16"-19" Tenon Saw options? Where/what to buy?

[Ali]

After pretty much being influenced by the article "Understanding Western Backsaws" (http://www.popularwoodworking.com/artic ... n_backsaws) I have started to try build a portfolio of saws. So far I have Lie Nielsen Dovetail Saw, the two Veritas Carcass saws (one Rip, one Crosscut) and recently received a very expensive (Thanks HMRC) Bad Axe 14" Sash Saw (hybrid cut).

I'd like to add a larger Tenon Saw to my collection and then hopefully I'm done (he says!) but there doesn't seem to be much option out there? I can only really find a Lie Nielsen from Axminster or go down the route of ordering another Bad Axe. I am not set up nor have I ever sharpened my own saw so used wasn't an option when I started buying. Does anyone else know what else is out there?

 

[Cheshirechappie]

As a straight answer, there's this - http://www.flinn-garlick-saws.co.uk/aca ... ml#SID=528 .

However, before writing the cheque, it may be worth asking yourself what sort of work you'll be doing. Furniture-sized tenons can be cut very nicely with a rip-filed sash saw of 14" length or so. To need a true tenon saw, you'd be doing larger joinery-type work.

Of course if it's just for the joy of owning, different matter. Go right ahead.

Edit to add - We're spoiled, these days. For about two-and-a-half decades I cut tenons with a 12" crosscut-filed 'tenon' saw because that was pretty much all that was available. Not brilliant, but it got there. It was only recently that I invested in a 14" oldie off Ebay and filed it rip. Much better.

If you're investing in top quality resharpenable saws, it's well worth learning to sharpen them. It's not difficult, but like a lot of woodworking skills, a bit of practice improves results a lot. Buy a couple of car-boot/Ebay cheapies to practice, and start on something with bigger rip teeth. Andy Lovelock's Youtube video 'Sharpening Western Saws' is a good place to learn the basics.

 

[FestoolFishy]

HI, there is a new 16" Rip tenon saw on ebay at the moment with Buy it Now £160 inc leather case
I think these LN saws are good value compared to others I have bought from Wenzloff / Bad Axe
But my favourite come from a new maker in the US very special saws
Cheers Peter

 

[RKrush]

I really like the Veritas saws I have (carcass and dovetail). Having spotted their new offering of tenon saw, I can barely hold off.

 

[Ali]

Thanks for the replies guys. I do hope to learn sharpening ChesireChappie but that involves practice and being set up which I am not. I appreciate your experience in this matter.

I really want to see those Veritas Tenon Saws in the flesh, I did like the carcass version of their saws in preference to the Lie Nielsens. Has anyone else used them yet?

Who are the makers of your new favourite Peter?

 

[swagman]

Just bear in mind. By traditional definition a Carcass saw was always sharpened x cut, and never rip tooth.

 

[swagman]

Dovetail Saw: Rip Tooth. Traditional lengths of 8 - 10 inch.

Carcass Saw: Crosscut Tooth. Traditional lengths of 11 - 12 inch.

Sash Saw: Rip Tooth or Crosscut Tooth.Traditional lengths if 14 inch.

Tenon Saw. Rip Tooth.Traditional lengths of 18 - 20 inch.

Stewie;



਍

 

[pedder]

Hi Stewie,

I kind of disagree with this:

Just bear in mind. By traditional definition a Carcass saw was always sharpened x cut, and never rip tooth.

At the time, the terms dovetail, carcass, sash and tenon saw where formed, nobody filed a saw with fleam. Carcass saws were for the bigger dovtails in the carcass. I think these terms are a bit blurry. If I used them, I support them with details.

Cheers
Pedder

 

[swagman]

Hi Stewie,

I kind of disagree with this:

Just bear in mind. By traditional definition a Carcass saw was always sharpened x cut, and never rip tooth.

At the time, the terms dovetail, carcass, sash and tenon saw where formed, nobody filed a saw with fleam. Carcass saws were for the bigger dovtails in the carcass. I think these terms are a bit blurry. If I used them, I support them with details.

Cheers
Pedder

Hi Pedder. Good of you hear from you. If we can agree to disagree then that are the hallmarks of healthy & constructive debate.

Carcass saw, commonly found in 11 to 12 inch lengths and was primarily made in a 14 ppi crosscut configuration. It was used to cut very precise joinery across the grain.

By its own definition the Carcass Saw was used to cut joinery timber to precise length on carcass work. That would not have excluded its use for fine joinery joints where part of that joint needed to be formed by cutting across the grain. such as tenon or halving joint.
The remainder of the joint that needed to be cut with the grain would have been done so using a rip tooth Sash Saw, as the traditional length of Tenon Saws, would have deemed slightly too long for precise joinery work.

As dovetail joints were traditionally only ever used on 7/8th thick stock, the blade depths on the dovetail saws were generally no more than 1 1/2" to 2" max. For deeper cut dovetails that exceeded the traditional depth of dovetail saws, most likely a Sash or Tenon Saw would have been used to cut them.

By details I am guessing your asking about sources of information. Here is 1 of my sources. http://www.vintagesaws.com/library/ftj/ ... all97.html

regards Stewie;

 

[pedder]

Hi Stewie

whom do you quote here?

Carcass saw, commonly found in 11 to 12 inch lengths and was primarily made in a 14 ppi crosscut configuration. It was used to cut very precise joinery across the grain.
I ask, because open handled 12" long saws seem quite rare to me and not "commonly found".

What I'm saying is, there is no very long tradition in filing joinery saws crosscut at all.
Take the Disston Catalogues and show me a crosscut joinery saw...

I think the terms refer mostly to the length and the men who did the work used the saw he had on hand.

I don't have the book on my hand yet, but what about the Seaton saws. Were the filed crosscut?

Cheers
Pedder

 

[swagman]

Hi Pedder. After going back and reviewing some of the early Disston catalogues , you are indeed correct. The backsaws were not filed with fleam, that tooth count was used to make the saw more compatible for cross grain work. On this point I stand corrected and thank you for clarifying this.

regards; Stewie.

 

[broga118]

I realise that I am replying to an old post here but I've had a pair of the Veritas saws for about 3 weeks now and have used them to make a pair of mission style coffee and a new base for my workbench and I can't fault them.