HOJ
Established Member
Conversely, I can't agree with any of what you have said you seem to be speaking from a hierarchical level.
What do you charge - bathroom locks/doors
- Thread starter Mjward
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I've never had a problem with customers watching me work, after all, they are the ones paying, I'm confident in my skills and have often thought that those who don't like being watched are not, often for good reason. In fact I want people to be happy with what I do before they pay. (Of course , there are always the know alls who are never happy but luckily I've only had a few of them) ' 45+ years as Carpenter, joiner and general builder (should have retired last year, this is the last...).
Hi,
Ive always believed that as very few are naturally talented to do an excellent job without too much effort then you should aim for the top level in everything you do. If you only aim for average then you can only get an average result or a poor result. It’s impossible to get an excellent or a good job if you only aim to do average.
Regards,
Dave
That’s my take on any job I undertake- to aim for excellence whilst accepting that if you don’t quite make it you will be very close.learning from your mistakes is part of your learning journey as is accepting that your human and will make mistakes occasionally and as I’ve said on previous threads a very good skill that comes naturally to some is to learn how to incorporate these mistakes ( not bodging) into your work so they are difficult to detect and don’t look obvious. Re customers watching I agree as it’s never bothered me but there are some perfectly good and genuine tradespeople that have a nervous disposition and can’t cope with the added pressure of onlookers. Those same nervous types I met and worked with in my 30+ years as gas engineer were the most likely to struggle when taking their accs assessments every 5 years . The times I’d be outside having a smoke and you would see one engineer almost ready to quit and walk away . I’d simply say think of him as a customer giving you a bit of grief-you want to hit them but you can’t , he’s going to ask you a load of questions and he wants the answer. On a customer point there are those that will watch your every single move , there are some who will check in with you from time to time offer you a drink etc and there are those that just leave you to it and will only want to know when you have finished. My preference are those that keep you supplied with coffee and don’t want to stop you working but won’t see you go without a drink .
Had to laugh, visiting my parents house and spotted this excellent job from a "joiner" some years back. Note the flooring covering has always been carpet ie floor height has barely changed over the years ....
That’s clearly designed for additional ventilation lol 
and the position of door handle to suit toddlers. I will admit to having a couple of doors in my flat with ( additional ventilation) because some idiot who I won’t name (shh it was me ) trimmed the top of the doors and not the bottom, then had to trim the bottom to at least get the top looking decent 
and the position of door handle to suit toddlers. I will admit to having a couple of doors in my flat with ( additional ventilation) because some idiot who I won’t name (shh it was me ) trimmed the top of the doors and not the bottom, then had to trim the bottom to at least get the top looking decent 
monster
Established Member
The near retired chap I use for gas safety checks told me a story of how he once took on an apprentice quite a few years ago. Now this guy is very diligent and thoughtful and takes his work very seriously and does an excellent job, anyway It became clear after a few months that the young lad he had took on didn't have the aptitude or level of care, interest and dedication to continue so my chap let him go.
Its regular practice for the Gas Safety Registration Body to periodically send out an inspector to check on the work of the registered tradesman.
So fast forward a few years and my chap gets notification that an inspector is coming out to check up on his work, so he arranges a visit at a customers with them, and guess who turns up to check on the quality of his work, none other than the young disinterested lackadaisical apprentice that he had let go a few years ago! lol
Its regular practice for the Gas Safety Registration Body to periodically send out an inspector to check on the work of the registered tradesman.
So fast forward a few years and my chap gets notification that an inspector is coming out to check up on his work, so he arranges a visit at a customers with them, and guess who turns up to check on the quality of his work, none other than the young disinterested lackadaisical apprentice that he had let go a few years ago! lol
johnnyb
Established Member
jobs are done by highly skilled tradesmen to fit the budget/ expectation of the client. arriving at that value is a soft skill and really has nothing to do with trade skills.
servicing a gas boiler is not unlike servicing a car. it's difficult to do badly as long as its done and doesn't leak. designing/making stuff can be fraught with issues for the unwary. even cutting a piece of wood on site square and to a specific fit can be a job. I laugh when people say can you fit my new doors but oh I'm fitting the kitchen myself! like it's the simplest job you can imagine. this happens all the time to the point I now say if you want me to finish that its double rate. they then sneer and I always end up finishing it. it's a £15000 kitchen versus a £50 door. no brainer really. cabinet making and fitting is still a difficult job(despite huge deskilling)
servicing a gas boiler is not unlike servicing a car. it's difficult to do badly as long as its done and doesn't leak. designing/making stuff can be fraught with issues for the unwary. even cutting a piece of wood on site square and to a specific fit can be a job. I laugh when people say can you fit my new doors but oh I'm fitting the kitchen myself! like it's the simplest job you can imagine. this happens all the time to the point I now say if you want me to finish that its double rate. they then sneer and I always end up finishing it. it's a £15000 kitchen versus a £50 door. no brainer really. cabinet making and fitting is still a difficult job(despite huge deskilling)
thetyreman
Established Member
fitting doors is a serious skill imo, not sure why anyone would think it's an easy job but many people do.
