Ebay. Sharp practice or good selling practice? Stayset No.3
- Thread starter Bm101
- Start date
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I don't think an old plane with a couple of replacement parts should be thought of as a fake. It might not be possible to spot when this has happened anyway so I'm not sure how much importance it should be given anyway, no matter how much it might bother a collector.
A step past that, there are many planes out there made up of bits and pieces from various donor planes and I don't think those are fakes either depending on how they're described by the seller.
Where things get dodgy I think is with the totally mismatched planes, that's when you get into Frankenplane territory where sometimes they're even cobbled together using parts from more than one maker. But even those aren't fakes per se as long as no claims are being made about their originality (which it seems might have been the case with this plane I asked about recently).
A step past that, there are many planes out there made up of bits and pieces from various donor planes and I don't think those are fakes either depending on how they're described by the seller.
Where things get dodgy I think is with the totally mismatched planes, that's when you get into Frankenplane territory where sometimes they're even cobbled together using parts from more than one maker. But even those aren't fakes per se as long as no claims are being made about their originality (which it seems might have been the case with this plane I asked about recently).
shed9
establiSHED member
In regards to definitions of fake old tools, it could be argued that a tool that has been maintained, upgraded and even modified during it's working life could be classed as more genuine than a New Old Stock 'barn find' to some degree. I know this is a bit of a stretch but bear with me.
These are working functional items after all and real world use can and will change aspects of that tool over time.
I don't mind that someone maybe replaced the iron or cap or had to replace a broken handle - it all adds to the history of it. I've got a fair collection of type 9's and 11's and these are generally the ones I go for. The fact that they have been used and little aspects changed over time is a positive in my opinion.
I probably have around 20 of these planes and with an approx age of 105 years old a piece (manf. 1902 - 1918, that totals over two thousand years of combined usage). It would be insane to expect no change of the interchangeable parts of those tools over that period.
These are working functional items after all and real world use can and will change aspects of that tool over time.
I don't mind that someone maybe replaced the iron or cap or had to replace a broken handle - it all adds to the history of it. I've got a fair collection of type 9's and 11's and these are generally the ones I go for. The fact that they have been used and little aspects changed over time is a positive in my opinion.
I probably have around 20 of these planes and with an approx age of 105 years old a piece (manf. 1902 - 1918, that totals over two thousand years of combined usage). It would be insane to expect no change of the interchangeable parts of those tools over that period.
Bod
Established Member
Bm101":qbuz3ckn said:
You think you jest!
Many a good tool has been found, at jumble sales, and the like.
Bod
bugbear
Established Member
Monkey Mark":6fam56v1 said:
For which eBay have a specific reporting option;
http://www.ebay.co.uk/gds/Sellers-biddi ... 738/g.html
It's illegal in meat space auctions too.
BugBear
Bod":1jbptr0e said:
Found a couple myself Bod.
No Karl Holteys though... My Mrs is a big ebayer. She's now moaning that her watch list is full of 'rusty man-rubbish' lol. 8)
A year or two back she was after a particular pair of boots or a bag, something along those lines. Not much interest at first then another bidder pipes up and starts a little war. Back and forth the battle goes, she was really after the sale. As the price kept on rising and rising she realised it was her identical twin down in Devon trying to buy it for her as a Christmas present. One frantic phonecall later 'Stop B*%$£*Y Bidding!' and a good few quid down she won the poxy stuff. One happy seller.
I think the Triggers Broom analogy is spot on for working tools, I suppose when you start looking at collecting the expensive gear, to look at or make money from, like anything, you better know what you're about or you're gonna get skinned.
Edit: (bit of a ramble...)
I had to google 'The ship of Theseus' ED. The closest I ever got to the classics was when I went for a daytrip to Cambridge. I'm in the pub and this bunch of academic types next to me. One fella dropped all his change and went 'Ahhhh, Im scattering my riches like Croesus !' And they all had a jolly good laugh.
When I went out for a ciggy I googled that too. And it turns out he was a rich fella. Memory sparked, I just had another look at wiki.
In Greek and Persian cultures the name of Croesus became a synonym for a wealthy man. Croesus' wealth remained proverbial beyond classical antiquity: in English, expressions such as "rich as Croesus" or "richer than Croesus" are used to indicate great wealth to this day.
Maybe in Cambridge Pubs they are, in my local when someone drops a coin it hits them on the back of the head. When they stand up someone's swiped their pint. :shock:
