central heating advice sought

[devonwoody]

My gas c/h is seriously playing up, boiler 12 years old and the old system.

Can most probably get new parts (3 way valve motor and boiler thermostat)

Interested in new boiler system but I think I should go the whole hog and have the piping and whole system replaced. (Thats 27 years old)

I cannot see it worth blowing out pipes and radiators etc for a new boiler.

So whats the going rate for a new c/h system these days?

 

[defsdoor]

Do the piping yourself - it's not hard and very rewarding - and you will probably do a better job than a paid by the day plumber. Copper is expensive atm but I'd still use copper over push fit - 22mm all round and 15mm risers. I completely re-did all the pipes in the old house (and fitted the boiler but don't tell anyone). No pipe noise at all!

I'm looking at a top of the range Vailant ecotec at the moment with built in hot water reservoir. About a grand all in if you shop around, but they are very deep so not sure it will go where the current boiler is. All my piping needs redoing too - very noisy - and I need to look at some floor boards too as some drop a good inch. A job for warmer weather though.

 

[Dibs-h]

My gas c/h is seriously playing up, boiler 12 years old and the old system.

Can most probably get new parts (3 way valve motor and boiler thermostat)

Interested in new boiler system but I think I should go the whole hog and have the piping and whole system replaced. (Thats 27 years old)

I cannot see it worth blowing out pipes and radiators etc for a new boiler.

So whats the going rate for a new c/h system these days?

Why replace the piping? It being 27yrs old - I wouldn't have thought would make any difference to it. Power flush it if you want\need. Have you seen the price of copper these days? You'll need to be sat down.

Dibs

 

[devonwoody]

Dibs, If I switch to the new condensing boilers, does it not mean that all the muck in the pipes (c/h system) will pass through the new boiler and they dont like it, any dirt around can ruin a new boiler? (at present the heating water is contained in its own circuit and does not enter the boiler)

So four new radiators (plus towel rail) for a two bedroom detached bungalow, whats the total cost for a new system?

I can sell the old copper, if they like cable they must like piping :wink:

 

[OLD]

12 months ago i had my heating re configured as the ground floor pipes were in the concrete slab so new piping from the upstairs to ground floor some radiators replaced. All old rads. washed out new pump cylinder and controls new tcv to all rads.new tanks and all new pipe work to new items. A 'fernox total filter tf1' was fitted to mop up any muck left in the system .Reused pipework is 50 year old copper.
From estimate :- copper pipe as required, 120ltr cylinder and immersion, new tanks (they were repositioned) pump and controls 9 radiators, no electrical work. £2591 total cost
Scrap copper and brass was £180cash.
Hope this info is useful to you.

 

[Dibs-h]

I can sell the old copper, if they like cable they must like piping :wink:

Yes but you would get less than < £1 I feel for 1m length of 22m, whereas a 1m length of new is £6-7. If it was the other way round - we'd all be trading our old pipes for new!

Dibs

p.s. A good power flush and filter installed - should be perfectly fine. IMO - anyone telling you anything else is full of something.

 

[woodstainwilly]

I had my old boiler and hot water tank removed and a condensing
boiler put in 18 months ago. It was the best thing I have done in a
long time. The system was power flushed before the changeover
and the muck that came out made me wonder how the system worked
at all. It cost £1500 but my heating bill has dropped by a third.
Willy.

 

[Digit]

I've installed four of my own systems, and two for others DW and I'm with Dibs. Why look for extra work?
If you are considering keeping an indirect system then I would certainly clean the muck out of the header tank.

Roy.

 

[Ateallthepies]

Here is a plumbing question, under the floorboards I always see the pipes without any lagging. Would lagged pipes make the system more efficient? Surely a lot of heat is lost on the way to the rads?

Steve.

 

[Digit]

Yes Steve, at one time you could buy 3 metre/10ft lengths of pre lagged pipe, haven't seen any for years though.

Roy.

 

[dickm]

Here is a plumbing question, under the floorboards I always see the pipes without any lagging. Would lagged pipes make the system more efficient? Surely a lot of heat is lost on the way to the rads?

Depends where they are! If they are in the ground floor void, then that heat is wasted, but if they are between ground and upper floor, you probably get most of the benefit from them.

The OP just might do slightly better that suggested if his system is really old and he sells the pipe - pretty sure the imperial (1/2") pipe was thicker walled than the modern stuff! But not enough gain to make a complete change worthwhile. Some 40 odd years ago I took out an old direct HW cylinder to replace it with a modern indirect one, and the copper on the old one was so thick that I got more for it than I paid for the new one. Ah, they don't make 'em like they used to

 

[RogerS]

DW does hav a point on two counts. If his system has got crud and muck in it then this could block up the smaller pipes inside a modern boiler. A powerflush should sort that out.

I'd be more concerned if DW was moving from a vented system to a pressurised combi as the extra pressure can really challenge older joints. Having said that, with some makes of combis you can run them on a vented system and which was one option I'd considered to solve the long dead leg in the how pipe to the downstairs area.

DW - I'd post this question over on ATT

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks to all for those good informative replies.

I got a plumber coming into day (within 24 hours!), I used my best elderly accent and plenty of coughs.


Things are better this morning, I have found that the thermostat on the hot water tank had been moved to a lower setting inadvertently and the boiler worked today, but my threeway motorised valve switch I have to turn with a spanner etc.etc. so getting a quote for a new set up. £1.5K to 2.7K does not sound too bad in this day and age.

If I dont change the piping I would have to take out c/h maintenace insurance?

 

[Dibs-h]

If I dont change the piping I would have to take out c/h maintenace insurance?

Get it power flushed and I wouldn't expect any issues.

 

[Digit]

Not all contracts cover rads etc anyway DW,
Called in on my CH/Plumbing suppliers this morning DW, I've known these boys for over 20 yrs and they have a very no-nonsense attitude, so I told them about you question.
Their reply was, power flush and put the money you save into the boiler and controls.
Sounds like good sense to me DW.

Roy.

 

[RogerS]

dw...save yourself a lot of money and get these..

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks, my plumber should arrive in 15 minutes. :wink:

 

[Digit]

And counting!

Roy.

 

[RogerS]

He's taking a while. Do you think he's having trouble with the buttons ?

 

[devonwoody]

And counting!

Roy.

It stretched to 120 minutes.


I think he has been so busy he hasnt been home for a week because he hasnt had a shave, or perhaps his heating system does not work.

he says go the power flush route, so a quote coming in for boiler and new controls etc.