french polish wrap

[danielhuw]

I need to send a box I've made to a customer. It's quite a chunky piece so will need lots of bubble wrap to protect it. I've given it a french polish finish and I think that the bubble wrap will leave marks. What should I wrap the box in to protect the finish? Some sort of paper or material?
Dan

http://www.dancabinetmaker.wordpress.com
http://www.danieltomlinson.co.uk

 

[marcros]

Dan,

I cant help you with that, but there is some stunning work in your website gallery. I urge others to have a look!

Mark

 

[danielhuw]

Thanks Mark. That's kind of you!

Dan

 

[flounder]

I think I would wrap the box in a cotton sheet before putting the bubble wrap around it.
Agree with Mark that your work looks fantastic. I particularly like the Solar Table, stunning work!

 

[Matt@]

I think I would use brown paper wrapped directly round the box. But crucially and critically, how long since you have finished the polishing? did you use decent fresh french polish? Is it a true french polished finish ie mirror finish with all grain pores filled? these finishes will mark in certain cirmcumstances for quite a while after finishing and for weeks if old polish has been used.....

 

[danielhuw]

I think I would wrap the box in a cotton sheet before putting the bubble wrap around it.
Agree with Mark that your work looks fantastic. I particularly like the Solar Table, stunning work!

Thanks for the compliment. Really chuffed you like the table.

I think I would use brown paper wrapped directly round the box. But crucially and critically, how long since you have finished the polishing? did you use decent fresh french polish? Is it a true french polished finish ie mirror finish with all grain pores filled? these finishes will mark in certain cirmcumstances for quite a while after finishing and for weeks if old polish has been used.....

Yikes! The polish is about 18 months old. It's a bottle of Liberon Special Pale French Polish, and I've just completed the polishing today! I've choked it to full grain (burr walnut, so not too difficult), but I'd like to give it a more satin look with some 0000 steel wool when it has cured a bit more. How long would you reckon before it could take a few days being wrapped in brown paper? Many thanks for your advice.

Dan

 

[houtslager]

I did a load of humidors for Dunhill many many moons ago, an they were wrapped in BW - arrived with loads of strange corn circle markings
So, wait as long as possible, and wrap in brown parcel paper shiny side in, then felt or BW.
hth k

 

[Matt@]

in this context, what marks the finish is constant pressure from lumpy packing materials. If it were me, I'd leave it a week at least before posting in warm room to be safe. I defo wouldnt be sending if off say 48hrs after finishing. The polish may be ok after 18months maybe not - depends how long on the shelf before purchase. The older the polish the longer it takes to harden off. You can test the marking ability by wearing a long sleeved sweatshirt etc and placing the tip of your elbow on the finish and press as hard as you can (dont puncture the box lid though lol) . If that leaves an imprint (ie the weave of the fabric) then it needs to harden more. I guess the reality is, you can send it after 3 days whatever and it'll prob be fine but if its soemthing I'd toiled over etc I would want to gurarentee beyond doubt that it would be ok so for me would leave it as long as possible...

 

[danielhuw]

Thanks both for those replies.

I'm no expert, but the polish didn't "feel old" when I was using it. It seemed more or less the same as when I bought it. Anyway, I think I'll leave it in a warm place for a week or two. I have to send it from the UK to Canada, so I will have to parcel it up sooner or later.

Thanks again. That's all really helpful advice.

Dan

 

[MIGNAL]

Ready mixed Shellac tends to go off fairly quickly, within 3 or 4 months. I can't specifically say that is the case with Liberon special Pale though. Write that you've had the Polish for 18 months on a Guitar making forum and they would tell you to strip it and start again. No two ways about it.
It really is much better to buy the flakes and mix enough for your immediate needs.

 

[danielhuw]

Write that you've had the Polish for 18 months on a Guitar making forum and they would tell you to strip it and start again.

... Which I could do, I suppose. I'll see how it goes for a few days first. This piece of work has been a succession of steep learning curves, but thankfully this is such a great supportive forum! Thanks everyone.

