What is your hand sanding method?

[Joe1975]

I’m trying to decide on a minimalist approach to preparing hardwood projects for finishing with danish oil or OSMO. Do you think that sanding with 120 and 240 grit aluminium oxide paper for surface prep followed by a quick rub down with a 3M Scotch-Bright 7447 pad before and between coats of finish would suffice? I’m looking for the best finish possible.

My surfaces are hand planed to a pretty smooth finish first. Perhaps getting a set of cabinet scrapers would be worth considering? Should I get any other grit sizes, or perhaps in sheets instead of rolls.

Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated. What are your routines for fine woodworking projects?

 

[Jake]

240 is too high for an oil or wax-oil finish. Check the tin but it's usually 180 or less. It needs a degree of roughness for the finish to grip to.

 

[Joe1975]

Thank you Jake, I’ll look into that.

 

[Eshmiel]

I’m trying to decide on a minimalist approach to preparing hardwood projects for finishing with danish oil or OSMO. Do you think that sanding with 120 and 240 grit aluminium oxide paper for surface prep followed by a quick rub down with a 3M Scotch-Bright 7447 pad before and between coats of finish would suffice? I’m looking for the best finish possible.

My surfaces are hand planed to a pretty smooth finish first. Perhaps getting a set of cabinet scrapers would be worth considering? Should I get any other grit sizes, or perhaps in sheets instead of rolls.

Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated. What are your routines for fine woodworking projects?

The "best finish possible" can mean a number of things: looks really good (depth, shine, etc.); is tough (resists water marks and rubbings of things going across it, etc.); is easy to repair (without taking the whole finish off, for example). Which is most important to you? Its often a compromise, depending on what's being finished and its role as a piece of furniture.

Some open grain or otherwise "rough" timbers don't generally benefit from sanding above 180 grit (unless the grain is filled). Others of fine grain will benefit from higher grit final sanding. For example, cherry can be sanded to around 400 grit and this will make it smoother than 240 grit, which will show as a greater depth & shine under a clear finish whilst also reducing the tendency of cherry to blotch (absorb more finish in areas where the grain is rising and so go darker than the rest).

Sanding as a means to provide "grip" to a finish ..... ? Hmmmmm. I've finished many pieces that have just been planed/scraped and not sanded. This does mean that the surface is very smooth. The "grip" of the finish doesn't seem affected ......

 

[Sideways]

A mirka hand sanding block with a dust extraction hose attached, or perhaps better one of those blocks that take a 6" orbital sander disc turned up at the edges to make a rectangle-ish. The advantage of the 2nd is that you keep only one size and shape of abrasive just in different grits.
Mesh abrasive either way.

A scraped finish IS nice.

 

[Jake]

Sanding as a means to provide "grip" to a finish ..... ? Hmmmmm. I've finished many pieces that have just been planed/scraped and not sanded. This does mean that the surface is very smooth. The "grip" of the finish doesn't seem affected ......

That's what manufacturers seem to recommend, and I recall the same being said in the various finishing books I've read (albeit some time ago) - that's for penetrating finishes like oil and wax-oil in particular, not for surface finishes (although the 2 pack floor varnishes I usually use for a varnish finish have similar recommendations).

But in practice you may well get away with it, seems like you have.

 

[Eshmiel]

A mirka hand sanding block with a dust extraction hose attached, or perhaps better one of those blocks that take a 6" orbital sander disc turned up at the edges to make a rectangle-ish. The advantage of the 2nd is that you keep only one size and shape of abrasive just in different grits.
Mesh abrasive either way.

Those Mirka blocks are good. I also use their two-sided blocks, with a squishy and a firm side. I have 4 with various grades of their rectangular papers on them all, from 60 to 600 grit. The 120, 180 and 240 get the most use but the others are used too, even that 600, which can put a shine of metallic stuff like brass.

I do have two of the hose-attachable blocks but the hose can make their use somewhat ponderous.

 

[Eshmiel]

That's what manufacturers seem to recommend, and I recall the same being said in the various finishing books I've read (albeit some time ago) - that's for penetrating finishes like oil and wax-oil in particular, not for surface finishes (although the 2 pack floor varnishes I usually use for a varnish finish have similar recommendations).

