Another Wadkin AGS 10 restoration thread.

[Hornbeam]

I had an AGS for about 15 years with the older style fence locking on both sides. I alway found a degree of lead/lag as you moved the fence in out, meaning you had to check for parallel. My new saw has a single front rail and doesnt suffer from this so I would probably prefer that on the Wadkin. I guess Wadkin made the change to improve things.
Ian

 

[wallace]

I spoke to the chap earlier in the day.

The issue is transport. He reckons it's too heavy for a standard courier, and so would have to go on a pallet.

Then I'm looking at £255 or somthing, and I've seen whole 3ph saws sell for that on eBay.

I'm wondering if the fence above is nicer to use than the older fence. As in all things being equal (which they are not!) which fence would be nicer?

Thank you.

You can get a pallet courier for as little as £50 for a half pallet

 

[julianf]

The part number of the main table on the slim unit with the new fence is -

D-1026M/207

Now all I need to do is find the manual for the unit with the wide base and see if the part number is the same...

 

[peter-harrison]

I have an AGS/P. The fence is very solid and as long as you keep it clean and give it the odd squirt of WD40, it's as smooth as you could wish.

 

[julianf]

Im not up on the codes - is the AGS/p the old style back to front one, or the new one?

 

[julianf]

Sorry, disregard my last comment - I found it - new style fence.

I've struck a deal with the eBay seller, and will purchase the fence and table above.

I won't get it here for a while, as the cheapest (as in free: ) transport option that I could find is someone I trust on another forum who happens to be going there next month. As my previous fence was broken by a pallet firm this will be a nicer option anyhow.

I'll see if the whole table can be fitted to my saw, but, of not, maybe I can use it to make a nice router table or somthing. Or try and resell it.

Either way, it seems like I may have the fence issue sorted.

Thanks again to all for the comments and advice so far - really is appreciated to get feedback from people who know more than me!

 

[julianf]

Update time!

Todays haul -

Its incomplete, but, between my existing damaged saw, and this one, i should have pretty much everything.

I also purchased the ags250 top / fence that was mentioned above, but i dont have it yet (its miles away, and a friend is due to pick it up on his way past) - thats still a gamble though as i dont know if the fixings will match with the lower casting, and the parts in the photo came up for sale locally, so i went for them also, to be sure.

I have enough now to start the rebuild anyhow.

 

[julianf]

This is the plate on todays unit -

In contrast to the one on my damaged saw -

I think that makes the "new" (to me) one to be a 1958 build, vs the 1976 green one.

In truth i did not even know they came in colours other than green, but the paint on the '58 one looks original.

 

[julianf]

I have not yet received the AGS250 top that was mentioned above, as a friend is picking it up in person for me. As a result of today's "find", in hindsight, it may not have been necessary, but, what ill do is get a working unit out of these two that i have currently, and then make a decision on the latter top / fence when it finally arrives here.

In light of that, job #1 -

The micro adjust on the new fence wont turn at all -

It does not look like its turned in a good few years!

Its the only part i have in from the car just yet so ive added some kerosene to the "well" and ill leave it overnight -

 

[julianf]

This is the base of the replacement saw -

I cant think that is the original paint work, as its in too good condition, but its certainly the right colour for the period.

Im not going to mess about with it. I dont need shiny tools - just ones that work as they should.

Moving on to the replacement fence -

The two screws on the bottom are to hold in the micro adjust and the plunger that works on the fence rail. Curiously, the newer fence does not have the micro locking screw in the same way.

Taking them both out meant that i could get out the main plunger, but the micro adjust was proper seized.

Heat and a oil filter strap got the knob off the shaft (its supposed to come off) and then i was able to tap the micro shaft -

One last point of confusion - i cant work out why the main plunger is in two parts -

Anyone know the reason for this?

The micro is a bit damaged on one section, but im hoping it will be fine. Ill add grease and re-assemble. This is not meant to be a "take everything apart" job - im interested in the working parts, but im not going to obsessively clean every bit of the unit.

 

[deema]

Yep, it is normally in two parts. You can find the manual in Wadkins library where it’s shown.

 

[julianf]

Yes, i spotted that - it looks like its sprung?

Either the spring in mine is very tough (as in i cant compress the plunger by hand) or its failed, and seized at compresson.

I dont entirely understand what its for?


Currently trying to work out how much of the trunnion assembly has to come apart before the rest of it can be lifted out. Im mainly interested in reducing weight for moving it about right now.

 

[julianf]

So, i have now realised that my 1958 saw has a different trunnion assembly to my original 1970s saw.

