Which plane for flatting a table top

[Midnight]

1) create a flat frame outside the piece to be flattened. Could be a couple of 2x 's. The essential thing is that they should both be in the same plane both longitudinally and widthways.
2) Build a bridge to hold a router that will slide non the two side pieces
3) procure a 1 inch/35 mil bottom cutting bit for router.
4) use bit to cut across the top slightly overlapping the several cuts.
5) Finish with #7 or #5 set very finely as there should be little to remove...possibly use a scraper plane instead.

beech... no dis-respect intended but..... och away wi ye man... by the time ye've scuttered aboot buildin yon contraption I could ha'e the job done and the kettle on plannin the next one..... sheesh.....

McLuma...

if your budget is limited to just the 1 plane... get a jack... and make it a good one... it has its work cut out for it... either a 5 or a 5 1/2...

first point... if you rip the top and run it through the thicknesser...it'll come out every bit as warped as it went in.......only it'll be thinner....

you need to be able to read the panel... find out where the high spots are and mark them, 'cos its them that need to be planed down... To see what's going on you'll need a good long straight edge and a pair of winding sticks... use the winding sticks to see where the warp is and to judge just how bad it is...

If the degree of warp is worse than the minimum tolerable thickness of your material... stop there... it'll never come out right...

assuming the warp and twist is recoverable... start by getting your blade as sharp as possible, set the frog fairly fine, adjust the blade to take a reasonable shaving, clamp the board down (use wedges under any high spots to stop it rocking if you need to) and start to work down the high spots. Take shavings across the grain, preferably working in overlapping diagonals until you've roughed out the worst of the high spots... turning the board around to plane from the opposite side should produce a herring-bone effect when planing across the diagonals.

stop periodically (for a breather if nothing else), check your progress with the straight edge and winding sticks to gauge how far you've yet to go...

once you get to the point where you're reasonably happy that the top's free of cup, twist and bow, re-tune the plane; this time you want to adjust the frog for a real fine shaving. If you haven't done so already, clip the corners off the blade by drawing it back over the stone gradually rocking the blade outwards quite aggressively; this will rid the blade of its tendency to leave harsh lines at the edges of each shaving.. set the blade to take as fine a shaving as you can (any finer and it'll be producing dust) and gradually work the board by planing along the grain and working with the grain (the plane will tell you in no uncertain terms when its working against the grain)...

Again, check your progress periodically with the straight edge and winding sticks; pay attention to areas that case the straight edge or sticks to rock, see where the high spot is and smooth it till its flush...

Planing isn't rocket science; its a slow, patient, methodical process that will generate the desired result provided you take care of the high spots...
remember that five minutes spent checking is far better than an hour spent removing a low spot that wasn't already there when you started...

Last point... once the top's nice and true, you need to figure out why the **** it warped in the first place... from what I've read, this wood should be stable when its been dried to a moisture content of around 9%; your reclaimed stock should be pretty close to that figure by now so I'd guess that the cause was either incorrect finishing (the top has only been finished on one side for example) or working the wood before it had had sufficient time to acclimatize to the conditions in your surroundings...

 

[Anonymous]

No need to scare him off with talk of not being able to do everything efficiently with one plane. Time enough to find that out when he's safely sliding... :twisted: :lol:

Cheers, Alf

I thought you only used one plane these days Alf - but with varying angles on the blade

 

[Alf]

Maybe one bench plane (mainly), but there's blocks, rebates, shoulders, plough, combination, moulding...

Rats. Now look what you've made me do. I'm sure I just heard running feet heading away from the top of The Slope... #-o

Cheers, Alf

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

A jack is good for removing high spots quickly. A longer plane with a very slightly cambered blade (called a try plane) is good for getting the panel flat. The final flattening and smoothing can then be done with a panel or smoothing plane.

I was planing 3 foot long Red Gum boards today. These were cut from 4x4 rough sawn posts, excess timber salvaged from a building site. This red gum is a pale pink timber.

