How would you rate the UK's handling of this pandemic?

[selly]

It’s okay Selly. I’ll wait for Selwyn to come along with his data sources and consider them. Thanks again.
[/QUOTE

You'd be better off just staying in your bedroom for the next 2 years

 

[RobinBHM]

t's naive to think that lockdown is stopping a seasonal respiratory disease and is

WRONG

Covid is not currently seasonal, it is a pandemic.

Go and read the WHO

 

[RobinBHM]

Ad hominem

It is a deflection tactic used by those who have no counter argument.

Routinely used in this thread by those who believe there is a better option than lockdowns (but are never able to provide any detail).

 

[RobinBHM]

Look at the Swedish data and the diamond Princess for a start

Neither prove lockdowns don't work

 

[RobinBHM]

Nz and Australia are not so useful because they quarantined before things became endemic

Thank you for agreeing lockdowns work

Viroligists have been say since start of last year: the harder and faster you lockdown, the less economic damage there is and less deaths.

 

[RobinBHM]

And what a mess we will have afterwards to sort out. There will be potentially 500k excess deaths to deal with and huge unemployment. Lockdown fanatics will probably claim it was worth

Ah the stock answer of the anti lockdowners.

Selly do you not realise no lockdown would quite simply mean community infection levels would be so high, many more people would become ill overloading hospitals.

That would lead to massive excess deaths Covid and non Covid and mass unemployment.

 

[RobinBHM]

They want sensible measures but want to keep the economy going

UK lockdowns have always kept the economy going.

 

[Rorschach]

Thanks ... but isn’t this the key graph (taken from the link you provided) which doesn’t show a peak before intevention?

View attachment 101620

That wouldn't be the graph I would use for that determination.

 

[Deadeye]

Asked what her updated estimate for the Infection Fatality Rate is, Professor Gupta says, “I think that the epidemic has largely come and is on its way out in this country so I think it would be definitely less than 1 in 1000 and probably closer to 1 in 10,000.” That would be somewhere between 0.1% and 0.01%.

Spent half an hour on the phone with my step daughter and this is in line with what she talked about at the hospital where she works. She's a nurse in A&E and her hospital now has an additional ward for covid patients. She spent some time yesterday sitting with a patient until the patient's daughter arrived....the patient was classed as "end of life" so relatives are allowed in. My daughter now hates going to work because of having to deal with situations like that on a daily basis...she's not even on the covid wards but dailly has to deal with the idiots using A&E as a doctor's surgery for minor/insignificant "injuries" like a scratch on a finger who think the pandemic is just a hoax whilst 23 (that's the number she told me) ambulances queue up outside the hospital because there aren't enough staff and beds to deal with them.

Why am I posting this?

1. Because I'm worried to death about my 2 step daughters; one is a nurse who works in A&E and her twin is a care assistant in a care home. The latter tested positive for covid 10 days ago and thankfully has got through it OK.....this time.
2. Because I am sick to death of seeing the keyboard warriors on this forum who have no contact with day to day reality posting comments based on nothing more than sitting at home googling opinions and statistics that they have found which agree with their agenda. Statistics are are not reality; they can be presented in numerous ways to say the say the same thing; e.g. they was one yesterday saying that there is a 40% increase in getting the virus if you didn't have the second vaccine within a certain time but if you checked the data it could also be presented as 4% increase...same data just expressed another way but obviously not as sensational and headline grabbing.
3. Those that argue against the lockdowns...speak to my step daughter who is the nurse and listen to what she and her colleagues think of your "theories"....I'd personnally like to see those "free thinkers" endure just for one week in a hospital...I doubt any of them would survive it.

I've no expectation of any rational response/discussion to this from any of the keyboard warriors that have caused me to write this post so my apologies if I don't respond... too many other important things to worry about at the moment like my family.

Not sure who you're including in your "keyboard warriers".

My son is an A&E doctor; my daughter is an HCA pending going to medical school; I used to be a virologist and currently sit on an acute hospital Board.

I've provided a pre-publication paper authored by people that would be widely seen as expert; I've provided a website collating evidential, peer-reviewed published information addressing many myths again authored by a consortium of highly respected specialists in the field.

I generally stay out of these threads, but there's so much nonsense spouted I thought it worthwhile to at least make some solid data available and point out that a few people (like Gupta) are miles away from the scientific consensus and viewed as dangerously irresponsible.

I'm not taking pot shots at ordinary folk who have reached incorrect conclusions; but I am condemning those who should (and probably do) know better for leading them there...and attempting to help people back to where the evidential concensus is.

 

[selly]

Ah the stock answer of the anti lockdowners.

Selly do you not realise no lockdown would quite simply mean community infection levels would be so high, many more people would become ill overloading hospitals.

That would lead to massive excess deaths Covid and non Covid and mass unemployment.

No it wouldn't. The infection rate is fairly similar around the world

 

[Selwyn]

WRONG

Covid is not currently seasonal, it is a pandemic.

Go and read the WHO

It is evidentially seasonal

 

[RobinBHM]

even official sources state that the epidemic curves were dropping or plateauing before lockdowns were introduced

No they don't.

JoinZoe website says: "it depends"
https://covid.joinzoe.com/post/did-...ats-going-on-with-covid-19-across-the-country
There was a tiered system in place before lockdown....and highest infection areas had pretty much same restrictions as lockdown

And BBC says: "infections actually rose after lockdown"

"When Prime Minister Boris Johnson called the UK lockdown on Monday 23 March, there were "a lot of infected people who suddenly were stuck together, and they infected each other", says KCL epidemiologist Prof Tim Spector.
The peak of the epidemic came nine days later, the researchers believe, on 1 April. They estimate more than two million people aged 20-69 had Covid-19 symptoms in the UK at this point - or 50 in every 1,000 people."

 

[Selwyn]

Neither prove lockdowns don't work

I would rather see the evidence they do work. The huge areas of transmission are care homes and in nosocomial.

 

[RobinBHM]

It is evidentially seasonal

In your opinion, which is is incorrect according to WHO

 

[RobinBHM]

I would rather see the evidence they do work.

Detailed analysis of non pharmaceutical interventions here:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41562-020-01009-0
Evidence shows lockdowns do work.

 

[Blackswanwood]

That wouldn't be the graph I would use for that determination.

Okay but which one would you use?

 

[RobinBHM]

No it wouldn't. The infection rate is fairly similar around the world

Clearly untrue.

 

[RobinBHM]

Okay but which one would you use?

He doesn't like your graph

 

[Blackswanwood]

Not sure I follow your logic there Shelly? Staying in my bedroom won’t really help anything but thanks for the constructive suggestion.

 

[Rorschach]

Okay but which one would you use?

Deaths is probably the most accurate, not the actual figures as that is debatable but the curve is probably the most accurate indicator of the pandemic that we have at the moment.