Did you see the report that boilers sales are to stop 2025

[Droogs]

I know how you feel, i live in an 1850s early Victorian terrace ground floor flat. The walls are solid granite and the ceiling is the up neighbours floor, not a lot I can do other than fit better windows. Unfortunately when we did ours about 5 yrs ago all we could get was double glazed but would have preferred triple. We are slowly ripping out the lathe and plaster walls and replacing with frame and plasterboard with dp and insulation as we eventually redecorate each room. We only got GCH around a year ago up until then the only heating was a wood stove in the living room and oil radiators in the bedroom. But you do what you can as you can.

 

[Rorschach]

But your house will probably have provided a home for people for a lot longer period than many of these new builds will and it will remain standing for a lot longer than many of the new builds so therefore it will have been a more sustainable build.

Why do you think a new build house will not last as long as an older house? The basic structural materials are not really any different.

 

[Jacob]

You make some great points however this section is problematic, why? Because poor people already do this and still live in relative fuel poverty.
Our flat isn't going to get anymore insulated, we do wear more clothes in the winter to keep warm, we do regulate our thermostat and run a dehumidifier to keep the air dry rather than opening windows (which is a waste of time in the South West in winter anyway), we do shop at our local supermarket/shops and we drive a car that we can afford. Our fuel consumption is about as low as we could make it and we are not alone, indeed I consider us to be reasonably comfortable compared to some people I know and some of our neighbours. In our last flat which luckily we only lived in for 18 months (but did 2 winters including a very cold one for our location) we got by with no running hot water and no central heating.

The point is we are ALL going to have to live like 'poor' people. This is problematic because so far most of the debate has been about how to get by without being inconvenienced. People are looking forward to whizzing about in EVs and having cheap heating from ground source heat pumps which cost £50k. In fact many have been buying them already.
We are just at a very early phase of adjustment. The phony war, before the s**t really starts hitting the fan.

 

[Spectric]

New builds are thrown up just to make big profits for the property developers, did you see the one show the other evening talking about Persimon houses, the standards were non existent with snaging list like encyclopedia's. Not just minor niggles but walls leaning and structural issues. Some people buy them to take advantage of offers just to get on the property ladder and then a year later sell and buy a more established property that they wanted in the first place.

Read what architects are saying, Most new housing so poorly designed it should not have been built, says Bartlett report

There are now companies undertaking proper build inspections to give the new owner a truthful snag list to hit the builder with.,

https://www.housescan.co.uk/services/https://www.mdrhomeinspections.co.u...VyslbJxpdOqHPG0O2lRV2ZHwILsM0cBRoC2LkQAvD_BwE
Further reading

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/mar/11/why-are-britains-new-homes-built-so-badlyhttp://www.brand-newhomes.co.uk/disadvantages_of_buying_a_new_home.htm
I was talking with a heating engineer who was having to rectify issues for some new build customers for a builder who had cut cost by getting the plumbing installed by a moon lighting taxi driver on the basis that it was just a case of simpling pushing it together, the biggest mistake was that the gas had been done in pushfit as well.

 

[Droogs]

@Jacob should that not be - we are going to have to live not like spoiled brats and more like normal people

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I believe a common misapprehension nowadays is that someone's being qualified equals their being conscientious and good at their job. Some of the best builders I knew didn't have a qualification and a fair part of my working week was often taken up trying to sort out the messes that supposedly qualified people had made.

 

[Spectric]

The point is we are ALL going to have to live like 'poor' people.

Look at history, everything that goes up eventually comes down, Greek empire, Roman empire, British empire so in reality it is an early phase of adjustment but heading into more of a third world status. America is going to have to accept China becoming the worlds biggest super power and not start another cold war with them. Maybe China will have more luck in global stabilisation because I think they don't bend the rules like the west just to suit a situation, ie Mr Hussain is a despot with invisable weapons of mass destruction so we end up at war yet Mr Nettyyahoo leading a fanatical religous sect gets away with genocide as he is currently in bed with Mr Biden, who is openly supplying weapons to kill civilians. We are going to have to accept huge changes in the way we live or just accept extinction is inevitable, this will feel like poverty if nothing else but then could lead to a better quality of life long term.

 

[Spectric]

Some of the best builders I knew didn't have a qualification and a fair part of my working week was often taken up trying to sort out the messes that supposedly qualified people had made.

That is because once upon a time your qualification could be the work you produced, ie a skilled bricky would have a decent wall for people to see at the end of the day, there is his qualification. These days you have to go to uni for a degree just to become a florist or bog attendant, we need to bring back streaming where for certain jobs an academic qualification like a degree is required but for others who are better with their hands then technical colleges and apprenticeships where doing a job takes preference to getting a bit of paper.

