Guitar strap button question

[Jacob]

Is there any good reason why I shouldn't fit strap buttons to a good quality classical guitar?
I've asked around and it seems to come down to fashion only.
I've put them on other guitars and I can't see a problem. They certainly make playing position a lot easier

 

[NazNomad]

No problem whatsoever, they generally don't have them because most classical guitarists can't stand up and play. :-D

 

[Ttrees]

Do you plan on drilling a hole in the heel ?
If so its not good practice to drill the end cap as it may encourage the heel to split .
Lots of folks choose to drill a hole on the treble side of the heel as it proves to be more comfortable,
and since its long grain there is more structural

 

[bugbear]

There was a thread about this a while back

classical-guitar-strap-buttons-t94172.html

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

There was a thread about this a while back

classical-guitar-strap-buttons-t94172.html

BugBear

Oh yes so there is! I should have asked you first BB, to see if I'd already raised the issue :lol:
Anyway I'm going for it this time, but it's a posh guitar so I thought I'd double check.
I've put buttons on two cheapo classical guitars with no problem and a strap is excellent for playing position. I found the knees up with a little stool really uncomfortable and leading to cramps. Also not easy to adjust or vary.

 

[profchris]

Check your hand position while playing the high frets to make sure the strap and button don't interfere.

All being equal the treble side of the heel is likely to be a good place. If you have a stacked heel, avoid drilling at the glue line just in case the screw splits the joint.

 

[profchris]

Another thought - classical tend to be played with the neck raised above the horizontal. If this suits you best, a long strap attached with a leather lace tied to the headstock might be most comfortable. Then you'd only need one button at the tail.

 

[Jacob]

Another thought - classical tend to be played with the neck raised above the horizontal. If this suits you best, a long strap attached with a leather lace tied to the headstock might be most comfortable. Then you'd only need one button at the tail.

Thanks for that. I've checked the position on other guitars and a button under the heel works well; the guitar sits where you want it and stays in place hands off. But I might try the headstock tie on before I commit myself to vandalising a posh guitar.

 

[thetyreman]

mmmh as a classical guitarist myself, I never stray from sitting down with a footrest, body position and technique are important.

 

[Jacob]

mmmh as a classical guitarist myself, I never stray from sitting down with a footrest, body position and technique are important.

Doesn't suit me - I get cramp in no time at all. I tried a bigger footrest (a box) but can't take to the fixed position.
A lot of pros go for alternatives such as the Dynarest cushion, or various support brackets stuck on with velcro or rubber suckers.
Flamenco guitarist do all variations but seem to favour crossed legs, right over left with guitar sitting on right thigh.
I get the impression that there is a hard core who think there is only one "correct" method (as per Segovia and J Bream) but a whole lot of others who do it differently and quite successfully.

A wide stool makes sense perhaps. Not locked in so tight:

 

[bugbear]

If you're understandably nervous about taking a drill to a nice guitar, two courses of action suggest themselves.

Buy a REALLY cheap classical (under £20 from ebay, car boot, auction) and confirm that the addition of a strap does provide the ergonomic improvement you're looking for. You could also experiment with different strap positions and fixings

You then drill the nice guitar, if all your suppositions have been confirmed. Of course, if they're not confirmed, you don't drill.

The alternative is to just sell the nice guitar, and buy a different nice guitar that better suits the playing style you want. e.g. If you want to play standing up (when a strap is very much needed) you're probably playing in a group, or performing in a pub/club, and you might well want the projection of steel strings instead of nylon.

BugBear

 

[ED65]

I get the impression that there is a hard core who think there is only one "correct" method (as per Segovia and J Bream) but a whole lot of others who do it differently and quite successfully.

Oh the irony :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Jacob]

If you're understandably nervous about taking a drill to a nice guitar, two courses of action suggest themselves.

Buy a REALLY cheap classical (under £20 from ebay, car boot, auction) and confirm that the addition of a strap does provide the ergonomic improvement you're looking for. You could also experiment with different strap positions and fixings.....

Well yes I've done that and it does represent an ergonomic improvement. Buttons and strap should arrive today!
Question remains however - why are straps deprecated by classical players? I think it's just fashion.

 

[Jacob]

I get the impression that there is a hard core who think there is only one "correct" method (as per Segovia and J Bream) but a whole lot of others who do it differently and quite successfully.

Oh the irony :lol: :lol: :lol:

I see the connection, but irony doesn't come into!
As with sharpening; I'm saying perhaps you don't have to obey the strict conventions - there may be easier (but unfashionable) ways for slobs like me .

 

[NazNomad]

End of the day, it's your axe. Drill as many holes in it as you want, right?

 

[thetyreman]

mmmh as a classical guitarist myself, I never stray from sitting down with a footrest, body position and technique are important.

Doesn't suit me - I get cramp in no time at all. I tried a bigger footrest (a box) but can't take to the fixed position.
A lot of pros go for alternatives such as the Dynarest cushion, or various support brackets stuck on with velcro or rubber suckers.
Flamenco guitarist do all variations but seem to favour crossed legs, right over left with guitar sitting on right thigh.
I get the impression that there is a hard core who think there is only one "correct" method (as per Segovia and J Bream) but a whole lot of others who do it differently and quite successfully.

A wide stool makes sense perhaps. Not locked in so tight:

.

 

[bugbear]

Question remains however - why are straps deprecated by classical players? I think it's just fashion.

On the basis of brief research, it appears to be the opposite of fashion - it's unchanged over decades (at least a century). It's traditional.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

Question remains however - why are straps deprecated by classical players? I think it's just fashion.

On the basis of brief research, it appears to be the opposite of fashion - it's unchanged over decades (at least a century). It's traditional.

BugBear

Yes but straps were used too. It's more of a convention than a tradition - something to do with moving from itinerant to chamber or more formal music, with more expensive instruments?
Discuss the difference between convention and tradition. 500 words?

Anyway the bits have arrived so I'm just going down the workshop to whack holes in my posh guitar.

......
it's not really hardcore, it's just normal, having once had a career in music as a performing guitarist ruined by tendonitis, I can tell you that posture is everything.

Well yes. But a strap makes choice and control of posture less difficult and less stressful, which is my point.

 

[profchris]

I have strap buttons on my resonator uke, baritone uke and tenor guitar. Primarily for performing standing, as these are all awkward to hold and play (though it can be done). I also use the strap if i play sitting, because it completely frees my fretting hand from doing any work to support the neck.

I think the conventional classical guitar playing posture continues for the same reason that classical guitar performers rarely wear Hawaiian shirts. It's what the audience expects. I've tried it out, and it feels good to start with but quickly induces back, neck and leg ache. I guess you need to train to cope with this, like all the other aches and pains involved in playing. But a strap takes all that strain away, and means you can leave your semi-simian crouch and communicate more freely with the audience.

I'm sure the convention would fade rapidly if a few top players decided to use straps. They appear elsewhere in "serious" music - go to a renaissance or romantic guitar recital and there will very likely be straps, often in the form of colourful ribbons. For unserious music like mine, i find a hat and jazzy waistcoat, with straps when i feel like using them, are completely acceptable

 

[Jacob]

They just don't want to look like this Guitarrón mexicano player. More fool them! I'm getting a sombrero next.

On the other hand Cacho Tirao is obviously doing it all wrong https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gE_ihoNhQ6g