Benefits of swapping Stanley Block planes for LN...thoughts?

[GraemeD]

Hi all,

I've been a happy but maybe less demanding user of a pair of Stanley Block Planes (a newer 9 1/2 and an older 60 1/2) for several years. They have been something I have reached for when planing a chamfer, or tidying up end grain, but not too much else.

Having recently started work on some more demanding woodworking projects, I realised that these planes could be a lot more useful, but probably needed some work to bring them up to scratch. I therefore spent some time cleaning, tuning and sharpening them, and believe they are now pretty much as good as they could ever be without upgrading blades and the like.

However, I am finding them to be slightly disappointing in use. Hard to use smoothly and not really capable of taking a consistent fine shaving. Sometimes they work nicely, but on the next stroke they dig in with nasty fat shavings. I have a stock Record No4 which I have similarly tuned, and that works a treat, but I cannot get the block planes to respond similarly.

So, I'm asking myself if they have reached their limits and I should invest in a better block plane. The LN low angle block springs to mind, as everyone seems to rate it highly. I am about to take a trip to the US, so such items become a little more affordable....now you can see how my mind is working!

So, my question is.....will this solve my problems? Have my Stanleys run out of steam, or is there further fettling to be done? Or do I just have poor technique? What kind of improvements will the LN offer me in use over my existing Stanleys? I know the LN has a heavier and tougher blade, but will this make a huge difference?

Bottom line, would I be disappointed if I upgrade, or should I save my money and improve what I already have first?

All suggestions and input would be appreciated!
Graeme

 

[wizer]

I think it is very unlikely that you will be disappointed with your purchase. Whether or not you should fettle what you already have is down to your bank balance and your patience. If you can afford it or don't want to spend time fettling, then, absolutely, go for the LN.

 

[Karl]

Hi Graeme

I'd definitely go for the LN low angle block (don't really see the point of the 9 1/2).

With the current exchange rate you should be able to get it for less than £80 (it's on LN website at $150). I've seen Stanley blocks sell on the bay for silly money - a standard, used, Stanley 9 1/2 recently went for over £40. So if you could sell yours for say £25 each, by the time you've sold your old ones, it might only have cost you another £30 to own an LN!

Cheers

Karl

 

[Smudger]

I recently replaced a Stanley 60½ with the LN equivalent, and I am very pleased with it. I may well go for a standard angle as well.
It seems tighter, easier to use, and the #18-style cap is very comfortable.

 

[woodbloke]

Over the years I've had Record and Stanley bock planes of various denominations :roll:...I got hold of the low angle LN about 4 years ago and it really is the dogs whiskers. I wouldn't even hesitate...just go and buy one - Rob

 

[GraemeD]

So far pretty unanimous then!! I think a few dollars spent may well be in order.....

Just for my interest, what benefits do you guys think I will see with a LN? Is there any reason to look at LV too?

Graeme

 

[Chems]

Im in the market for a decent block plane and this is the one Ive got my eye on. Cheapest Ive seen in the UK is £71 on the bay.

 

[GraemeD]

Hi Chem,

That's the 102....so a mini one rather than the full size 60 1/2. Anyone have an opinion as to which of these to go for?

Graeme

 

[bugbear]

... not really capable of taking a consistent fine shaving. Sometimes they work nicely, but on the next stroke they dig in with nasty fat shavings.

Those are classic symptoms of either:

* badly concave sole

* loosely mounted blade

(or, I suppose - in the nightmare tool from hell - both)

BugBear

 

[Karl]

Hi Chem,

That's the 102....so a mini one rather than the full size 60 1/2. Anyone have an opinion as to which of these to go for?

Graeme

The 102 is the fixed mouth. I'd go for the 60 1/2.

I've actually got the LV adjustable block, and the LN 102. The 102 is good for little trimming jobs, but is a little too lightweight for cleaning up wider end grain.

HTH

Cheers

Karl

 

[Racers]

Hi, Graeme

I have a Stanley 60 1/2 and a LN60 1/2 and the LN so loads better than the Stanley well worth the extra, but the Stanley is a good plane after some tuning I never had the problems you describe, is it a new one? mines an older one.


Pete

 

[GraemeD]

Hi Pete,

Thanks for the pointers. My Stanley 60 1/2 is an old one; I bought it second hand and unseen as part of a batch of old planes from a chap who used to work at Bletchley Park during WW2.....an interesting fella to talk with!