 

[Jacob]

That is because once upon a time your qualification could be the work you produced, ie a skilled bricky would have a decent wall for people to see at the end of the day, there is his qualification. These days you have to go to uni for a degree just to become a florist or bog attendant, we need to bring back streaming where for certain jobs an academic qualification like a degree is required but for others who are better with their hands then technical colleges and apprenticeships where doing a job takes preference to getting a bit of paper.

In the old days the qualification for many was a successfully completed apprenticeship.
We need strong unions to protect workers rights and also to be big players in training, apprenticeships and quality control, as was the case with Guilds.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

That is because once upon a time your qualification could be the work you produced, ie a skilled bricky would have a decent wall for people to see at the end of the day, there is his qualification.

I worked years ago with a young patissiere who went for an interview at a (very) top London restaurant. I asked her how she got on and she said the interview itself wasn't bad, but at the end the interviewer pulled two bags of ingredients out from under the table, pointed to the kitchens, told her the ovens were hot and to go and cook. Cook what? she asked. You're the chef, came the answer, up to you.
She got the job. I thought that was as good a way as any of sorting the wheat from the chaff.

 

[Selwyn]

Am I the only one who is not bothered in the slightest by climate change?

 

[Just4Fun]

at the end the interviewer pulled two bags of ingredients out from under the table, pointed to the kitchens, told her the ovens were hot and to go and cook. Cook what? she asked. You're the chef, came the answer, up to you.

It is strange. Whenever I have interviewed job applicants I have given them a practical test, yet I have rarely been given such a test when I have been interviewed for jobs. I do not understand that.

 

[Rorschach]

The point is we are ALL going to have to live like 'poor' people. This is problematic because so far most of the debate has been about how to get by without being inconvenienced. People are looking forward to whizzing about in EVs and having cheap heating from ground source heat pumps which cost £50k. In fact many have been buying them already.
We are just at a very early phase of adjustment. The phony war, before the s**t really starts hitting the fan.

I got news for you, no-one wants to live like poor people, especially poor people. It's all well and good talking about these targets now but when people start to feel their standard of living go down things will change.

 

[Spectric]

To change is to break that economic circle where the few get richer at the expense of the rest. It is like climbing a ladder except you have no idea about how long or what happens at the last rung. Prices go up, cost of living goes up and so we get a payrise that may narrow the gap, this cycle repeats but pay falls behind so the gaps between rich, poor and homeless just get wider. The economy cannot be the main objective for living, if we had a system where we all shared or got out a percentage of what we put in then things may improve in the right direction but right now the system is broken, things are out of proportion and earnings not related to any meaningful agenda, ie how can you earn more kicking a ball than improving and saving lives being a consultant surgeon.

 

[RobinBHM]

You make some great points however this section is problematic, why? Because poor people already do this and still live in relative fuel poverty.
Our flat isn't going to get anymore insulated, we do wear more clothes in the winter to keep warm, we do regulate our thermostat and run a dehumidifier to keep the air dry rather than opening windows (which is a waste of time in the South West in winter anyway), we do shop at our local supermarket/shops and we drive a car that we can afford. Our fuel consumption is about as low as we could make it and we are not alone, indeed I consider us to be reasonably comfortable compared to some people I know and some of our neighbours. In our last flat which luckily we only lived in for 18 months (but did 2 winters including a very cold one for our location) we got by with no running hot water and no central heating.

The government and I guess the energy suppliers are forcing people to make energy efficiency decisions simply by raising prices, mainly: green and social taxes + smart meter rental.

The big problem is UK housing stock is all pretty old and not energy efficient. The cost of retrofitting insulation to floors, walls, roof, new central heating, solar panels etc is so high there is no worthwhile payback period for most people.

 

[Spectric]

The big problem is UK housing stock is all pretty old and not energy efficient.

And they are still building thousands of houses that are no where as energy efficient as they could be because it is not cost effective for the developers. To me this gives a clear message that the government is full of words and no action, just trying to score points as politicians always do.

 

[RobinBHM]

Am I the only one who is not bothered in the slightest by climate change?

I'd guess you are a right wing libertarian, probably a Trump and Brexit supporter.....which are all linked

I bet you dislike Greta Thunberg?

Libertarian groups such as the Koch foundation fund climate change denier think tanks that push out misinformation and campaign for fossil fuel interests.

https://bylinetimes.com/2019/06/10/...d-raab-all-part-of-the-tufton-street-network/

 

[RobinBHM]

And they are still building thousands of houses that are no where as energy efficient as they could be because it is not cost effective for the developers. To me this gives a clear message that the government is full of words and no action, just trying to score points as politicians always do.

Part L for new builds is quite energy efficient.

Property developers won't exceed building regs as that would just eat into their profits.

Virtually all passivhaus builds are self builds

 

[Rorschach]

Careful Robin, you dropped your bias card and your prejudice is showing

 

[D_W]

... a fanatical religous sect .....

well, then - let's just dance around what that comment is.