Dan

 

[tudormaker]

Many years ago when working as a french polisher I used to make up my polishes with flake or pearl shellac and methylated spirits, admittedly I made up batches on a fairly regular basis but there is nothing in there to go off, if it gets to thick add more meths, so age should not be an issue. Button polish is to my mind the softest of all. Although I don't polish for a living now I still have some that I made up years ago and now use it as a sealer with no ill effects.
On a thin coat it should be completely dry in about a week or two the problem starts to arise when applying with a rubber and using oil to help with the application (it stops it sticking and pulling up).
Even when you have filled all of the grain especially in a burl to a mirror finish it will still sink in, it may take a week, two or even a month but it will.
If it is completely dry and doesn't show a finger print when pressed hard then I may consider using cotton wool around the object then wrap as normal.

Terry

 

[danielhuw]

Thanks Terry.

My box has been drying for a couple of days now, and it seems to be curing quite nicely. I only used a single coat of linseed oil on the very first application to bring the contrasts out of the burr. All the subsequent applications were just shellac. Your finger-print test is already not showing any marks. All is not lost!

Dan

 

[MIGNAL]

Many years ago when working as a french polisher I used to make up my polishes with flake or pearl shellac and methylated spirits, admittedly I made up batches on a fairly regular basis but there is nothing in there to go off, if it gets to thick add more meths, so age should not be an issue. Button polish is to my mind the softest of all. Although I don't polish for a living now I still have some that I made up years ago and now use it as a sealer with no ill effects.
On a thin coat it should be completely dry in about a week or two the problem starts to arise when applying with a rubber and using oil to help with the application (it stops it sticking and pulling up).
Even when you have filled all of the grain especially in a burl to a mirror finish it will still sink in, it may take a week, two or even a month but it will.
If it is completely dry and doesn't show a finger print when pressed hard then I may consider using cotton wool around the object then wrap as normal.

Terry

Sorry but on this point you are just plain wrong. Mixed Shellac goes through a process known as esterification which renders the finish softer than it should be. There may be some types of Shellac that display a longer shelf life (I suspect the waxy types) but they all tend to go off eventually.

 

[mrpercysnodgrass]

Hi Dan, I like your website, you have some interesting commissions on there, is that bog oak on your table or stained?

With regard to your original question. You can buy a combined brown paper and bubble wrap, it is very strong yet supple and smooth( this is beginning to sound like an eighties loo roll commercial). we get furniture sent to us from all over the world wrapped in this, sometimes with the paper side in and sometimes with the paper side out, for your box you would obviously want the paper side in.

With regard to the shelf life of shellac, the advise given by Terry and mignal are both right except on the point Terry makes about adding meths to old polish, this does in fact speed up the esterification process. Your 18 month old liberon SPB will be fine if it has been stored in a cool environment away from sunlight. ( you are in Wales so you probably have the perfect storage conditions!! )
Esterification starts as soon as the shellac is mixed and the rate at which it proceeds depends on many factors, mostly the weight of cut and the storage conditions. To keep your shellac in best condition transfer it into glass bottles ( HP sauce ones are good ) and keep it in a fridge along side your danish oil and bleaches.

W.S. Jenkins of Tottenham produce a range of outdoor polishes, Pale Outside ( 004 ), Dark Outside ( 005 ) Extra Pale Outside ( 006 ) and Satin Pale Outside ( 0015 ) These are thin hard polishes that dry quickly, used with a rubber and no oil they give a good hard finish that can be handled quite soon after finishing.

Hope this is of use to you.

Regards,
mrpercysnodgrass.

 

[MIGNAL]

Jenkins call them modified Shellac. It would be nice to know just what they are modifying them with and the overall effect i.e harder? tougher? presumably more resilient to the outside environment.

 

[danielhuw]

Hi Dan, I like your website, you have some interesting commissions on there, is that bog oak on your table or stained?

Thanks for the reply. It's actually fumed oak. I wanted a dark wood, but also wanted to use a species indigenous to Europe. I bought the veneer pre-fumed.

Unfortunately, I didn't see your post until I'd already sent the box. I ended up wrapping it with a piece of microfiber cloth. It was very soft, so should protect it from any scratching as well as bubble wrap marks.

Thanks again to everyone for all the advice about this.

Dan