I have no idea of its date, but interestingly it is narrower than my Stanley 9 1/2, which I bought about 20 years ago new. It seems somehow slack and rattly with no "finesse", although the sole is nice and flat. My feeling is the blade is not held very firmly; maybe I need to try tightening the screw some more, although that seems to make adjustments difficult!

Graeme

 

[bugbear]

Hi Pete,

Thanks for the pointers. My Stanley 60 1/2 is an old one; I bought it second hand and unseen as part of a batch of old planes from a chap who used to work at Bletchley Park during WW2.....an interesting fella to talk with!

I have no idea of its date, but interestingly it is narrower than my Stanley 9 1/2, which I bought about 20 years ago new. It seems somehow slack and rattly with no "finesse", although the sole is nice and flat. My feeling is the blade is not held very firmly; maybe I need to try tightening the screw some more, although that seems to make adjustments difficult!

Graeme

If the blade is "slack", what happens is:

* slack blade doesn't engage at all

* blade depth is lowered

* blade touches wood

* blade is pulled deeply into cut by the wood itself, taking up the slack

Result - plane that will only take "grabby" thick shavings.

A concave plane is similar, but not quite so nasty (to use)

BugBear

 

[jasonB]

I've got an old 60 1/2 with a LN blade in it, Works fine for me Prefer it to my newer stanley with standard blade.

Jason

 

[DuncanvdH]

I've got an old 60 1/2 with a LN blade in it, Works fine for me Prefer it to my newer stanley with standard blade.

Jason

Ditto here. The LN blade is significantly thicker than the stanley blade.
I don't know why, but it works much better than the original.

I also have the LV block and apron plane and the LN 102. I feel the LV block plane is too wide for my (not so small) hands. Prefer the stanley with the LN blade.

Duncan

 

[Paul Chapman]

You will find the Veritas and the Lie Nielsen low angle block planes streets ahead of the Stanley and Record block planes, particularly when dealing with more demanding types of wood.

Both the Veritas and the LN are excellent and their peformance is about the same. I prefer the Veritas with its Norris-type adjuster which the LN doesn't have, but you wouldn't be disappointed with either.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[ivan]

If you are strapped for cash, it is possible to tweak the Stanley. For me the best solution is a very thick blade, even thicker than LN. You can't buy one so I used industrial superglue to bond* one of those 2 layer Japanese blades (Tilgear) to the original Stanley. Carefully file the mouth so that most of the blade touches it (usually concave) and flatten the sole. I now have LN too (can't stand the LV adjuster) but often use the Stanley which fits my big hands OK.

*At least 5 yrs and going strong; ideally bury the Stanley blade in 1" of sand in an oven tin and detemper it in a domestic oven at max temp for 30 mins.

 

[GraemeD]

Thanks for all the input guys. I tried tightening the blade holding screw a notch and it definitely improved matters. Not exactly slick, but shavings were more consistent and could be made with quite fine settings. I think a blade upgrade may be the answer to this.....thicker blade and better steel.

Your suggestion Ivan is an intriguing one. What about making plane blades from tool steel plate like some of the members here have done before? That way you could have whatever thickness works for you. I guess the grooves milled into a block plane blade which engage with the adjuster might prove to be an issue here....then your superglue trick is a good workaround. I may have a go at something like this with my old plane, as it would be great to bring it up to scratch.

In the end, as I'm off to the US next week on holiday, I ordered a LN by mail order. Bit of a coup as Woodcraft (a large chain of tool stores out there) had an 80th anniversary deal yesterday only. 10% off and free postage, so my gleaming 60 1/2 will come in at something like £68 delivered.....40% off the UK price. I couldn't resist!!

Thanks for all the pointers guys.....I feel much more confident with my buying decision, and don't think I'll be disappointed.

Cheers
Graeme

 

[bugbear]

Thanks for all the input guys. I tried tightening the blade holding screw a notch and it definitely improved matters. Not exactly slick, but shavings were more consistent and could be made with quite fine settings.

Hmm. Have you checked the upper surface of the bedding, and the lower surface of the cap?

BugBear

 

[GraemeD]

I have, and they looked pretty good to me. Not that some careful fettling might not help some more, but the surfaces were clean, paint free and reasonably flat at least with a cursory examination.

The results now that I have really tightened up the blade are ok, but I guess would be improved with a few tweaks.....for example using a thicker blade and some minor fettling of the plane's mating surfaces. This is soomething I will try when I get a chance, as the plane is definitely usable!

Graeme