Carved With Love BBC Four

[Jacob]

He did painted pine too. You can see this in the new V&A furniture gallery:

 

[marcros]

the 2 stand out bits for me that i will do some further reading on were the marquetry and the japanning/gold leafing.

 

[bugbear]

I've just watched this and I agree with Andy re camera work but it was a lot better most of this type of programme and we did see some craftsmen actually doing things. The veneer being used for the marquertry was thin modern stuff - the original would have been thick hand sawn veneer which you could not cut with a knife. Overall I enjoyed the programme and I am looking forward to the rest of the series.

Cheers------Arnold

I have a dim memory of the original veneers being VERY strongly coloured (as revealed by a small section of a piece which was protected from light), and a modern craftsman being commissioned to reproduce a panel in "full colour".

Any remember this (TV program), and have more details?

Edit I have been pointed at this thread:

chippendale-tonight-7pm-bbc1-t1289.html

BugBear

 

[Dangermouse]

Unusually good programme, for these days of soundbite TV. Enjoyed it very much. Of course the best bits were seeing the FANTASTIC items of furniture his workshop made. I would have liked to have seen more of the workshops making his designs today and their way of working. But I think that would have sent 98% of the viewers to sleep, so all in all a very good programme. Looking forward to the next one.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I hope with the Gibbons one there is more attention paid to the actual carving and the building up of the pieces, rather than the artwork and the finished product, otherwise it'll be like an art lesson.

 

[bugbear]

I have a dim memory of the original veneers being VERY strongly coloured (as revealed by a small section of a piece which was protected from light), and a modern craftsman being commissioned to reproduce a panel in "full colour".

Gotcha!

http://secretlivesofobjects.blogspot.co ... earch.html
http://secretlivesofobjects.blogspot.co ... dales.html

The craftsman was Jack Metcalfe.

BugBear

 

[Phil Pascoe]

As regards the colouring of the inlays - I remember seeing the workshop of a guy making repro Chippendale about 40yrs ago, and commenting on the extremely vivid inlays. He pointed out that they needed to be that bright to fade to the right colour, as they used pigments and dyes made up to be as original as possible. He showed me a piece that they were copying, with the new piece next to it - you'd never have believed they would ever look the same.

 

[soulboy]

Bugbear, thanks for those links, very interesting info about dyes & mordants.
chris

 

[Jacob]

As regards the colouring of the inlays - I remember seeing the workshop of a guy making repro Chippendale about 40yrs ago, and commenting on the extremely vivid inlays. He pointed out that they needed to be that bright to fade to the right colour, as they used pigments and dyes made up to be as original as possible. He showed me a piece that they were copying, with the new piece next to it - you'd never have believed they would ever look the same.

I don't think they fade 'to the right colour' - they just fade. Too much sunlight and they darken or fade faster.
I used to have a corner cupboard with a marquetry 'Britannia' and the red white and blue flag had all gone shades of brown. Everything brown in fact except the sea which was deep green, probably not the original colour.
They had no more control over colour than artists of the period, whose paintings would also fade or darken, quite unintentionally, depending on how/where they were kept.

 

[bugbear]

As regards the colouring of the inlays - I remember seeing the workshop of a guy making repro Chippendale about 40yrs ago, and commenting on the extremely vivid inlays. He pointed out that they needed to be that bright to fade to the right colour, as they used pigments and dyes made up to be as original as possible. He showed me a piece that they were copying, with the new piece next to it - you'd never have believed they would ever look the same.

I don't think they fade 'to the right colour' - they just fade. Too much sunlight and they darken or fade faster.
I used to have a corner cupboard with a marquetry 'Britannia' and the red white and blue flag had all gone shades of brown. Everything brown in fact except the sea which was deep green, probably not the original colour.
They had no more control over colour than artists of the period, whose paintings would also fade or darken, quite unintentionally, depending on how/where they were kept.

If you're making a piece that you intend to look like an old Chippendale when the piece you make is itself old, you have to make it with very bright colours when it's new. Thus the piece you make does indeed "fade to the right colour".

BugBear

 

[Chems]

They didn't even mention the characters created for him:

 

[jimi43]

The reason some colours fade to nothing and others stay is a function of the permanency of the pigments used.