Well, a sharp Smoothcut blade in my well-tuned Stanley #7 did not cut smoothly, and in fact did not do more than tearout every few inches. I switched to a high angle HNT Gordon Try Plane, with a fine mouth, and this left a beautiful finish, but did the job ever so slowly. So I tried a LV LA Jack with a 50 degree cutting angle. Not as good as the Gordon (I needed a higher angle blade) but reasonable and much faster. Finally finished with a LV LA Smoother with 62 degree cutting angle - just magnificent. The result was clean, tearout-free boards.

Working on these boards made me realise just how useful the forthcoming LV LA Jointer is going to be.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[MikeW]

...Finally finished with a LV LA Smoother with 62 degree cutting angle - just magnificent. The result was clean, tearout-free boards.

Working on these boards made me realise just how useful the forthcoming LV LA Jointer is going to be.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I completely agree. I was doing some paduak, what with its interlocked grain. Ended up using the LV LA smoother at the end, though I did use my Knight 60 degree heavy coffin once the lighter LV dulled. Both did a tremendous job.

In fact, I have two blades for the LV LA smoother--one to make a 50 deg cutting angle, the other a 60 + angle (don't know what the final secondary by hand did to it ). Now I need to order another blade for it to have something for the occasional softwood...

The LV LA jointer is one I'll add as soon as it is available. But really, just one more plane...Well, ok. I'll also get the heavy LA LV smoother. But really, then that's it...

Anyone wish to buy some other planes to support my new want list? Gotta make room :twisted:

 

[Philly]

Mike
I have recently overcome a long and expensive case of "Handplane Wallet" and was given a clean bill of heath by the Doc. So no, I won't take you up on your offer, thanks.
Mind you, I wouldn't mind the new Super Smoother too! And would like a look at the Scrub-I don't need one, just interested, you know....
Nurse! My medication!!! :lol: :roll:
Philly

 

[Alf]

I have recently overcome a long and expensive case of "Handplane Wallet" and was given a clean bill of heath by the Doc.<snip>
Mind you, I wouldn't mind the new Super Smoother too! And would like a look at the Scrub-I don't need one, just interested, you know....

So not so much recovery as a short remission... :roll: :lol:

Cheers, Alf

 

[Philly]

:lol:
Philly :wink:

 

[MikeW]

Mike
...So no, I won't take you up on your offer, thanks.

That's ok...you don't really think I was serious, did you :!:
Oh no. I need 'em all :lol:

Edit: Actually, this little glib bit help me to decide that I really am going to be offing a few. I've decided that though I will end up getting the couple LV LA planes, half of what I do have are going away. There's a list on another forum, in a far far away land...

Mind you, I wouldn't mind the new Super Smoother too!

"Go ahead" (the little voice says). "You do really need one. By the time it's released, you'll have forgotten to take your meds anyway..."

And would like a look at the Scrub-I don't need one, just interested, you know.... ...Philly

"Yes, I know" (the little voice continues). "I know. We all know that we only want to see it, to feel it in the hand, to use it just a little, to, you know, be able to say we don't really need one..."

 

[MikeW]

I have recently overcome a long and expensive case of "Handplane Wallet" and was given a clean bill of heath by the Doc.<snip>
Mind you, I wouldn't mind the new Super Smoother too! And would like a look at the Scrub-I don't need one, just interested, you know....

So not so much recovery as a short remission... :roll: :lol:

Cheers, Alf

To quote (well, to apply it to this issue anyway) the last line of one of my favorite poems:

...and what's one more tool, more or less.

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Mike wrote:

"Go ahead" (the little voice says). "You do really need one. By the time it's released, you'll have forgotten to take your meds anyway..."

LV should bring in a Try-Now-Return-Later offer. You know, "use this plane for one week and, if unsatisfied, we will send you in return a paid-up course of psychotherapy". They know how addictive these are, and the unlikelihood of anyone later wanting to give one up.

