FC Tools fc32 rail plunge jig

[SLM]

Does anybody have the FC Tools fc32 rail plunge jig?

I have one of Frank’s MK V rail squares and a repetitive stop, for my Mafell rails, so I know the quality of product; I’ve no doubt that the fc32 jig is worth £85, in terms of cost of manufacture. But I’m struggling to justify buying one, for what’s likely to be a one-off use.

As I use a Mafell saw, I do have the option to buy a Bosch track, with the holes already drilled. But I’ve already got plenty of track!

Any thoughts?

 

[Spectric]

Yes I took the plunge and it is a great jig, I drilled both my Makita tracks and it is precise. It is a lot of money for what is really just a heavy lump of alumium but how else would you drill the holes. I also have the sled with the indexer to actually use the drilled track and that is also great, yet to make an MFT type top though.

 

[Nelsun]

A (very!) minor point about OEM vs. jig made holey rails is that, certainly on the Festool rails (IDK about the Bosch / Mafell but Mafell being Mafell they've likely thought of that), the indexing holes are actually oval in shape. The idea being to aid the indexing pin finding it's way in rather than trying to get a perfectly round 5mm pin into an perfectly round 5mm hole. Any jig will likely only let you produce round holes... unless you can find an oval drill bit

Do FC tools also provide a do-hickey to allow indexing / referencing from a hole? This aids greatly in getting shelf pin holes to align vertically. The Festo ones look like this...

...and are orientated differently depending on which end you're referencing from. It's a bit mind bending which way round they go, but I can't imagine not using them as precision is paramount if you don't want rocking shelves.

 

[SLM]

That’s an interesting point regarding the hole shape. I don’t think fc do an indexing thing, but I find their gear, though very good, isn’t all that well described or documented. So, whether that functionality is covered by something, I can neither confirm nor deny!

 

[Nelsun]

If you follow Frank on his socials you get to see (typically when in development / approaching release) some videos with demos of things. Or you used to as I'm out of touch with that now. But yeah, some of the more obscure items could do with better blurb.

He does like to iterate on things (e.g. rail squares and hinge jigs) which kinda puts me off a bit TBO; as you never know if what you're looking at will be superseded by the next version in a month or so. Kudos to him for constantly improving his products though!

Oh, and @Spectric, having attempted to produce a couple of MFT tops with a holey rail, I'd advise against it if accuracy is important. While it can make a deadly accurate row of equally spaced holes, problems did present when it came to making the next row(s) line up perfectly in all directions - even one row a hair out chucks relying on it for squareness out the window. The Parf MKII has literally never let me down there and has been nothing short of deadly accurate every time... even with me at the helm

 

[Spectric]

I don’t think fc do an indexing thing,

https://fctools.co.uk/product/fc32-for-festool-and-bosch-rails/

That’s an interesting point regarding the hole shape

Watch this video

in particular 0.45 in and you will see there is no issue with round holes, the index pin clunks into the track with no problems. Maybe Festool made oblong holes to overcome an issue with precision.

 

[Nelsun]

The "indexing thing" are the "do-hickey" (end stops) I mentioned above with the photo. If you want to learn about what they help accomplish, there's a video specifically about them:



From experience, they really do help eliminate alignment errors and speed up setup time; especially when coupled with the offset rods. And you could likely rig up an equivalent stop from scraps (or order just the bits from the Festool eKat system) without having to choke on the now exorbitant price of the Festool LR32 system.

As I said, the pin hole shape is a very minor point and I don't doubt the FC Tools pin will pop in to a 5mm hole fine enough. Based on the video you posted, I would say it doesn't look quite as smooth an operation... but only in a nit-picking way. It's great that there's quality options available for non Festool routers.

 

[SLM]

https://fctools.co.uk/product/fc32-for-festool-and-bosch-rails/

Watch this video

in particular 0.45 in and you will see there is no issue with round holes, the index pin clunks into the track with no problems. Maybe Festool made oblong holes to overcome an issue with precision.

I think the doohickey Nelsun referenced is to register the track against the end of the work piece.

 

[starfish]

If you follow Frank on his socials you get to see (typically when in development / approaching release) some videos with demos of things. Or you used to as I'm out of touch with that now. But yeah, some of the more obscure items could do with better blurb.

