How would you rate the UK's handling of this pandemic?

[Jameshow]

It's mainly because we aren't doing well. We are even worse than USA in terms of deaths per capita.

Not supprising when you compare our population density.

Cheers James

 

[Droogs]

Since I am relatively young perhaps you can suggest a politician in the modern era say since Churchill who you are sure could have done a better job???


Cheers James

There are 2 I would put forward and neither will be popular. MT and TB both had the strength of will to ensure that what needed to be done would have

You have no idea how much I don't like admitting that

 

[Selwyn]

Curious as to how these other deaths won't show up in the excess mortality totals. If you have covid deaths separated out of the excess and still a lot of excess, you can the figure out then what age groups the deaths are in and find the cause.

There was initially a lot of deferring of elective and other procedures here in the states , but we have so much non icu capacity in the states that hospitals have made a point of not deferring any longer. It was actually a financial threat. The elderly are deferring dental work, though.

30k of the English excess deaths were "at home". So in some respects a lot of deaths were because hospital wasn't available to people for deaths that may have been preventable but don't expect any chat about that.

The data on chances of people dying from covid has been out there for ages. Its very low under 70 and a lot higher over 80 but then again still very low. The Diamond Princess was a great example of this.

 

[Selwyn]

Since I am relatively young perhaps you can suggest a politician in the modern era say since Churchill who you are sure could have done a better job???


Cheers James

Western Europe is dealing with it all pretty much the same. But it is now a endemic seasonal disease so why wouldn't they. I don't expect any politican to do better than any other - Aleksander Lukashenko maybe!

 

[doctor Bob]

It's mainly because we aren't doing well. We are even worse than USA in terms of deaths per capita.

Vaccine Jacob, context.............

 

[Jelly]

Since I am relatively young perhaps you can suggest a politician in the modern era say since Churchill who you are sure could have done a better job???


Cheers James

Depending on your political persuasion:
Nye Bevan or Margaret Thatcher would be the obvious suggestions.

However, I think Blair, Brown and Cameron would all have been significantly more effective than Boris has been, that's not to say they would have handled it well, but less badly.

 

[Noel]

Clearly not, the post and my response were deleted. It doesn’t seem credible that the moderators saw fit to remove the post given you were simply asking a question re “legislation”. Forums welcome posts and is their business model, so why would they discourage ‘questions’......

Indeed.

 

[Jameshow]

But you cannot do things which the infrastructure dosen't allow like mass testing without the labs to do it. Which we didn't have in march.

PPE supply was a big issue and a disaster created over the past 20yrs implemented by logistics experts with just in time theory.

The tracking element was a disaster and Dido Harding has been sharing a desk with Gavin at the back of the class.

The rest of the decisions have been in the majority based on science and when that comes available...

Just my dumb assessment....

Cheers James

 

[Woody2Shoes]

Not supprising when you compare our population density.

Cheers James

I reckon we're as dense (and as susceptible to bibble on social media) as they are, on average....

 

[Woody2Shoes]

But you cannot do things which the infrastructure dosen't allow like mass testing without the labs to do it. Which we didn't have in march.
The tracking eliment was a disaster and Dido Harding have been sharing a desk with Gavin at the back of the class.

The rest of the decisions have been majority based on science and when that comes available...

Just my dumb assessment....

Cheers James

It's easy to diss track n trace, but it's important to remember that everything they do is after someone has managed to get themselves infected...

 

[Droogs]

I agree with you on this Dr Bob but it is not really due to the government but more I would say to the professionals within the NHS

 

[D_W]

30k of the English excess deaths were "at home". So in some respects a lot of deaths were because hospital wasn't available to people for deaths that may have been preventable but don't expect any chat about that.

The data on chances of people dying from covid has been out there for ages. Its very low under 70 and a lot higher over 80 but then again still very low. The Diamond Princess was a great example of this.

OK, my point above still was the claim that nobody will be able to quantify the impact on lack of non-covid care. If it results in deaths, they will show up and can be counted (as in quantified).

Not much necessary care has been avoided here, but this is the land of elective medical work (if you need orthopedic surgery here, you'll get it right away - there's no management of utilization like there is in nationalized systems, but that kind of stuff had been cut back originally).

Not sure about the death totals, etc, but if there's a big excess of deaths (by that, I don't mean every death from neglect to complete medical treatment - there is some of that all the time - but the amount above and beyond normal), it'll be easy to find right away after the main causes are weeded out. CDC records death by cause here in the states, so the cohort of unknown cases is pretty small. If it stays small, and the other death rates (heart disease, cancer, etc) don't change much, then it's more perceived consequences than actual.

 

[Misterdog]

When the coronavirus struck, the British government repeatedly said it was among the best-prepared countries in the world – with some justification. As recently as October, an international review of pandemic planning ranked the UK the second best prepared country in the world (behind the US).

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...rnment-prepare-for-the-wrong-kind-of-pandemic

 

[Rorschach]

There are 2 I would put forward and neither will be popular. MT and TB both had the strength of will to ensure that what needed to be done would have

You have no idea how much I don't like admitting that

Eh gads, we agree on something!

 

[Rorschach]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...rnment-prepare-for-the-wrong-kind-of-pandemic

This was pointed out earlier in this discussion and I brought it up as well but it was dismissed by people here who expect governments to be prepared for every possible eventuality.

 

[MikeJhn]

No matter who was or is in charge, they were on a "hiding to nothing", being "stuck between a rock and a hard place", can't think of anymore metaphors to add, but I think the sentiment is true.

 

[Misterdog]

Off topic.

When it comes to detailing the statistics, I've not seen better than the LA Times.
https://www.latimes.com/projects/california-coronavirus-cases-tracking-outbreak/

 

[Spectric]

Since I am relatively young perhaps you can suggest a politician in the modern era say since Churchill who you are sure could have done a better job???

That is the problem, all the leaders have to work within the constraints of the system but maybe Blair would have made the hard decisions and also people now believe they have total freedom to do as they please whenever they want to, but far to many are incapable of actually comprehending a situation, understanding the facts and responding in the right way. On day 1 the government should have used the military to enforce the lockdown, anyone not following the rules should have just been locked up until the pandemic is over.

 

[NormanB]

That is the problem, all the leaders have to work within the constraints of the system but maybe Blair would have made the hard decisions and also people now believe they have total freedom to do as they please whenever they want to, but far to many are incapable of actually comprehending a situation, understanding the facts and responding in the right way. On day 1 the government should have used the military to enforce the lockdown, anyone not following the rules should have just been locked up until the pandemic is over.

Nice theory. But ignoring the much diminished numbers in the military and with that diminished capacity to do what you suggest, the modus operandi in the UK is always to deploy the military as ‘Aid to the civil power’ which in practice means having a copper with them. In terms of enforcing rules it might act as a force multiplier for a Chief Constable wanting to have an effect but the multiplier effect would be embarrassingly small.

Different in Europe who have very well resourced ‘para military police forces ‘ and are part of the landscape. We just do not like armed troops on the streets of our hometown.

 

[Misterdog]

On day 1 the government should have used the military to enforce the lockdown, anyone not following the rules should have just been locked up until the pandemic is over.

Just like the Communism I witnessed in Romania where my family were from then.

Living in a police state you could also guarantee that there would be no criticism of those in power.
I feel though that your proposals will gather few votes, if any.
Been a bit of a failure in Russia.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...third-worst-covid-19-death-toll-underreported