So there you are, Philly, just borrow one for a while. You can return it later. :lol:

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Midnight]

And would like a look at the Scrub-I don't need one, just interested, you know....

interested huh..???

Ahem...

slope's got him good n proper...

 

[beech1948]

1)

beech... no dis-respect intended but..... och away wi ye man... by the time ye've scuttered aboot buildin yon contraption I could ha'e the job done and the kettle on plannin the next one..... sheesh.....quote]

Midnight,

No offence taken. However, since reading your message this morning and now I have had to stare at my own recently glued up bench top and wonder what to use to flatten it.

Top is steamed beech, 68mm thick and 84 inches long by 28 inches. A lot of handplaning.

So I built a frame out of 2x3 pine time 85 minutes including aligning to the top in width and length planes.

I build a bridge for the router time 21 minutes..felders are magic

I used my router to clean off the top and bottom time top 27 minutes, bottom 18 minutes and I was slow because I had not done this before.

Used LN Large Scraper plane to do a fine clean up of the top....48 minutes as I got some tearout which had to be cleaned up using a plane with York pitch blade and very fine shavings.

Does'nt seem slow to me Midnight..in fact in terms of effort it was way less than doing it all by planning....compared to some of the times I have heard for planing a top flat and sqaure

 

[Alf]

Used LN Large Scraper plane to do a fine clean up of the top....48 minutes as I got some tearout which had to be cleaned up using a plane with York pitch blade and very fine shavings.

On a benchtop?! Yikes. :shock:

 

[Midnight]

Does'nt seem slow to me Midnight..in fact in terms of effort it was way less than doing it all by planning....compared to some of the times I have heard for planing a top flat and sqaure

when you put it like that... no it doesn't, I agree, but then you don't say how much material needed to be removed to get the bench "true"...

btw how did it turn out..????

 

[beech1948]

Midnight,

Ahhh! I guess I forgot to say that the top was pretty flat. Maximum amounts removed were maybe 1mm a RHS, centre was pretty flat anyway and almost nothing was removed. LHS was bowed up by 2mm for about the final 250mm. One LHS corner was a bowed/twisated upwards by maybe 5 mm for 250 mm square area.

The bottom was pretty flat but a couple of the central strips of the glue up were projecting below the top by maybe 3mm.

Not a lot of adjustment really.

I must admit to a perverse streak that seeing your email I felt it was worth having a go just to see what was possible...I can at leat say that I have used this approach now.

Alf,
The tearout was really due to a small part of the beech top which had a very swirly or convoluted grain..almost like a large branch begining or a crotch piece. The area was quite small but a pipper to fix. In truth it is now maybe 1 mm below the rest of the top for a piece about 200x75mm.

regards
alan
PS I like my benches to be as good as furnitiure..I know I'm an ancient perfectionist but I like it that way so there.. :twisted:

 

[Midnight]

Ahhh! I guess I forgot to say that the top was pretty flat.

reading the amount of work it needed... I'll stand by my initial remark...

milk n sugar..?? :wink:

I'm guessing that my #6 woulda had the top flat in around the same time it took you to make the jig and complete the stock removal with the router... the difference being that my #6 doesn't tear out... already has the high angle frog fitted..

still... gotta admire a guy with a thran streak... nice technique to have in the armoury...

PS I like my benches to be as good as furnitiure..I know I'm an ancient perfectionist but I like it that way so there..

there's another way to be...???? :wink:

 

[Mcluma]

Ok I think, I know now which one to go for and

the order is in for

a 4 1/2 smoothing plane

and a number 5 jack plane

Well I am looking out for a good deal that is

Thanks for all the advise =D>

McLuma

 

[Anonymous]

Good choice McLuma

 

[Mcluma]

Well I couldn't resist of trowing in a scraper,

And it will all be here tomorrow \/

To bad it will have to stay wrapped up till the weekend

McLuma