Help with new NVR switch, please.

[MikeG.]

I have finally bought a new NVR switch for my bandsaw, after years of using the switch on the socket to turn the machine off. Unfortunately, it has a different arrangement of terminals than the old one, and unfortunately, I didn't take a photo of that. I'm not sure how much that would help anyway as there is no wiring diagram on the old switch.

Could someone please tell me which wires go on which terminals. Obviously the two red wires have to be one on the "in" side of the switch, and one on the "out".......but that's as far as I've got.

 

[novocaine]

sorry Mike, but without knowing where the wires go to it's pretty close to impossible to say.

I can tell you that pin 13 and 23 are N and L in and pin 14 and 24 are Motor N and L. if it's got switches on the doors or an emergency stop that routes from live to A1 (which has a coil inside to stop short circuit) but I can't tell you what the wires in your machine represent. you'll need to either find a wiring diagram or do some digging with a multimeter.

Sorry again.

Edit, do you know what switch was in there previously? as in was there a part number on it?

 

[sunnybob]

With the standard 4 pin switch, there should not be a piggy back wire, so no knowing what that little devil does.
the standard arrangement is Live and Neutral in, and Live and neutral out to the motor. All of them independent from each other

So we need the make and year and model number of the bandsaw to find the wiring diagram (unless you have the manual?)

 

[MikeG.]

......Edit, do you know what switch was in there previously? as in was there a part number on it?

No, there's no number. It just says "Liang Jih"" on it, presumably the makers name.

Given that the red is both in and out, there are only a few possibilities for all the wire positions. Is there any harm in just randomly attaching cables to terminals?

 

[novocaine]

kaboom is a good possibility. give it a go, but make sure your filming first. (or not)
can you see if there's a seperate relay inside the machine?

is it normal 240 supply or 3 phase?
is that all the wires? how old is the machine? black and red hasn't been used for supply for a rather long time (blue and brown) which says there is something else between the plug and the switch.

 

[MikeG.]

....So we need the make and year and model number of the bandsaw to find the wiring diagram (unless you have the manual?)

It's an Axminster BS350, from August 1998 (could be 1996), made in Taiwan by Shinetool Electric with their serial number 011577.

 

[MikeG.]

can you see if there's a seperate relay inside the machine?

I can't see anything inside the machine.

is it normal 240 supply or 3 phase?

Single phase, normal 240 V.

is that all the wires?

Yep.

how old is the machine?

1998 (or 1996)

black and red hasn't been used for supply for a rather long time (blue and brown) which says there is something else between the plug and the switch.

So can we just assume that black and red are the power in, and red & white are the power out to the motor?

 

[novocaine]

we can't assume anything. but thanks for the answers.

you've only got 3 wires (or is that wire that looks like a piggy back of wire 13 a separate wire?) so you've got 2 outs (black and white most likely) and 1 live input but no neutral.
you need to go digging with a multimeter and find out where those wires go, start at the motor.

 

[MikeG.]

That is definitely a piggy back red. So yes, we have 3 wires.

I have an ancient multimeter. I don't suppose it's beyond me to confirm the live and neutral wires in from the plug (assuming they come directly from the plug to the switch position). Would that be useful? There's nothing easily accessible at the motor, without pulling covers off.

The double reds could mean that this is a single pole switch, couldn't they? I mean, if the red goes to either side of the switch then the switch is only working on the single remaining pole.

 

[lurker]

I would assume terminal A1 is the feed to the relay coil

So can we just assume that black and red are the power in, and red & white are the power out to the motor?
No, because then they would just bypass the switch

 

[lurker]

This is a guess!!

Wire 13goes to terminal 14 and it’s piggyback to terminal A1

I am just off out to my workshop to look at one I think is similar .

 

[MikeG.]

OK........the multimeter seems to have died.

 

[novocaine]

got a battery and an LED handy? you can knock up a quick test lamp for what you are doing here. lets start with wire colours shall we.

what colours are in the plug?

Lurker, that was my guess but as it could mean a bit of a bang I wasn't willing to guess.

 

[MikeG.]

It's a sealed for life plug. I could cut it off if that helps, and put a new one on.

Terminal A1 is a different size to the others, so the spade connectors won't fit properly.

 

[novocaine]

no, don't cut it off. that way madness lies.
I'm just checking something with the ET.

 

[lurker]

Is this plug a normal uk three pin plug?
If yes I very much doubt any of the wires we are looking at come from there.

I have just looked inside both my bs and ts. In both cases there are two “cored”cables connected to the switch.
One is from the three pin plug and the other from (or rather to) the motor.

My conclusion is that the wires we are looking at are the motor feed.

 

[Racers]

Mike.

You need a new meter, once you have one it should be simple to find out which the incomming wires are.

Pete

 

[novocaine]

he said it probably wasn't an NVR on the machine previously, if it was it would have been something like a KJD6 or 12 and it sounds like it only switched the live. couldn't give me a wiring diagram as he hasn't touch anything like that in a while and he'd check what the wires were first. red is probably the live in but he'd expect that to be wrapped separately to the white and black which would be N and L to the motor. the piggy back would be for an emergency stop (I suggested it may have a switch on the doors.



so basically, useless and I owe him a pint.

Edit:
I'm sort of wondering if lurker has a very good point here and that you have black and white to the motor and 13 (with piggy back) are door switches, which means at some point someone has removed the live feed completely. with it all unplugged does your machine start when plugged in? (you say you've been switching it off at the wall, has it always been like that?)

 

[lurker]

got a battery and an LED handy? you can knock up a quick test lamp for what you are doing here. lets start with wire colours shall we.

what colours are in the plug?

Lurker, that was my guess but as it could mean a bit of a bang I wasn't willing to guess.

Agree entirely

 

[MikeG.]

Battery & bulb test.....

White is live from the plug. Nothing else seems to connect directly to the plug.