How low can I go?

[MMUK]

We've had cheap chisels and cheap saws. So, on a whim last night I ordered a couple of cheap planes from Amazon. Not Poundshop planes but the cheapest I could find with a cast base. There were plenty cheaper with pressed steel or composite bases but you can't really fine tune those.

So, for the princely sum of £12.49 I am expecting a Faithfull #3 Finishing Plane and for £17.26 a Silverline #6 fore Plane. They should hopefully be here on free delivery by the end of the week. I'm not expecting mega impressive performance and absolutely nothing straight out of the box. However, I'd like to think that I can come away with something usable that will do the job until I can justify spending £££ on a single plane.

 

[G S Haydon]

I look forward to this.. I found the Faithfull #4 to be ok, and fine for many tasks. The #7 However had a very bent sole rendering it useless. I could not face trying to make it flat. I hope the silverline #6 fares better.

Regards

Graham

 

[AndyT]

It's public spirited of you to do the research. Will they be usable despite some faults (like the chisel) or fundamentally flawed (like the saw)?

I'll hazard a guess and say that they will be potentially usable for undemanding tasks such as taking a shaving off the edge of a bit of replacement floorboard to fit a gap, but will be poorly finished and fail to hold an edge for long.

But that's just my hunch, based on buying one Anant brand plane in a sale*, so I shall wait and see.



* I won't do that again. Photos can deceive. It was not a bargain.

 

[Preston]

For around the same price you could get a rusty old Stanley or Record plane, at least you'll be proud of what you have once you clean them up.

 

[jimi43]

For around the same price you could get a rusty old Stanley or Record plane, at least you'll be proud of what you have once you clean them up.

Exactly!

But if you insist on getting your old washing machine back, just in a difference shape as it went to the dump...don't let me stop you. :mrgreen:

And when you've finished with the "iron" you can always grate it over your pizza. :wink:

Jimi

 

[Richard T]

+1 for the above.

Plane I use for prep.: Middle aged Record #5 - £12 with replacement, thicker, laminated iron - 15p (approx).

Nevertheless I am very interested to see what you will make of your Faithfull and Silverline. :-k =D>

 

[bugbear]

Nevertheless I am very interested to see what you will make of your Faithfull and Silverline. :-k =D>

That's rather the point!

BugBear

 

[AndyT]

Indeed. We all already know that old Sheffield planes are good but that's not the point of this thread. Do we know what you get if you buy new and pay Silverline prices? I think I do but I don't have the evidence for my thoughts. MMUK is funding original research here! So let's wait and see the results.

 

[jimi43]

Apologies gentlemen if I find this akin to the woodworking equivalent of a cilice! :mrgreen:

Jimi

 

[RossJarvis]

Apologies gentlemen if I find this akin to the woodworking equivalent of a cilice! :mrgreen:

Jimi

Ooh, I had to look that one up. Nothing like a hair shirt to keep you on your toes

 

[MMUK]

I'm not after kudos or sarcastic comments

It's just something to keep me occupied over the Christmas holiday. I'll do anything to escape the festivities - I hate Christmas!

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Beats me how anybody can make a new plane (even in the Far East) and sell it at a profit for £12.50 - you couldn't buy the materials for that in the UK - but I won't knock it if you manage to make a decent worker out of it. I suspect you'll have an easier time with the smaller plane, just because there's less to correct if the sole shows any distortion. It'll be interesting to hear your opinion of the general fit and finish of both planes as they come out of the box, though; and how much you need to do to get acceptable performance.

 

[bugbear]

Beats me how anybody can make a new plane (even in the Far East) and sell it at a profit for £12.50 - you couldn't buy the materials for that in the UK - but I won't knock it if you manage to make a decent worker out of it. I suspect you'll have an easier time with the smaller plane, just because there's less to correct if the sole shows any distortion. It'll be interesting to hear your opinion of the general fit and finish of both planes as they come out of the box, though; and how much you need to do to get acceptable performance.

The quality of the materials is also of interest.

Those of us who restore and tune the old planes take good materials for granted, even if the original machining wasn't toolroom grade, and the passage of years may not have been kind.

BugBear

 

[MMUK]

I think the point I will be trying to make is that there will always be some people who assume that new will be better than old. Just another problem with today's throw away society. Whilst my findings may prove that these bargain basement hand planes are acceptable for an occasional hobbyist, I'm sort of hoping that I will be able to prove the complete opposite in terms of trade use (I may though be pleasantly surprised, you never know).

If my findings can educate newcomers sufficiently, then we may see a forced improvement from the manufacturers due to a drop in sales of cheap mass produced tools. I doubt it but it's worth a shot.

If these two end up no good, I'll just tart them up and keep them as space filler ornaments

 

[KevM]

I'm looking forward to your account, there's a lot of dross on the market now, but I suspect there always was. Some of the defects with older tools are overlooked through misty eyed sentimentality, some older tools exude quality. I was shocked to see a contemporary Record 52 1/2 vice and contrast it with my vintage one, the vintage one will go on forever, the new one not so much.I often wonder about the middle ground, e.g., if you can't get hold of a decent vintage tool, and you can't afford the very best of modern tools where is the best value to be found. Is anybody aware of an earnings adjusted analysis of tool costs? If my grandfather blew a day's pay on a tool, would I expect to pay an hour's pay or week's pay for the same quality?

 

[Billy Flitch]

Kev just to give you or anyone else for that matter a bench mark on costs back in 71 0r 72 the first tool I bought as a journeyman was a tenon saw. As an apprentice where you get you experience for good tools from is by using the Journeymens.
So of I went to a tool store with a very good reputation and asked for a Disston brass backed tenon saw(what I didn't know at the time was that Disston hadn't made them for a long time).
The guy said they didn't have any(surprise) so I asked for the best tenon saw in the shop, it was also the most expensive.
What he brought back was a Spear & Jackson brass backed tenon saw Iv had that saw ever since and it hasn't let me down once.It cuts as true today as it ever did Iv replaced the handle there is no makers name stamped in the back there was an etching on the plate but that's long gone the name was on the handle but it had been wore of long before I replaced the handle. So looking at it today you would not know who made it I paid just over 27 pounds,at the time a journeymans wage for a weeks work was just about 27 pounds.

Who today would pay a weeks wages for a tenon saw? But don't get confused and think every thing old is good I see some names getting banded about with pride today, that going back you would not have touched with a barge pole.

There is no doubt that Tradesmen s tools do have a style and a fashion and once a tool loses its good name there is no way the tradesman will let it into his box, because he thinks that it will reflect on him.
But then again you cant judge a tradesman by his tools the two best roofing Carpenters I ever come across used to carry their hand tools about in a plastic shopping bag that's just the way they where.

 

[KevM]

Billy, thanks - that's an interesting perspective. Sounds like you've had your money's worth, or is it like Trigger's broom: 5 handles and 6 blades - finest saw I ever owned.
Kev

 

[Billy Flitch]

Kev made me laugh,but no same plate and brass back but different handle LOL.

 

[KevM]

Good, pleased to hear it. I've got a few saws I've picked up recently in pretty sorry condition, 1 Disston and a couple of S&J that I'm hoping to refurbish. Kev

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Interesting - a week's wage would be somewhere around the cost of a premium plane today (Lie Nielsen, Clifton and Veritas), which is somewhere in the £250 to £350 range depending on size. Maybe things haven't changed that much.