buying hand planes

[MattMac]

hi, i want to purchase some hand planes, i've read a lot of information and think i have two options, either quangsheng planes from workshop heaven or an old stanley or record plane from ebay. I think i like the second option most but i hear people discussing different models and ages as being the best so my question is how would i identify a good plane on ebay, what should i be looking for? i was thinking a #3, #5 and #7 would be a good collection?

 

[Jacob]

Big difference from 5 to 7 - I'd slot in a 5 1/2 in preference to one of them.
You just have to take pot luck on ebay - early supposedly "better" versions can be past it, later ones can be in excellent trim, "restored" ones can be wrecked. It's a learning curve! If it really doesn't match the description you get your money back fairly easily.

 

[Droogs]

Considering the minefield that it can be to get good usable planes on the web, why not put a wanted ad up here on the forum. State what sizes you are after and roughly what sort of condition and you may find some of the members may have "extras" they are willing to sell onto you. At least that way you have a decent chance of getting good tools for a sensible price.

 

[JohnPW]

You can identify a plane by age from features like shape of lever cap hole, handle material etc. Whether if it's any good is a different matter, which you can't really tell if it's on Ebay.

 

[Just4Fun]

I don't think I have ever seen a #3. It would be much easier to find a #4.

For many years the only plane I owned was a #5. You could do worse than get a #4 or #5 initially, see how you get on with it, and then decide what else to get. It would also give you some experience so you could better judge whether a used plane is OK.

 

[Jameshow]

Pick up a 4 because they are cheap and handy.

A 3 for smaller work.

A 5 1/2 or 6 for bigger jobs.

Unless jointing a 7/8 aren't really necessary so I'm told.

Finally pick up any old no 5 and use as a scrub plane. Round the blade and use it to clean up sawn timber when you don't want to use a your best planes mines a wickes one.

As to Stanley you want the pre handyman ones. Others will know the precise dates of the best ones.

Also with record the later ones with the screw cap iron are really rehashed sobo planes. Ok but not the real deal.

Cheers James

 

[ptturner]

When buying secondhand planes I would factor in the time need to flatten the sole, easiest way is to get a deadflat tile sample from a tile shop or very thick sheet of glass and tape sheets of sandpaper with spray adhesive. Progressing down to say 100grit from 40 or 60. Therefore making an offer on used planes you might want to use the setup time as bargaining from general punters in the free ads. Also pretty much all the blades will need re-honing so bear it in mind.

 

[Daniel2]

With the state of the new plane market, at present, I should think
second hand is the only option.
The new supply chain appears to have vapourised.
But, obtaining a good second hand one is a pure lottery if going the eBay (et al), route.

 

[Jameshow]

When buying secondhand planes I would factor in the time need to flatten the sole, easiest way is to get a deadflat tile sample from a tile shop or very thick sheet of glass and tape sheets of sandpaper with spray adhesive. Progressing down to say 100grit from 40 or 60. Therefore making an offer on used planes you might want to use the setup time as bargaining from general punters in the free ads. Also pretty much all the blades will need re-honing so bear it in mind.

I use the cast iron table of my bandsaw with a sheet of wet and dry on it. Seems flat enough to me.

Cheers James

 

[thetyreman]

I'd start with a 5 1/2, I use mine for almost everything, just get a good old bailey type second hand one, the thinner blades on them saves time, that's the main downside to the modern style of planes the thick blades, the less time spent sharpening the better.

 

[bp122]

Most suggestions above here are great.

I started with just a no.4 bought for under £20. Sharpened the blade, cleaned it up a bit and it was good to go. Used it for over a year for all sorts of jobs.

Then came across a no.6 in a "joblot" tool chest for next to no money - a bargain find for me. No.7s are expensive, but no. 6 isn't that expensive and are more common.

Don't look too make a set of these, buy as and when you need one.

Another approach that worked for me is, someone was selling a big bag of wooden planes for a tenner.

Brought them home, watched videos on how to use them and I loved it. I have many from small coffin smoothers to large 2 ft long jointers. That's a lot of planes for a tenner!

Most important point of it all.
Factor in the cost of a decent sharpening system: sharpening stones / diamond stones / scary sharp system / wet and dry paper on glass etc.

Your best planes (£20 or £300) are worthless if they aren't sharp.

 

[Stan]

If you are looking to ebay for a working plane rather than a collector's piece, once you have found a plane you fancy I suggest the following.