He does like to iterate on things (e.g. rail squares and hinge jigs) which kinda puts me off a bit TBO; as you never know if what you're looking at will be superseded by the next version in a month or so. Kudos to him for constantly improving his products though!

Oh, and @Spectric, having attempted to produce a couple of MFT tops with a holey rail, I'd advise against it if accuracy is important. While it can make a deadly accurate row of equally spaced holes, problems did present when it came to making the next row(s) line up perfectly in all directions - even one row a hair out chucks relying on it for squareness out the window. The Parf MKII has literally never let me down there and has been nothing short of deadly accurate every time... even with me at the helm

I like this method of indexing using a lr32 .

Oddly I bought a bosch rail and router sledge from Amazon which turned out cheaper than a festool rail or drilling my maktita rails - I had thought about this Drilling template for festool rails, circular saw, router 32mm LR32 LR 32 | eBay

 

[Nelsun]

I like this method of indexing using a lr32

Holy time warp, that's how I tried to do it some 8 years ago off the back of that exact same video. It worked pretty well, but I'd end up with very small inconsistencies (like a row being ~0.2mm out) in the grid pattern. Then it was a couple of different router templates which were way quicker but still prone to inconsistencies. It's the Parf MKII system all the way for me now.

 

[starfish]

Holy time warp, that's how I tried to do it some 8 years ago off the back of that exact same video. It worked pretty well, but I'd end up with very small inconsistencies (like a row being ~0.2mm out) in the grid pattern. Then it was a couple of different router templates which were way quicker but still prone to inconsistencies. It's the Parf MKII system all the way for me now.

The LR32 has been good enough for me, I can't really justify the parf system for the use it would get

I bought a 3d printer instead so am playing these Festool MFT DIY Routing Jig large by Binky61

 

[Spectric]

It's the Parf MKII system all the way for me now.

Yes it is a good system and delivers but nothing stays at the top forever and maybe when @petermillard gets his idea out of development for making MFT style tops then things might change, I am in the router camp for cutting holes and not the drill. That said I have made many jigs and worktops using the Parf system and these have made things easier if you are not fully perforating a top with as many holes as you can fit and need some extras later.

https://www.axminstertools.com/ujk-...7359?queryID=6ec6bac87520b780b798b9fba301e246

 

[petermillard]

Yes it is a good system and delivers but nothing stays at the top forever and maybe when @petermillard gets his idea out of development for making MFT style tops then things might change, I am in the router camp for cutting holes and not the drill. That said I have made many jigs and worktops using the Parf system and these have made things easier if you are not fully perforating a top with as many holes as you can fit and need some extras later.

https://www.axminstertools.com/ujk-...7359?queryID=6ec6bac87520b780b798b9fba301e246

Almost there Roy. Just trying to wrangle a custom router bit issue - continue to support British industry and try to resolve to issue, or just buy from Taiwan at half the price, but a 3 month lead - otherwise it’s ready to go.

I did my own take on the LR32 MFT issue in this video - as long as your top is square it works well, but you do need an LR32 rail and a set of raildogs, whereas my MFT jig has a much lower entry requirement.

Best, P

 

[Spectric]

That word "custom" stands out, always better to use off the shelf where possible as it saves money and reduces lead times. Have you approached Wealdon tools for the cutter, they do give great service when buying and might be your solution.

 

[petermillard]

That word "custom" stands out, always better to use off the shelf where possible as it saves money and reduces lead times. Have you approached Wealdon tools for the cutter, they do give great service when buying and might be your solution.

Not possible in this instance Roy, it’s the custom nature of the bit that makes the difference. Long story short, in my testing (I’ve used pretty much all the MFT jigs available here in Britain) off the shelf 20mm router bits ((by far the fastest/easiest way to get the desired top) produce a slightly larger than 20mm hole due to router run-out. So I’m having a slightly under-sized bit made to counteract that. Wealden tool make a great bit, but have no interest in smaller, custom runs.

 

[Spectric]

Hi Pete

I suppose that is why some of these jigs use a bush in a custom CNC hole with a smaller cutter, you just have to spend more time cutting each hole. What I dislike about some of these systems is the aluminium tape used to adjust the size which is crude to say the least. Is the problem with the router or that people don't always use a centering cone and then you introduce an offset ?

Another idea, can you not use an off the shelf 20mm cutter and just get it reduced by a gnats do dah ? You can only be looking at a few thou and I recal the guys I worked with doing something like this with the slot cutters on a mill.