Ill take photos tomorrow.

I wonder why they changed things - if it was an economic choice or an engineering one.

I now see how to get the assembly out of the 1958 saw, but the screw that locks the tilt screw shaft housing (for want of a better name) into place isnt keen on turning at all. So far as i can tell this needs to be removed for the rest of the job to come free of the main casting.

I dont know how much longer ill try though, as the only reason i wanted to separate it was to reduce weight.

Ill see if i cant upload some photos later.

 

[MilesH]

I should make up some sort of wheeled base for this.

I'm actually better at metal work than I am at wood, so would an angle iron (steel) base with some wheels on it be all that I really need?

Any recommendation on some decent wheeled castors? My workshop floor is concrete, and fairly flat, but it's not a shiny, power trowelled factory floor.

If you want a minimalist solution, you can get a set of these castors and drill two holes in each of the two "feet". https://www.castors-online.co.uk/acatal ... ml#SID=219 A few washers will give extra clearance, if needed. You'll need some way to lock the machine in position, of course. I'm planning to use these on my Wadkin BAO/S, to preserve the Dalek look

 

[MilesH]

If you want a minimalist solution, you can get a set of these castors and drill two holes in each of the two "feet". https://www.castors-online.co.uk/acatal ... ml#SID=219 A few washers will give extra clearance, if needed.......

Ref: wadkin-12-bao-s-planer-thicknesser-project-t114281-30.html#p1250913

 

[julianf]

Thank you - ill have a read of that in a bit. I have a whole box of decent castors, but i was concerned about a way of locking the saw in place also. Ive not yet read the thread you link to, so possibly its covered there...

 

[julianf]

Some of the oddities that i mentioned elsewhere :

So there is the 50s saw -

The "locking plate" on the rise and fall mechanism on the 50s unit seems to be a cast lump -

(youre looking at the part with the three bolts on at the bottom)

The arbor side looks like this -

you see the two loose screws near the wall? Thats where the riving knife would attach (saw is on its back in the shot)


All well and good?

So on to the 70s saw -

The plate that holds the sliding section in place is suddenly not part of the casting, but a separate plate -

But also theres a big plate on the other side with oval holes milled in it (you can see the blade though it) -

This is odd, as, so far as i can tell, the function is the same for both setups, but the implementation different.

The manuals show the two parts setups - i had not noticed until i realise the physical items were different.

Im wondering why the change was made.

 

[julianf]

And here is a quick photo of the fence rails -

Older saw -

Newer saw -

I realise one is metric and the other imperial, but i cant think they swapped away from the brass insert for anything other than financial reasons!

Which makes me think some about the mechanisms also - i mean, ultimately, ill only keep one of these, and it will be a hybrid of all the incomplete saws that i now own (!) so i may as well choose the mechanism that seems preferable - and, as illustrated by the fence scales, i dont believe that things are always changed for anything other than financial reasons - i mean the later mech may be superior or it may not be - just because its newer means nothing!

 

[Trevanion]

i dont believe that things are always changed for anything other than financial reasons - i mean the later mech may be superior or it may not be - just because its newer means nothing!

You look at ANY piece of kit whether it's old Wadkins and the newer Felder machines, a lot of "changes" are to cut costs.

Sedgwick is a prime example, The early kit was all cast iron and built to last, the newer stuff is a lot of sheet metal with some castings. There are some SMALL improvements over the older machines. But there's also the problem of when they built stuff like tanks and to last forever they were basically killing off their customer base because you'll never need to buy a new machine again once you had one, why buy a new one when the 50 year old one still works fine? The 571 morticer is a good example as the going price is around £300 for an old second hand one which has nothing wrong with it at all and a brand new one will set you back £2000 inc vat, there's a massive surplus of very good old Sedgwick machines because they were built to last. The Sedgwick planers have changed their looks many times through the years, the features largely stayed the same though.

The earliest model

The latest model (They did move the handle after 50 years of people kicking them off with their shins though, so that's a plus)

 

[MilesH]

Julian,

My AGS is a bit younger than your later one and has the same guide system for rise and fall movement.

The earlier system on your 50s saw has a proper gib strip adjustment. The later system uses single point brass stud and locknut to adjust the fit. I've no experience of a machine with the gib strip adjustment system. I've never managed to set up the rise and fall mechanism on my AGS satisfactorily, though. The motor/arbor assembly should fall under its own weight or you get lost motion. Instead, it shudders down, at best...... This is one thing about the AGS that infuriates me....