First check all the parts are there. If something you can't do without is missing, you will either have to make it or source it from somewhere. A bargain plane for £10 is not that good a bargain when it costs another £30 on replacement parts. Just a spare bolt could easily cost £10 or more.

Next check the sole. Parts broken off indicate it has been whacked fairly hard, so what else will be broken? Avoid broken soles.

Check the mouth on the sole, the slot on the bottom where the blade is. You are looking for cracks coming from the corners of the mouth, and rough edges around it. You want a sole with no cracks and with straight edges to the mouth. Repairing this part is a big undertaking, so avoid damage here.

Check the handles. Wood is vastly superior to plastic, which cracks easily. Cracked wooden handles are easier to repair than plastic, but better if they are not cracked in the first place.

Rust all over the place is no big deal. What you are looking for is pitting. A few spots here and there are ok.

Dont worry too much about the edge on a blade. It can be reground and/or sharpened without much bother. What you are looking for is firstly is it decent steel? This is no problem with older big name brands. Secondly look at the distance between the edge and the start of the slot: the closer they are the less life there is left in the blade. Often only the end of the blade is hardened and the hardening does not reach all the way to the slot. Once the hard steel is ground away the blade wont hold an edge.

Look at the edge of the cap iron ( USA = chipbreaker ), where it presses onto the blade. It will need to be flat along its length so the whole length presses onto the blade. If the edge cannot be made flat enough to press fully on the blade then the blade may flutter, affecting the quality of the cut.

There are other things to look for. I am only a beginner and no doubt wiser heads than mine can add to this.

Hope this helps. Regards.

 

[profchris]

It might be worth, once they reopen, visiting one of those antiques centres which have display cabinets from dozens of dealers. There is often a cabinet full of hand tools, occasionally priced as decorative (ouch!) but often maybe only 10% above eBay prices. You can inspect and handle these, which is a big plus.

 

[shed9]

As already pointed out but to add; used planes require investment beyond the initial purchase price and it can be a skeet shoot if you don't know what to look for or acquire one with an unworkable issue. The QS options however, although a quicker route to a known working state, are not as available as they were pre-COVID. Each option has its merit and a mix of the two is not to be excluded either.

Any decent Stanley or Record plane in fair condition can be coaxed to work, it's just knowing which ones to look for and to be honest everyone has their bias when asked. The sweet spot for me is the Stanley Type 11 give or take a couple of type numbers. You can normally identify these based on the number of patent dates behind the frog and the height of the front knob. Types 9 to 10 have two dates and Types 11-12 have three. Types 9 to 11 have low knobs and type 12 is the start of the high knobs on Stanley planes. As long as there is no (major) pitting, no cracks in the metal parts (predominantly the plane body and frog) and it's all there you can generally tease a working keeper out of it. Cracked handles or knobs is not a showstopper. Of course this assumes you don't pick up a Frankenstein-bitsa-plane but my own experience is that it's usually the lever caps which get swapped around only. Trawl Ebay's most recent sold prices for the planes you are looking for to get some idea of what they go for but make sure you get a good sampling of prices, they usually average out but you do get curveballs occasionally. Whatever you buy, if it's being shipped in post, ask the seller politely to make sure it is well packed. I once had a rare Stanley No.10 1/4 shipped to me in a taped up Tesco's plastic bag!!!!!

As for planes sizes, you cannot go wrong with a No.3, they are lovely to work with and one of my own favourites, just be cautious if you have large hands is all. Unless you have a specific need for a No.7, I'd hang fire on that one. Buy one at a time and start somewhere in the middle, a No.4 or No.4 1/2 perhaps, give it a clean, get it ready for use and let your use of it and your needs lead which one you buy next. Lots of useful advice up there ^ and on Youtube in flattening and prepping a plane. If you go the glass route for flattening, make sure you get actual float glass as not all glass is flat. If you are new to hand sharpening dip your toe in the scary sharp method initially as it's the most cost effective to start with.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I would start with a 5 1/2, Stanley or Record with wooden handles rather than plastic - that change seems to be about the time quality started to take a dive although there are perfectly good ones after that. There isn't much you can't do with one of them. Then a 3 or 4 (though I prefer 4 1/2s). A long one comes alot later unless you're going to do loads of long butt joints. If you come across ones with square topped (not rounded corners) irons so much the better. It's a bit of a rabbit hole, but don't worry too much about it - they all work, just some a little better than others.