Blues and some yellows can be quite fugitive whereas the natural colours made from earth pigments tend to be more permanent.

Jim

 

[Jacob]

As regards the colouring of the inlays - I remember seeing the workshop of a guy making repro Chippendale about 40yrs ago, and commenting on the extremely vivid inlays. He pointed out that they needed to be that bright to fade to the right colour, as they used pigments and dyes made up to be as original as possible. He showed me a piece that they were copying, with the new piece next to it - you'd never have believed they would ever look the same.

I don't think they fade 'to the right colour' - they just fade. Too much sunlight and they darken or fade faster.
I used to have a corner cupboard with a marquetry 'Britannia' and the red white and blue flag had all gone shades of brown. Everything brown in fact except the sea which was deep green, probably not the original colour.
They had no more control over colour than artists of the period, whose paintings would also fade or darken, quite unintentionally, depending on how/where they were kept.

If you're making a piece that you intend to look like an old Chippendale when the piece you make is itself old, you have to make it with very bright colours when it's new. Thus the piece you make does indeed "fade to the right colour".

BugBear

But then it will look like new Chippendale when it's new! If you want it to look like old Chippendale when it's new, then you would match the faded (or darkened) colours.
Then if your are restoring you can choose either way. Picture restorers tend go for the original (bright) colours - but not with any intention that they should fade or darken to the 'right' colour.

 

[Jacob]

The reason some colours fade to nothing and others stay is a function of the permanency of the pigments used.

That's what is known as a 'tautology'

Blues and some yellows can be quite fugitive whereas the natural colours made from earth pigments tend to be more permanent.

Jim

And wood, oils and varnishes tend to darken.

 

[jimi43]

Yes Jacob....thanks mate.

Jim

 

[richarnold]

One thing the program didn't mention is where Mr chippendale may have learnt his trade

Richard Wood was possibly Yorks first commercial planemaker, although his main line of business was joinery.
Guess who his most famous apprentice is reputed to have been!!!
Richard Wood planes are extremely rare, but I'm still hopeful I might find one one day with the owners stamp of chippendale!!!

 

[Graham Orm]

I greatly enjoyed it but also wondered why they didn't explain how he got the initial capital to make the Director and to address the issue of his actual workmanship as opposed to his design and management (which was implied only).

I really liked the little bit on Anthony Hay's workshop in Colonial Williamsburg. If you're not familiar with it, here is their somewhat infrequent blog;

http://anthonyhaycabinetmaker.wordpress.com/

I use the following picture from that workshop as my desktop background on all my computers so it was a treat to see the carver working right next to it;

http://anthonyhaycabinetmaker.files.wor ... c_0008.jpg

If you want to view regionally restricted videos, you should Google "ip spoofing to view videos" and start reading.

New desk top......thank you!!!

 

[marcros]

this is worth a flick through- Chippendale's "catalogue"

http://digital.library.wisc.edu/1711.dl ... ippGentCab

 

[bugbear]

I don't think they fade 'to the right colour' - they just fade.
...
They had no more control over colour than artists of the period, whose paintings would also fade or darken, quite unintentionally, depending on how/where they were kept.

If you're making a piece that you intend to look like an old Chippendale when the piece you make is itself old, you have to make it with very bright colours when it's new. Thus the piece you make does indeed "fade to the right colour".

BugBear

But then it will look like new Chippendale when it's new!

Yes - that's the point being made. Well done.

BugBear

 

[bugbear]

Was the family trade carpentry or joinery? (They are not the same thing!)

It's feasible for a firm or induividual to do both, but the distinction certainly used to be made; here's the famous 1911 edition of Encyclopedia Britannica on the subject:

He[The Carpenter] is distinguished from the joiner by his operations being directed to the mere carcass of a building, to things which have reference to structure only. Almost everything the carpenter does to a building is absolutely necessary to its stability and efficiency, whereas the joiner does not begin his operations until the carcass is complete, and every article of joiners' work might at any time be removed from a building without undermining it or affecting its most important qualities. Certainly in the practice of building a few things do occur regarding which it is difficult to determine to whose immediate province they belong, but the distinction is sufficiently broad for general purposes.

A carpenter would also be involved with scaffolding and shuttering work, which a posh jointer would not sully himself with.

BugBear