Woodworking vice linings

[John Brown]

I've had a couple of second-hand woodwork vices on a shelf for about a thousand years, and this afternoon, for no good reason, decided to mount one on my bench. I think it's a Record 52, quick release and with dog. I finally got it fitted after a struggle(heavy things!). Now I had always assumed, stupidly it seems, that the holes for attaching linings were threaded. Apparently not. I can line the moveable jaw using wood screws, but I am loathe to drop the whole thing and the wooden spacers out again to line the fixed jaw. I am thinking of screwing a lining to the front of the bench(no, I didn't arrange for the fixed jaw to be totally flush with the front of the bench, as I couldn't see a lot of point. The metalwork of the fixed jaw IS pretty flush though).
Any advice gratefully received

 

[sunnybob]

That vice is well over a 100 quid now.

I have one, and i inset the rear into the bench, but only to the metal face. i prefer the vice to be a bit proud to enable me to be able to clamp odd sized pieces.
I use 12 mm plywood for the jaws, fixed by screws.

i believe vices 50 year old have screwed threads, but I have found no issues with my woodscrews.

If you havent used this vice before, the front face is slightly canted out at the bottom, untill its firmly tightened. At first I thought it was a fault. it isnt.

 

[undergroundhunter]

I have a similar vice to yours, mine had 18mm ply that I had kicking around. The front jaw is bolted on (recessed bolts) the rear jaw liner is screwed on through the face of the liner into the bench as you have described. Works fine no problems and easy to swap it out should it get too beaten up.

Matt

 

[John Brown]

OK, I've taken another look, and reckon that the wooden spacer will be behind the holes in the fixed jaw, so I'll use some scrap ply and screw through. I take it ply is better than MDF?
I think I paid £25.00 each for these, but I can't find the eBay emails to verify exactly how long they've been langusihing. A thousand years is probably a bit of an exaggeration. More like 5.

Thanks for the replies

 

[John Brown]

It's actually an Irwin Record 52, with quick release and dog. I can't seem to find one on eBay that's exactly the same.
And I now realize I should have said "cheeks" rather than "linings".

I actually have some leather that I bought for another purpose and didn't use, but I think that might be gilding the lily for the level of wood butchering I get up to.

 

[undergroundhunter]

It's actually an Irwin Record 52, with quick release and dog. I can't seem to find one on eBay that's exactly the same.
And I now realize I should have said "cheeks" rather than "linings".

I actually have some leather that I bought for another purpose and didn't use, but I think that might be gilding the lily for the level of wood butchering I get up to.

You will be amazed at how much more grip you will get if you line the jaws with leather.

Matt

 

[mrpercysnodgrass]

You could make several cheeks to line your jaws, with leather, cork or rubber mounted on wood or MDF but instead of screwing or bolting them in you can use rare earth magnets, that way you can have linings to suit the job in hand and you will not need to take the vise off to replace the fixed jaw.

 

[worn thumbs]

Over the years I have used vices with jaws made from beech,iroko,MDF and birch play.They all worked.I never have found a use for the dog on the front jaw though,has anybody?

 

[Jacob]

.....I never have found a use for the dog on the front jaw though,has anybody?

Nor me, but it looks a good idea!

 

[ED65]

(no, I didn't arrange for the fixed jaw to be totally flush with the front of the bench, as I couldn't see a lot of point. The metalwork of the fixed jaw IS pretty flush though).

I flipflopped for ages about having the rear jaw inlet so the lining would be flush or face-mounted and eventually decided to go with Paul Sellers's advice, and Robert Wearing's before him, and not bother to inlet it.

I love the neat look of an unbroken front edge to a bench but their separate arguments in favour of face-mounting are persuasive.

In Wearing's case his books on workshop aids show the possibilities for a range of different linings that can be dropped in as needed. Sellers demonstrates on one of his pages how useful it is to be able to grip behind the board being clamped up if it's heavy, which alone is enough to convince me it's preferable (and it wasn't an argument I'd read elsewhere previously).

