6010/11 welding electrodes, why not popular in europe?

[DennisCA]

First off. I'm new to welding, a while ago I got a 2d hand Kemppi Super Kempak welder, 150 amp rectifier welder so I get DC.It's a good welder, my dad is a professional welder and used it without problems when he repaired some stainless pipes at home, but my skill level is so far very low, I have never really welded before.

There A LOT of different electrodes out there and learning what they all do and whats best for you seems at first like an overwhelming task but I've found two main electrodes that seems to be preferred and it's different based on location. If I ask on swedish forums the venerable 7018 is the togo electrode, also most common electrode you can get.

When I asked on a US forum I got the answer that 6010/11 are way better than 7018s for beginners and hobbyist, 7018s produce the best weld but are overkill a lot of the time, 6010/11s are much easier to use and more versatile. But over here in europe they seem impossible to even find, and people here don't really seem to know they exist.

One guy also really hated on 6013s and claimed they where the worst electrodes ever. But in europe they seem to be the only commonly available rutile electrodes, and over on the euro side I hear good things about them...

So I am wondering if the 6010/11 are that good, are we just missing out on something here? Would we also think the 6013s are junk if we got to try 6010s?

Anyone here got personal experience with these electrodes, know any reason why they are so hard to find here, yet common as dirt "over there"? Inquiring minds want to know...

 

[DennisCA]

Guess there aren't any welders in this forum

 

[Wuffles]

I only use mig and wouldn't know the difference between whatever is put in my hand if I am pushed to use an arc, which is I presume what you're on about?

 

[DennisCA]

Yes, maybe it was just a really stupid question. My mum told me there weren't any such thing, but maybe she lied to me.

 

[blackrodd]

Sorry, I can't help either, I also just use a mig and although I can "stick" weld only know the basics
Rodders

 

[Wuffles]

Perhaps a little too specific a question for here.

Try http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/ if you're really interested as it's more weldy (you can have that word, it was mine but I will share).

Have you ever tried MIG welding? I started out wanting to weld legs for tables and benches I was making and bought a second hand (well used) arc welder, but before trying that I was introduced to mig by a kind chap from that forum. I was converted right then and there. Bought a mig setup the next day. I found it less "scary" to arc welding, but that's just me.

 

[n0legs]

Welding in the US, and some others, is different to Europe due to supply voltages on the welding machine

 

[DennisCA]

Wuffles:
My dad has a mig welder, he's a professional welder, well he gave it up in the 80s to become a farmer but the skillset was useful there. Anyway that is part of the reason I went with a stick. I can borrow his mig when I need to. But a stick welder is the more versatile welder, and cheaper and more reliable, no gas either. It's harder but I am willing to learn the skill since it'll be so useful. Since I bought my welder my dad already borrowed it because he couldn't weld a stainless pipe he needed to replace with a mig welder.

Another thing I like about it is that I can later add a TIG setup with scratch start if I want to, then between me and my dad I'll have Stick, MIG and TIG covered.

 

[DennisCA]

Welding in the US, and some others, is different to Europe due to supply voltages on the welding machine

They do have 240 there though. My welder uses two 230V phases for 400V single phase. Not as good as actual 3-phase but better than plain 230V.

 

[Wuffles]

Wuffles:
My dad has a mig welder, he's a professional welder, well he gave it up in the 80s to become a farmer but the skillset was useful there. Anyway that is part of the reason I went with a stick. I can borrow his mig when I need to. But a stick welder is the more versatile welder, and cheaper and more reliable, no gas either. It's harder but I am willing to learn the skill since it'll be so useful. Since I bought my welder my dad already borrowed it because he couldn't weld a stainless pipe he needed to replace with a mig welder.

Another thing I like about it is that I can later add a TIG setup with scratch start if I want to, then between me and my dad I'll have Stick, MIG and TIG covered.

I don't do enough to worry about gas really (I use a dirt cheap mix), it's a minor concern, but if you've tried it and it's not for you, or you prefer the sticks then that's cool. I struggle to keep the electrodes dry, and it's all a bit baffling for a thicko like me.