But in practice you may well get away with it, seems like you have.

I'm reluctant to sound like an awkward git but the notion that oil and oil-wax finishes "penetrate" is something of an advertisement-created myth. In reality, they too sit on the surface, getting into open grain but no deeper than that. ..... Or so I read in the WW WW stuff, put there by them damned scientific investigation types.
It is the case that they can be sanded or scraped off very quickly, in my experience, without removing any significant wood if one's scraper has a good burr.

 

[Jake]

I'm reluctant to sound like an awkward git but the notion that oil and oil-wax finishes "penetrate" is something of an advertisement-created myth. In reality, they too sit on the surface, getting into open grain but no deeper than that. ..... Or so I read in the WW WW stuff, put there by them damned scientific investigation types. It is the case that they can be sanded or scraped off very quickly, in my experience, without removing any significant wood if one's scraper has a good burr.

I don't think you sound like a git at all, let alone an awkward one. Some might say I should know.

I don't think anyone suggests they penetrate very far at all, just that their mode of sticking isn't very sophisticated and needs to bind into the cells of the timber a bit, which is promoted by a bit of roughness. But that's just my understanding and might well be wrong.

 

[Blackswanwood]

The routine I use for the boxes I make is:

1. Do as much as I can to avoid scratches and dings during construction and assembly.
2. Using a hard sanding block work through 180 and 240 grit
3. Raise the grain with a damp cloth
4. Use the hard sanding block again with 320 grit
5. Remove all dust with a tack cloth or soft brush
6. Apply the hard wax oil finish
7. Sand lightly with 600 grit between coats of finish

It’s also possible to apply the finish with a fine abrasive - you need to be careful doing this if using contrasting dark and light wood as the light wood can end up looking dirty. If I am applying an oil finish such as Peacock Oil I sand to 600 grit at step 2.

I have found that different oil/hard wax oil finishes are absorbed to varying degrees. Peacock oil for instance can easily penetrate a couple of mm when using ABW. I expect that there is a correlation between drying/curing time and the level of absorption.

I use Mirka sanding sheets. Bear in mind if using the Mirka sanding block with the Velcro fastening that it creates a soft sanding surface which can result in rounded edges which may not be noticeable on most things but may be on a smaller item such as a box. I make my own sanding blocks from MDF when box making.

As others have said it’s wise to check the instructions of the product being used.

 

[Joe1975]

Very interesting to hear from others, thank you all, I’ve just ordered rolls of 120, 180, 240, and 400. I think, if not totally essential, I can justify stocking this range.
I’ve got a few Mirka sanding mesh discs that I use with my Makita random orbital sander for larger surfaces. The sanding block with extraction must work well but I think I’d rather wear a mask than have the vacuum extraction going constantly when I’m hand sanding. I’ve got an air filter in the workshop so I tend to remove the mask after 15-20mins.

 

[Dr Al]

Wherever possible, I use a Stanley #4. You have to plan ahead a bit (thinking about grain direction before gluing pieces into a panel, finish planing internal surfaces before assembly, etc), but you can get a beautiful finish straight off the plane. Some awkward woods (Padauk for example) need something else (e.g. card scraper, cabinet scraper, scraper plane, high angle plane, etc) instead, but with a lot of woods the #4 is plenty.

I have to resort to sandpaper when I do woodturning (which probably says more about my lack of woodturning skills than anything else), but I can't remember the last time I used it on boxes or furniture. Hand planing is so much more enjoyable (and much, much quicker).

 

[CaptainBudget]

Completely agree with Dr AI. I hate sandpaper.

I find that in most cases a well setup #4 produces a smoother finish with crisper grain patterns than any sandpaper; I'll only use the latter if I've been beaten by a particularly horrible bit of grain that I can't scrape out (the yew I worked at the end of last year had grain directions literally everywhere and became impossible to scrape, so that I did sand in the end).

The sound of sandpaper also grinds my teeth, really don't like it...

 

[AJBaker]

If you're already hand planing, and you're using an oil finish, you can probably get away with very little sanding. I'd just use a simple cork block, or even just the palm of my hand on rough spots... I'd probably stick around 120-240.