Four MDF Alcove Units - WIP

[dexter]

Duncan,
I know you described the hinges you use in a previous thread but I`m struggling to find any. Can you help please?
Dex

 

[BradNaylor]

Duncan,
I know you described the hinges you use in a previous thread but I`m struggling to find any. Can you help please?
Dex

Pop in, buy me a coffee, and I'll give you some!

:lol:

Duncan

 

[Doctor]

Hi Dan,
Like you I find more and more customers wanting soft close doors, looking at your hinges (difficult from picture) it looks like you use a cheap mounting plate, why not invest a bit more and get a mounting plate which can be adjusted on a cam.
I use hettich and all 3 directions of movement are done by 3 different screws, I think it looks better and is less fiddly.
Have you seen the mew hafele all in one hinges with the soft close built in.

 

[BradNaylor]

You're right Bob.

These hinges are Hettich ones which my mate Phil ordered. Being a cheapskate he went for the crappy base plates and they're not even clip-ons!

Unfortunately he bought about 6 months worth...

Next time it'll be my turn to buy them and I will follow your advice.

Cheers
Duncan

 

[Doctor]

How do you go about deciding who buys what? Also, a customer walks in off the street and asks for a piece of furniture you are both capable of making, who quotes or do you both quote?

 

[BradNaylor]

A question about the Domino - presumably, before the Domino, you would have used biscuit for the face frames. How do the two compare for this type of application?

cheers
Dave

I did use to use biscuits for face frames but always found them unsatisfactory. The Domino is many times better.

I can't think of a single use for a biscuit joiner that the Domino can't do better.

Cheers
Duncan

 

[jedmc571]

Alright Dan,

Just looking at the MDF in the pic, is that all MR MDF ? I know the green stuff is, but I've not seen ( what I'm assuming is ) brown faced MR MDF ?

I did notice some at yours during the "Bash" but never got round to asking.

Cheers

Jed

 

[CNC Paul]

Jed,

Sometimes the thicker 18mm and above) MR MDF has a brown face with a green core, it is still all MR. I think it is something to do with the manufacturing process for thicker boards.

 

[BradNaylor]

I asked my board supplier why some manufacturers make their MR MDF with a green core and biege faces.

Apparantly it is because people were having problems when veneering the all-green boards with woods such as maple or ash. A green cast showed through the veneer.

Not what you want when you've just put the finishing touches to a £10k board-room table!

Cheers
Dan

 

[JonnyD]

I asked my board supplier why some manufacturers make their MR MDF with a green core and biege faces.

Apparantly it is because people were having problems when veneering the all-green boards with woods such as maple or ash. A green cast showed through the veneer.

Not what you want when you've just put the finishing touches to a £10k board-room table!

Cheers
Dan

That seems to make sense my supplier tends to have all green boards up to 15mm and brown faced ones 18mm and upwards which would be suitable for table tops.

Jon

 

[BradNaylor]

How do you go about deciding who buys what? Also, a customer walks in off the street and asks for a piece of furniture you are both capable of making, who quotes or do you both quote?

We just take it in turns to buy consumables and things like hinges and fittings. We keep a running tally of who has bought what and who has used what and then even things up in the pub every now and again! We both take the view that things work out fairly equal so long as we're both sensible.

As to work, it tends to be whoever answers the phone or talks to the visitor first. We're both booked up for months so as yet we haven't fought over anything! We've started to go halves on bigger jobs such as kitchens.

We're currently quoting on fitting out 46 hotel bedrooms over a 2 year period.

That's 23 each!

:lol:

Dan

 

[Doctor]

We're currently quoting on fitting out 46 hotel bedrooms over a 2 year period.

That's 23 each!

:lol:

Dan

Yes, even when I was at school 46 divided by 2 was 23 :lol:
Sounds like a good job Dan, I can always make money on big jobs, it's the small ones I struggle on.
I used to work for a furniture company which solely did hotel furniture, I would recommend that you do have terms and conditions in place, it gets some serious abuse.
We used to put about 4 coats of lacquer on everything and a lot of high pressure laminates.

 

[BradNaylor]

Sounds like a good job Dan, I can always make money on big jobs, it's the small ones I struggle on.
I used to work for a furniture company which solely did hotel furniture, I would recommend that you do have terms and conditions in place, it gets some serious abuse.
We used to put about 4 coats of lacquer on everything and a lot of high pressure laminates.

