about how to do it.
Storage: I quite like the idea of a french cleat system, perhaps on the 'grey' wall at the back, the strips of ply on dark grey would look pretty cool I reckon. I know workshops are not living rooms but if i can make it look cool at same time as being functional then why not. My worry the cleat system is I will spend too long making bespoke 'hangy' things for it as opposed to actually building 'stuff'. And is it really needed....


SKETCHES
I just have one sketch of the potential layout so far:
View attachment 142019

The two unlabelled rectangles are modular benchs / carts that can have storage under them but also work as either infeed / outfeed for other things, or as assembly tables

Here are my two current sketches for the combined bench / workshop:
View attachment 142020

I would like to utilise the space under the desk when its not a desk, I am thinking that a shop vac / dust extractor could go there, and the chair for the desk needs a home I suppose...


THINGS FOR THINKING ABOUT LATER
Bench design / type
Storage configuration

QUESTIONS

• Any general feedback?
• Anybody know of any small workshops (youtube vids etc)?
• Anybody know of any cool workshops for me to take a look at?
• What about workshops with multiple functions like what I am trying to do? I have looked around and I dont really see anybody trying to do multi function in one room, maybe its a terrible idea....
• Any other inspirational sources I should be looking at?

And back to the title of the post, is a multi function workshop really a flying submarine? i.e. does the design architecture of one thing conflict with the design architecture of the other?
Plane: (flies = lightweight)
Sub: (resists pressure=heavy)

I really need to work on being more succinct.

Martin

You have thought of almost everything except "Rogers' Law" i.e. junk accumulates according to the space available for it. Good luck with that and law number 2, if it is a bargain buy it, then worry about where to put it. i.e. build another shed.

 

[Molynoox]

And Hi back
Before we get into it, just to say i didnt see you'd finished the pics and very nice it looks too, though a little sparse, which believe me will change, if everyone elses workshop on here is anything to go by
A first suggestion, given the amount of space you have and positioning of machinery, might i suggest looking for a big extractor and ducting, and also some sort of air cleaner. Once you start routing, sanding and using that mitre saw, the ultra fine dangerous dust is going to go everywhere. Best make allowances off the bat for that, before you really get into the big projects.


Not a lot of choice really, wheels, even 8(4 per) kind of make a bench a bit wobbly, especially when planing, hammering etc, and im kind of used to a big immovable 9x4 joiners bench.
Plus the tops of these things is a simple 12 or 15mm thick top thats little good for anything. My option was always to use an mft and I bought the parf system for it, so if you add that on height wise, the height is a lot higher than im used to. These steel drawer units arent meant for woodworking really. The tops have no overhanging edges which makes clamping pretty much impossible.
It is 2 of these units im using back to back.
https://www.homebase.co.uk/36-mobile-workbench-with-tool-storage/12840868.htmlSo taking everything into account, adding the mft, plus space underneath it, the height would have been way too high and the only way to lower it to a safe and comfortable height is to remove the wheels and wheels off gives me an extra 160mm to play with. More than enough for an mft unit with tool space even a couple of drawers beneath.

Everything else will be on wheels and can be moved about. If the bench is offset rather than the middle of the room, I can use the wider area for something like thicknessing/planing, the drum sander or whatever, then have the actual bit i stand at opposite side meaning im not too encroached. I should have access all around, maybe 3' one side, 2' on the others and a bit tighter where the bigger machines will sit.
Its tight, but beggars cant be choosers and i can make do.

All wall units will start at a height of 4 or 5 feet above the floor. Mostly flat shelves to take the festool boxes, an area for clamps*- sash/G/F QR, and higher up maybe small cupboards for the thousand other bits you seem to collect over 20 years.

* On the subject of clamps. You appear to be missing 50 of them

I do actually have a 3rd bedroom, currently its classified as 'the bike room'. Im a multi bike cyclist with all the bike kit and tools to build and service my own. I can utilize some of that space for timber, or other things i wont need as much.

Yes I am indeed 50 clamps short of the required number... n+1, where n is the number of clamps currently owned. Same with bikes is it not although I've got rid of my road bike now

 

[Jameshow]

Yes I am indeed 50 clamps short of the required number... n+1, where n is the number of clamps currently owned. Same with bikes is it not although I've got rid of my road bike now

I've got 6 road bikes got rid of my MTB to my son!