 

[Nic Rhodes]

I would start with a 4 1/2 and a 5 1/2. The advantage of these is that they take the same blade. If / when you want a 7 (and it is not an essential purchase straight off but great fun) then this also takes the same blade. Record might save a few quid over Stanley. Not much difference in my book. I prefer wooden handles Phil eludes to above also.

 

[G S Haydon]

Hi Matt

Don't go crazy with the matching set idea just yet. Just buy one and get used to using it.

The No4 is a good start and will be always be useful. eBay is great for No4 planes. £25 should cover it. Just factor a bit of time to checking it over and tuning it up. It's not engineering or difficult to do, it just has some nuance.

If that's not for you a new No4 will cost more but just require honing the cutting iron and tweaking the cap iron.

Don't hurry to long planes. I was edge joining a 7 foot oak table top today and a 5 1/2 was all I needed.

If you can wait it's worth signing up to Workshop Heaven's mailing list. The have a seconds sale now and again. My 5 1/2 was around £120 and I couldn't find the blemish.

All best!

 

[Jacob]

Hi Matt

Don't go crazy with the matching set idea just yet. Just buy one and get used to using it.

The No4 is a good start and will be ever useful. eBay is great for No4 planes. £25 should cover it. Just factor a bit of time to checking it over and tuning it up. It's not engineering or difficult to do, it just has some nuance.

If that's not for you a new No4 will cost more but just require honing and tweaking the cap iron.

Don't hurry to long planes. I edge joining a 7 foot oak table top today and a 5 1/2 was all I needed.

If you can wait it's worth signing up to Workshop Heaven's mailing list. The have a seconds sale now and again. My 5 1/2 was around £120 and I couldn't find the blemish.

All best!

I agree about long planes. I use a 5 1/2 more than anything. I've got a 6 but don't think I've ever used it. 7 I've used but at that size an old woody is much handier - lighter for a start.
Never found a use for a 4 1/2 - too close to the 5 1/2, but the 5 is a big step away and very useful.

 

[bobblezard]

It might be worth, once they reopen, visiting one of those antiques centres which have display cabinets from dozens of dealers. There is often a cabinet full of hand tools, occasionally priced as decorative (ouch!) but often maybe only 10% above eBay prices. You can inspect and handle these, which is a big plus.

As Prof Chris said the antiques centres can be a good option to see plane's and lots of other tools before buying. I note that you are in North Yorkshire - Not a million miles away are GB Antiques in Lancaster and a Lords Salvage in Ingleton. They both have a couple of good tool sellers with a good selection of planes including Nos 3-7 and a fair number of block planes, shoulder planes etc. and pretty fair prices to be honest - sometimes you can find an absolute bargain on the other stalls, i.e. rusty with a broken tote etc but perfectly restorable.
Worth thinking about, good luck

 

[Ttrees]

Personally I'd go for the secondhand route also.
As said a no.4 should be really easy to get a hold of, for cheap at buy it now prices.
It might be the case that you would have to bid for anything other than four's and five's.
I would buy a good no four for about no more than 25 pounds, a nice heavy smoother.
a no.5 if the same price would make a good roughing plane.
I'd get a nice no.5 1/2 for the main work, I have two, one for shooting with.
To me, a different tool, the no.5 plane seems tippy in comparison.
I really love the no.5 1/2.

I wouldn't be bothered with what iron came with the plane, as long as the sole of it was sound, as in a good thick casting.(which may well narrow your options)
A bit of rust is no issue, and I'd be inclined to look at those first.
Some folk might be put off if the iron was corroded.

I wouldn't buy any plane without a picture of the front and back to show it was nice and chunky. (if the sole has a twist or whatever, then you've got some meat to work with)
The longer the plane, the more concern this is,
I wouldn't buy a long plane that is refurbished and polished.

No chips out of the mouth (another photo of the underside of the plane)
and looking at the cheeks to see if there was any hairline cracks present.
Preferably no cracked totes or knobs, if so, I'd want pics of each cheek to make sure.
Preferably plenty of life left in the iron, but just because most have a full length iron, and another has a bit less, wouldn't be important to me if wanting the heaviest one.

Not looked at the market on the bay to see the prices since the lockdown.
A good rough guide is to see what a no.4 goes for, buy it now price.
Last I looked it was less than 20 squids for one.

Have fun shopping.
Good luck
Tom