I take your point entirely about the T&C's, Bob. We've made these very clear in our quote and suspect that if we don't get the job it will be because of them.

So be it.

If we do get it it will mean that one month out of every three for the next two years is sold. That would be a comfortable feeling in the teeth of a recession!

Cheers
Duncan

 

[Doug B]

Do your T&C`s cover you for them backing out after the contract is signed Dan?
I`ve lost 4 kitchens recently, 1 of which was a labour only, i turned up on the appointed date to find the womens out of work brother had fitted it the week before :shock: . Apparently she didn`t think it "necessary" to let me know :roll: . There are words but i don`t want to be banned from the forum. :lol:

 

[Karl]

I`ve lost 4 kitchens recently, 1 of which was a labour only, i turned up on the appointed date to find the womens out of work brother had fitted it the week before :shock: . Apparently she didn`t think it "necessary" to let me know :roll: . There are words but i don`t want to be banned from the forum. :lol:

Doug - I had this with a client a couple of years ago. Labour only kitchen installation. Got there and pretty much the same thing happened as in your example. So I asked her what she was proposing to do about the fact that I now had a week without work, because I had booked my time to her. "Nothing" was the response.

So I billed her the full amount, with a covering letter that she had contracted my time for that week, and I had therefore lost a weeks work because she no longer required a kitchen fitting. Obviously she asked how you can bill somebody for work which hasn't been done - fair point, but misses the point of my covering letter.

Needless to say, she didn't pay up (not that I expected her to). I was, however, able to offset the "bad debt" of the unpaid invoice against my income for the year, thereby gaining tax relief.

Cheers

Karl

 

[BradNaylor]

Do you not take a deposit?

I would definitely get a deposit for at least 25% of the final bill, even for a labour-only job. I would justify this by pointing out how busy I was, and that if they wanted to book a week of my time, a commitment was necessary.

Even if you've no work on, it is always best to tell customers that you are booked up months in advance. They are then ever so grateful when you manage to 'fit them in'.

A deposit should be required in order to secure your services.

I was, however, able to offset the "bad debt" of the unpaid invoice against my income for the year, thereby gaining tax relief.

Clever!

What's to stop a tradesman issuing a load of made-up invoices, logging them as bad debts, and then claiming tax relief?

:wink:

Cheers
Dan

 

[Doctor]

Exactly, that is what is stated on my initial invoice, like Dan mine is 25-33% of the total and reads
Deposit to secure the services of Armstrong Jordan Ltd..... etc, etc.
I never consider a job in the bag and scheduled in until I cash the cheque.

 

[Karl]

What's to stop a tradesman issuing a load of made-up invoices, logging them as bad debts, and then claiming tax relief?

:wink:

Cheers
Dan

Well I suspect that the tax man would have a raised eyebrow if the main income stream on your SA return was "Bad Debts"..... :lol:

Personally I never take deposits for a labour only job. In 3 1/2 years I have only had the two "bad debts" - the one mentioned earlier, and a £200 BD, which was on a £3.5k job. So I don't lose too much sleep over it.

For jobs with sizeable materials cost (fitted wardrobes, decking) etc, I ask for 50% of the total job value as a deposit.

Cheers

Karl

 

[BradNaylor]

Meanwhile, back at the thread....


All four units have been completed and the top sections disassembled for easier finishing.

A day of sanding was followed by a couple of days of spraying with primer - two coats with a denib in between.

This is just repetitive, boring work. It is however, vitally important if a good end result is going to be obtained.

Tomorrow and Monday I'll be top-coating everything. That's actually a lot easier and more fun! I just need an empty and dust-free workshop.

I've roped in Karl to help me fit them on Wednesday and Thursday. We'll take plenty of photos as we go.

I just hope the bloody things fit!

:lol:

Cheers
Dan

 

[Doug B]

Do you not take a deposit?

Cheers
Dan

I`ve never taken a deposit in 11 years of self employment, i`ve never had a bad debt, & until recently never lost a job or had someone pull a trick like this woman did.
Perhaps i`ve just been lucky, i`d rather think, that the customer has always been happy to pay for the job i`ve done. Perhaps you`re right & in these economic times i`ll have to start asking for a deposit.

The cupboards look like they are coming on well, i look forward to seeing them being fitted.