 

[Jacob]

.................

I really need to work on being more succinct.

Martin

Absolutely! Some overthinking going on here! Too long to read.
Main thing with sorting out a workshop is to get into making things.
You soon find out what you need, and it's a continuous process permanently under review.
It's not like kitchen design.
To be "more succint" just start making things. You'll soon find out what "storage configuration" you need.
What are you hoping to make BTW, or is it too soon to say?

 

[Molynoox]

Absolutely! Some overthinking going on here! Too long to read.
Main thing with sorting out a workshop is to get into making things.
You soon find out what you need, and it's a continuous process permanently under review.
It's not like kitchen design.
To be "more succint" just start making things. You'll soon find out what "storage configuration" you need.
What are you hoping to make BTW, or is it too soon to say?

workshop is in full swing now (this is an old thread), serving its primary functions pretty well

the wheels on all the units mean that I am not really committing to any particular layout and the space continues to evolve with me
One recent addition was a small desk that folds away when not in use

It's all working pretty well but I need more storage for timber

Martin

 

[Molynoox]

Here is an update on my goals for a multi use room.

I have the workshop working well, I've just installed a little office area, and I am almost ready with the fitness zone.

I've also found that my office chair is comfy enough to sit and chill, read, listen to music.

So out of the 4 original functions I'm pretty much there with all 4 in one space.

Cheers!

Martin

 

[Cabinetman]

I am pleased that you have found a workable solution for your workspace. I am at a loss though to understand how you find the time to keep it so clean and do much woodwork in it, you’re obviously not like me, lol. I could make such a complete and utter mess of it in a couple of hours that it would take days to clear up. I’m probably envious deep down.
Ian

 

[Molynoox]

I am pleased that you have found a workable solution for your workspace. I am at a loss though to understand how you find the time to keep it so clean and do much woodwork in it, you’re obviously not like me, lol. I could make such a complete and utter mess of it in a couple of hours that it would take days to clear up. I’m probably envious deep down.
Ian

Hi Ian,

Yeah I can understand you being a bit baffled by it, it looks a bit like one of those sterile YouTube channels and you wonder if they ever do any woodworking There are three reasons for it in my case:

• I don't do woodworking very much - the odd weekend here and there when I have a project I'm working on - I will probably do it a bit more often once I get my life organised
• I have OCD and a high sensitivity to clutter - as such I clear up pretty much every time I make a mess, otherwise I can't relax.
• Because I do yoga in there, and other types of exercise, I need the floors to be clean at all times - so I tend to make sure it's clean for the next visit. It can be a bit annoying but it's no different from how you work in a kitchen, you never walk off leaving food remains allover the worktop so once in the habit it's not so bad.

In general, I get a certain sense of calm from an organised space, it's partly what I like about having the space in the first place. It's my little zone for having my stuff just how I want it. I'm on the end of the bell curve, but I always have been

Martin

 

[Cabinetman]

Oh yes, that explains it well. The word Zen comes to mind, but actually it isn’t lol.

 

[Molynoox]

I think you've already identified the main problem - overthinking. I would advise turning the whole thing on its head. Decide on something you would like to make and JFDI. "But I haven't got a bench" I hear you say. Well get one. You don't have to make one; there's plenty of s/h ones out there. "But where can I put my tools?" Where are they at the moment? Can they stay there for a while? Just make sure you have the essential kit available for the next stage of your project. Take it step by step.
While you're making do and actually achieving something you can also be planning ahead on the next development for the workshop. You've already decided to make things flexible by having units movable on castors (BTW, having just bought a set of casters, I've found that the latter is a perfectly acceptable spelling)
While on the subject of casto(e)rs find a set for your mind. Allow yourself to make mistakes and learn from them. Let the workshop evolve. Let your requirements evolve. After a time I suspect you'll come to the conclusion that it's a workshop, not a lounge, not a gym and not an office. You haven't got enough space for it to be of multifunctional use.
Brian

Hi Brian,

I've just read through / revisited this thread again and wanted to highlight that the advice you gave above is spot on - very similar to what many others were saying too, but I liked your bit about 'planning ahead for next evolution while already using the space' instead of big bang style where everything is planned to death before doing anything.

you were wrong about the last part though, haha :-D workshop is now serving all functions, obviously its compromised, but its good enough at everything that the sum of the parts are worth more than a single function done perfectly.

Martin