I like to just pick it up, turn on the electrics and the gas, and just stick stuff man

I do enjoy the metalworking though, it's more permanent and instant than the wood. Less to worry about, provided you get your welds nice and tidy - nothing like my stick welding, that's bad.

 

[DennisCA]

I prefer to learn to use sticks as I think it has more use for me. If I need a MIG specific welder I can goto my dad and borrow his, and me having a stick turned out well for him too, the processes complete each other.

 

[dickm]

Wonder if Oerlikon or one of the other rod manufacturers still publishes sets of specs for the different rods? I've got one somewhere, but have to admit to not understanding it

 

[t8hants]

Back when I was an employed person we always used to use Eutectic rods, which I think are pretty universal the specifications are here
https://www.castolin.com/en-US/Manual-Metal-Arc-alloys

 

[woodfarmer]

When i weld "mild steel" I use locally bought general purpose " mild steel rods. but for anything difficult, my go to rod is a eutectic 680. Sadly the ones i had have now all been used and I haven't found any replacement so use stainless steel welding rods instead. Not as easy or as good as the old 680's

https://www.castolin.com/en-US/Manual-Metal-Arc-alloys seen here but I haven’t been able to actually get any.

 

[DennisCA]

Never heard of the word eutetic before, I only knew of cellulosic (6010/11), rutile (6013s) and basic coatings (7018s). I assume it's a british term for one of these three. The different terms for similar things makes it a bit problematic to figure out which is which. I use the american terms as they seem to be the most used online. But here we use our own set of terminology different from both UK and US.

I've gone through all of ESABs electrodes and they have a 6010 on paper, called PipeWeld 6010 Plus, but it's not for sale anywhere here. So 6010/6011 rods are suspiciously absent from what I've gathered, most of europe. I've come across some mention of these electrodes in the UK where they have been referred to as NuFive or Nu5.

 

[t8hants]

They are the manufacturers, and always claimed to pan European

 

[Colekcampbell]

First off. I'm new to welding, a while ago I got a 2d hand Kemppi Super Kempak welder, 150 amp rectifier welder so I get DC.It's a good welder, my dad is a professional welder and used it without problems when he repaired some stainless pipes at home, but my skill level is so far very low, I have never really welded before.

There A LOT of different electrodes out there and learning what they all do and whats best for you seems at first like an overwhelming task but I've found two main electrodes that seems to be preferred and it's different based on location. If I ask on swedish forums the venerable 7018 is the togo electrode, also most common electrode you can get.

When I asked on a US forum I got the answer that 6010/11 are way better than 7018s for beginners and hobbyist, 7018s produce the best weld but are overkill a lot of the time, 6010/11s are much easier to use and more versatile. But over here in europe they seem impossible to even find, and people here don't really seem to know they exist.

One guy also really hated on 6013s and claimed they where the worst electrodes ever. But in europe they seem to be the only commonly available rutile electrodes, and over on the euro side I hear good things about them...

So I am wondering if the 6010/11 are that good, are we just missing out on something here? Would we also think the 6013s are junk if we got to try 6010s?

Anyone here got personal experience with these electrodes, know any reason why they are so hard to find here, yet common as dirt "over there"? Inquiring minds want to know...

I’m an American welder and the purpose for 6010 is not because it’s easy for beginners (it’s not). The reason is it has very deep penetration and has a fast freeze flux and has a very good thermal stability meaning it can cool down without cracking faster than a 7018. We use 7018 slot in the US to just not for root passes normally.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Nice bit of thread resurrection.

 

[Spectric]

Not to mention some very old names we don't see anymore.

 

[Sideways]

I'll drop this in here for when the thread gets resurrected again in 2030

During my 30 hours intro to welding course, our instructor mentioned that a well chosen rod can make it much easier for a beginner to get a good result with stick welding.
I'm 99% certain he had us using Oerlikon Overcord rods. Those and a decently powerful welding set made stick welding far easier than when I'd tried it in the past.

Edit to add
"Oerlikon Overcord E (6013) is a rutile medium coated electrode, especially developed for welding mild steel in all positions.
Ideal for general fabrication, structural engineering, shipbuilding, vehicle and agricultural repairs.
Excellent striking and restriking characteristics with a stable arc."