As far as lining material goes, MDF isn't the most robust but it can work just fine. Nearly anything can be used, even the cheapest pine. Going with something cheap and cheerful there's little danger of being precious about chiselling or sawing into it accidentally which can be valuable.

 

[ED65]

I never have found a use for the dog on the front jaw though,has anybody?

Obviously the way it's intended to work is you bore a series of dog holes inwards from the vice then you can pinch workpieces between the rising dog and one or more of those. But if your bench allows the easy use of clamps and/or you have stops of some kind to use when planing they can be like a fifth wheel.

It's all about the way you prefer to do your workholding.

 

[bugbear]

I never have found a use for the dog on the front jaw though,has anybody?

Obviously the way it's intended to work is you bore a series of dog holes inwards from the vice then you can pinch workpieces between the rising dog and one or more of those.

Yeah - if you haven't made the holes in your bench, you'll struggle to find a
use for the dog in the jaw!

BugBear

 

[monkeybiter]

Mine doesn't have a dog and I'd swap it in an instant, but then I hold a lot of irregular shapes and often on the bench top clamped against little temporary blocks of ply screwed onto the bench. I sometimes hold a piece of wood in the vice with some smaller pivot blocks so that it projects above the jaws/bench top and acts as an impromptu dog. A permanent rising dog would be better though.

 

[MusicMan]

After some 40 years of using my vice inlet so the front is flush with the side of the bench, I have changed to the "Sellers" style. It's an easier mounting and I could also use it to correct a slight out-of-square fault in the Paramo vice. The rear cheek is 40 mm deep and the front about 45, which allows for dog holes. I also made the width of the cheeks twice the width of the vice. These have all been big improvements for me on the older style. It is surprising how many more part-assemblies can easily be clamped now.

Keith

 

[monkeybiter]

Wow! And the inlay? Show-off. Mine look like a beaver's off-cuts.

 

[John Brown]

Thanks for all the replies.
Would anyone care to expand on the pros and cons of using cheeks that are substantially wider than the metal jaws?

 

[bugbear]

Thanks for all the replies.
Would anyone care to expand on the pros and cons of using cheeks that are substantially wider than the metal jaws?

Pro: You can hold bigger things, with more support.
Con: racking

BugBear

 

[MusicMan]

Wow! And the inlay? Show-off. Mine look like a beaver's off-cuts.

And they will work just as well!

Guilty as charged1 I just had this offcut of rosewood to use up, as one does... so thought it might as well look nice.

 

[DoctorWibble]

The general rule of thumb on vice jaw linings used to be max 4" each side. I don't see any great benefit in exceeding or even approaching that. It doesn't increase the holding power of your vice but simply spreads what is available over a slightly wider area. The outer edges of the lining will bend anyway and tend to get in your way without adding to what you can do. To counter this bending some are tempted to use thicker linings which will of course reduce the capacity of the vice not increase it. And regardless of how thick or strong the vice lining is made the vice pressure will still be unevenly (and so unpredictably) spread across the thing your holding.
Plus extended linings reduce the power of the vice at the edges. For some operations (like sawing if you do this in the vice) that can lead to slippage which you then may counter by overtightening in the middle.
Lastly extended linings encourage you to clamp things at a distance from the vice centre which is bad for the long term health of your vice.
In short the benefits of extended linings are largely imaginary. Make them an inch or two larger than the vice but no more. If bigger things need to be held just supplement the vice with a clamp or two or clamp the thing directly to the bench. There are always better ways than huge linings to the vice jaws.

 

[DoctorWibble]

On a more constructive note I think deeper full face vice linings ARE a good idea. A little more work to make and they don't lend themselves to swapping in and out Robert Wearing style but they make full and even use of the holding power of the vice and help you get a really good grip of vertical boards and panels. Full face jaw linings are best made from ply because hardwood boards that wide might tend to cup.