I agree that there is nothing easy about fitting doors, especially in older buildings, old frames , out of square, twisted etc . The way the old chippys would put a Brad nail or 2 behind the hinges just waiting for your nice sharp chisel. Yesterday I agreed to trim the bottom off my neighbour’s door as he has just moved in and had carpets fitted. Off came the door and I promptly trimmed the bottom and attempted to refit it . The screws just wouldn’t start and when they did they went in at a weird angle . A closer look and I found the so called chippy had used those metal plasterboard fixings as the frame was damaged when the flat was renovated a month ago -they had of course split the wood -job abandoned and today off with the architrave and cut out the damaged section and cut and glued in a new piece , a few screws to re- inforce . I will refit the door tomorrow. So nothing easy there as it was supposed to be a 20-30 minute job 
johnnyb
Established Member
when you've done many many doors you start to aim for perfect. so I always try to fit the frame so perfectly I don't have to plane the door. obviously not possible on a refit. but I insist on the door clapping against the rebate well and no binding. the lock can be tricky as it's fractional mm stuff to get it to operate perfectly.
Isn't that the truth - my other half calls it the "mm police". I fuss about things that to most people are apparently invisible.
Which leads me on to the idea that trades should be "certified" as discussed a few posts back. I disagree - all it would do is drive out all the old hands that really don't want to go back to college to obtain that NVQ which apparently makes trades "qualified".
And if anyone's interested, here's my latest project from a totally unqualified, not a piece of paper to my name, handyman....(but so far not professionally - maybe when I retire in 2 years from the day job.....) https://community.screwfix.com/threads/garden-room.256842/
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Reminds me of a plumbing job I did a couple of years back when we moved in. 80yr old neighbour was talking about getting his kitchen tap replaced, being new to the street I said let me do it for you gratis, in my head thinking it was gonna be a 20-30 minute job and about 60 quid on a tap.... 4 hours later...as whenever the kitchen was replaced over the years the units had blocked access to the individual valves for the tap...so gave neighbour option of cut out cabinet back or drain whole system... did the latter, but still, the way the cabinet had been lined up was to make pipe access far more difficult than it could be... at which point with torch on I realised he had a very ever so slightly leak to one of the copper elbows... so in this ridiculous tiny work space I had to cut out some of the shoddy pipework and soldered in new connectors etc. Thankfully he is a top bloke and we are now friends!I agree that there is nothing easy about fitting doors, especially in older buildings, old frames , out of square, twisted etc . The way the old chippys would put a Brad nail or 2 behind the hinges just waiting for your nice sharp chisel. Yesterday I agreed to trim the bottom off my neighbour’s door as he has just moved in and had carpets fitted. Off came the door and I promptly trimmed the bottom and attempted to refit it . The screws just wouldn’t start and when they did they went in at a weird angle . A closer look and I found the so called chippy had used those metal plasterboard fixings as the frame was damaged when the flat was renovated a month ago -they had of course split the wood -job abandoned and today off with the architrave and cut out the damaged section and cut and glued in a new piece , a few screws to re- inforce . I will refit the door tomorrow. So nothing easy there as it was supposed to be a 20-30 minute job
Wow - how to cement a new friendship , not gratis but I charged him £10 per door to remove and trim . I soon realised that was not enough but he’s just moved in , carpets and blinds have all but relieved him if any spare cash and he said himself “ you can’t do all this for £20 . “ however I said call it a moving in gift . Sometimes it’s just not about money . There are 6 flats where I live and we all know each other by name, we look out for each other so the community spirit is priceless.. but it’s amazing how the perceived 30 min job escalates into a more involved labour intensive job..
Exactly that, those 4 hours together cemented a friendship almost immediately and we look out for each other since that day, worth every penny in the end
It’s the story’s like this that make me glad I joined Inspirational to read and restores the faith with so much violence and aggression and everyone for themselves attitude we see and hear so many examples of.
